Room Conversation and Reading
from Srimad-Bhagavatam Canto 1 and 12

June 25, 1976, New Vrindaban
Devotee (1): These are publicity for the Ratha-yatra. This is the article about the building, how it's the most attractive real estate in Cleveland. It's in the paint and flowers and gardens.
Prabhupada: This year's?
Devotee (1): Yes. People would drive by the temple, Prabhupada, and just look. They would drive by and look once, drive a little further and look twice and three times.
Prabhupada: But San Francisco we haven't got our temple. We haven't got any temple?
Devotee (1): No. We used the photograph. We made a publicity notice, a news release, and they printed it directly. It was easier for them. The picture is of San Francisco, but the festival was in Cleveland.
Prabhupada: There is no date? Hmm?
Devotee (1): Maybe not in that one article. Other articles, there are dates.
Prabhupada: Is this Cleveland?
Devotee (1): Yes. There are many skyscrapers, tall buildings, there are many tall buildings, and people were looking out at the Ratha-yatra cart and at Lord Jagannatha.
Prabhupada: Here, the daytime is...
Dhrstadyumna: We have found, Srila Prabhupada, when the buses are going to many of these cities, they have never seen our devotees, because when we go, we are dressed like they are for distributing the books. So now the boys are going again in the streets with a kirtana party once a week downtown, and they have all done front-page newspaper articles, because although they have been reading the books, they have never seen the devotees in many years. I think festivals like this...
Prabhupada: Yes.
Dhrstadyumna: ...in all these cities would be very advantageous, and all the book distribution...
Prabhupada: And therefore I said that introduce Ratha-yatra every city. At least wherever we have got our centers. Bring Pusta Krsna. They have received some testimonial from Indian...
Hari-sauri: Oh, yes, Indian reviews?
Prabhupada: You can open this file. I don't want, but...
Devotee (1): Prabhupada, how should we have these Ratha-yatra festivals. Should they be big? Should they be big festivals? Should I plan on having three carts next year, just one, or a small cart?
Prabhupada: As you can afford. Minimum one cart. Otherwise, three carts. In India the Ratha-yatra festival is going on, according to rough estimate, for the last two thousand years, and the crowd never diminishes. One secretary of Parliament or something like that.
Hari-sauri: Sri R. Subramanyam, M.A., Deputy Director Research, Lok Sabha Secretariat, National Parliament, New Delhi. Should I read it? "A strange feature of the modern world is that in spite of vast advances in science and technology and the establishment of a good number of institutions for human welfare, mankind has not found true peace and happiness. Knowledge of material sciences and arts has increased tremendously in recent times, and millions of volumes on each fill the libraries the world over. People and leaders in every country are generally well versed in these arts and sciences, but despite their efforts, human society everywhere continues to be in turmoil and distress. The reason is not far to see. It is that they have not learned the science of God, the most fundamental of every other art and science, and fail to apply it to the facts of life. The need of the hour is, therefore, to do it if mankind is not only to survive but flower into a glorious existence. To teach this science of God to people everywhere and to aid them in their progress and development towards the real goal of life, Srimad-Bhagavatam is most eminently fitted. In fact, this great ancient work of Vyasa will fill this need of the modern times, for it is a cultural presentation for the respiritualization of the entire human society. His Divine Grace, Srila A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada, the founder-acarya of the ISKCON movement, has taken it upon himself, in addition to his ceaseless travels and other multifarious activities in the service of the Lord, the stupendous task of translating this Sanskrit work into English in about sixty volumes for the welfare and happiness of mankind. It is really astonishing how he is able to do this single-handed, and when one comes to think of this, apart from his other great literary works, one is tempted to wonder if he is not the same Vyasa Muni reborn today to adapt his own old work into a universal language of this age for the spiritual upliftment of the modern man. So far eighteen volumes of this most beautiful literature on God have been brought out by ISKCON, and the rest are under preparation. Needless to say that in keeping with the excellence of their other publications, the publishers have seen to it that the printing, get-up, and pictures in these volumes are also of the highest quality, as though to serve as an ornament to the divine contents of the books. This is a rare opportunity to people and leaders of every country, race and community in the world to know and understand the glorious science of God and work for their perfection. I would say that this encyclopedia of spiritual knowledge is more important and fundamental than the encyclopedia of any other branch of knowledge and should, therefore, find a rightful place not only in the public and private libraries, big and small, of educational and other institutions, as also of every household, but above all in the hearts and minds of every man and woman." That seems to be it.
Prabhupada: Now read.
Pradyumna: First Canto, Chapter Five.
Prabhupada: You can keep it here.
Synonyms also? The synonyms also?
Prabhupada: No, just text.
Pradyumna: "Suta Gosvami said: Thus the sage among the gods, Narada,..."
Prabhupada: Where is your son?
Devotee (2): He is at Pennsylvania, the Gurukula for now.
Prabhupada: Your wife?
Devotee (2): She is here, she wanted to see you.
Prabhupada: Yes?
Devotee (2): She can come in? She can come in for a minute, she has the baby with her.
Prabhupada: All right, let her in.
Devotee (2): This is made with wheat from the farm.
Pradyumna: He's on Pennsylvania farm, with Paramananda.
Prabhupada: Paramananda is there?
Devotee (2): Yes.
Prabhupada: They are doing well?
Devotee (2): Oh, yes.
Prabhupada: That's all right. Hear, now.
Pradyumna: "Thus the sage among the gods, Narada, comfortably seated and apparently smiling, addressed the rsi amongst the brahmanas, Vedavyasa." Purport. "Narada was smiling because he well knew the great sage Vedavyasa and the cause of his disappointment. As he will explain gradually, Vyasadeva's disappointment was due to insufficiency in presenting the science of devotional service. Narada knew the defect, and it was confirmed by the position of Vyasa." Text number two.
"Translation. Addressing Vyasadeva, the son of Parasara, Narada inquired: Are you satisfied by identifying with the body or the mind as the objects of self-realization?" Purport. "This was a hint by Narada to Vyasadeva regarding the cause of his despondency. Vyasadeva, as the descendant of Parasara, a greatly powerful sage, had the privilege of having a great parentage, which should not have given Vyasadeva cause for despondency. Being a great son of a great father, he should not have identified the self with the body or the mind. Ordinary men with a poor fund of knowledge can identify the body as self or the mind as self, but Vyasadeva should not have done so. One cannot be cheerful by nature unless one is factually seated in self-realization, which is transcendental to the material body and mind."
"Your inquiries were full and your studies were also well fulfilled, and there is no doubt that you have prepared a great and wonderful work, the Mahabharata, which is full of all kinds of Vedic sequences elaborately explained." Purport. "The despondency of Vyasadeva was certainly not due to his lack of sufficient knowledge, because as a student he had fully inquired about the Vedic literatures, as a result of which the Mahabharata is compiled with full explanation of the Vedas."
"You have fully delineated the subject of impersonal Brahman, as well as the knowledge derived therefrom. In spite of all this, why should you be despondent, thinking that you are undone, my dear prabhu?" Purport: "The Vedanta-sutra or Brahma-sutra compiled by Sri Vyasadeva is the full deliberation of the impersonal absolute feature, and it is accepted as the most exalted philosophical exposition in the world. It covers the subject of eternity, and the methods are scholarly. So there cannot be any doubt about the transcendental scholarship of Vyasadeva. So why should he lament?"
"Sri Vyasadeva said: All you have said about me is perfectly correct. Despite all this, I am not pacified. I therefore question you about the root cause of my dissatisfaction, for you are a man of unlimited knowledge due to your being the offspring of one, Brahma, who is self-born, without mundane mother and father." Purport. "In the material world everyone is engrossed with the idea of identifying the body or the mind with the self. As such, all knowledge disseminated in the material world is related either with the body or with the mind, and that is the root cause of all despondencies. This is not always detected, even though one may be the greatest erudite scholar in materialistic knowledge. It is good, therefore, to approach a personality like Narada to solve the root cause of all despondencies. Why Narada should be approached is explained below."
sa vai bhavan veda samasta-guhyam
upasito yat purusah puranah
paravareso manasaiva visvam
srjaty avaty atti gunair asangah
"My lord! Everything that is mysterious is known to you because you worship the creator and destroyer of the material world and the maintainer of the spiritual world, the original Personality of Godhead, who is transcendental to the three modes of material nature." Purport. "A person who is cent percent engaged in the service of the Lord is the emblem of all knowledge. Such a devotee of the Lord in full perfection of devotional service is also perfect by the qualification of the Personality of Godhead. As such, the eightfold perfections of mystic power, asta-siddhi, constitute very little of his godly opulence. A devotee like Narada can act wonderfully by his spiritual perfection, which every individual is trying to attain. Srila Narada is a cent percent perfect living being, although not equal to the Personality of Godhead."
tvam paryatann arka iva tri-lokim
antas-caro vayur ivatma-saksi
paravare brahmani dharmato vrataih
snatasya me nyunam alam vicaksva
"Like the sun, Your Goodness can travel everywhere in the three worlds, and like the air you can penetrate the internal region of everyone. As such, you are as good as the all-pervasive Supersoul. Please, therefore, find out the deficiency in me, despite my being absorbed in transcendence under disciplinary regulations and vows." Purport. "Transcendental realization, pious activities, worshiping the Deities, charity, mercifulness, nonviolence and studying the scriptures under strict disciplinary regulations are always helpful." Text 8.
sri narada-uvaca
yaso bhagavato 'malam
yenaivasau na tusyeta
manye tad-darsanam khilam
[SB 1.5.8]
"Sri Narada said: You have not actually broadcast the sublime and spotless glories of the Personality of Godhead. That philosophy which does not satisfy the transcendental senses of the Lord is considered worthless." Purport. "The eternal relation of an individual soul with the Supreme Soul Personality of Godhead is constitutionally one of being the eternal servitor of the eternal master. The Lord has expanded Himself as living beings in order to accept loving service from them, and this alone can satisfy both the Lord and the living beings. A scholar like Vyasadeva has completed many expansions of the Vedic literatures, ending with the Vedanta philosophy, but none of them have been written directly glorifying the Personality of Godhead. Dry philosophical speculations even on the transcendental subject of the Absolute have very little attraction without directly dealing with the glorification of the Lord. The Personality of Godhead is the last word in transcendental realization. The absolute realized as impersonal Brahman or localized Supersoul, Paramatma, is less productive of transcendental bliss than the supreme personal realization of His glories. The compiler of the Vedanta-darsana is Vyasadeva himself. Yet he is troubled, although he is the author. So what sort of transcendental bliss can be derived by the readers and listeners of Vedanta which is not explained directly by Vyasadeva the author? Herein arises the necessity of explaining Vedanta-Sutra in the form of Srimad-Bhagavatam by the self-same author." He has not said it, so how can they know it?
yatha dharmadayas cartha
na tatha vasudevasya
mahima hy anuvarnitah
"Although, great sage, you have very broadly described the four principles beginning with religious performances, you have not described the glories of the Supreme Personality, Vasudeva." Purport. "The prompt diagnosis of Sri Narada is at once declared. The root cause of the despondency of Vyasadeva was his deliberate avoidance of glorifying the Lord in his various editions of the Puranas. He has certainly, as a matter of course, given descriptions of the glories of the Lord (Sri Krsna), but not as many as given to religiosity, economic development, sense gratification and salvation. These four items are by far inferior to engagement in the devotional service of the Lord. Sri Vyasadeva as the authorized scholar knew very well this difference. And still, instead of giving more importance to the better type of engagement, namely..."
Prabhupada: Why not go there? You can go there.
Hari-sauri: In the big room? Yes. It's... It's too crowded here.
Prabhupada: Let us go there. [break]
Devotee (1): ...trying to retire here in one year when he's through with his duties as a director of a mental hospital.
Prabhupada: Which community?
Devotee (1): He plans to come here to retire in one year.
Prabhupada: Oh. Yes, everyone should retire and join us.
Devotees: Jaya.
Prabhupada: At least those who are above fifty years old. That is Vedic civilization. Pancasordhvam vanam vrajet. One who is over fifty years of age, vanam vrajet. So vanam vrajet means completely retired from family responsibilities and take to Krsna consciousness. That is compulsory according to Vedic civilization.
Pradyumna: "These four items are by far inferior to engagement in the devotional service of the Lord. Sri Vyasadeva as the authorized scholar knew very well this difference, and still, instead of giving more importance to the better type of engagement, namely the devotional service of the Lord, he had more or less improperly used his valuable time, and thus he was despondent. From this it is clearly indicated that no one can be pleased substantially without being engaged in the devotional service of the Lord. In the Bhagavad-gita this fact is clearly mentioned. After liberation, which is the last item in the line of performing religiosity, etc., one is engaged in pure devotional service. This is called the stage of self-realization or brahma-bhuta [SB 4.30.20] stage. After attainment of this brahma-bhuta stage one is satisfied, but satisfaction is the beginning of transcendental bliss. One should progress by attaining neutrality and equality in the relative world. In passing this stage of equanimity, one is fixed up in the transcendental loving service of the Lord. This is the instruction of the Personality of Godhead in the Bhagavad-gita. The conclusion is that in order to maintain the status quo of the brahma-bhuta stage, as also to increase the degree of transcendental realization, it is recommended by Narada to Vyasadeva that he, Vyasadeva, should now eagerly and repeatedly describe the path of devotional service. This would cure him from gross despondency."
"Those words which do not describe the glories of the Lord, who alone can sanctify the atmosphere of the whole universe, are considered by saintly persons to be like unto a place of pilgrimage for crows."
Prabhupada: Just like the modern newspaper. Huge bundle of newspaper every morning, huh? So it is, as it is said here, the place of enjoyment for the crows. What is that?
Prabhupada: Vayasam means crows. The crows, they take pleasure in a place where all rubbish and refuses are thrown. They take pleasure. So what is this newspaper? All rubbish things, they are collected together. Nobody likes it to read. They just glance over for a few minutes, and then it is thrown away, rubbish. And even it is thrown, nobody touches. So they are spending huge, so many newspapers. Each newspaper several editions in a day, huge establishment, but there is no substance of life. That is being described. Na yad vacas citra-padam harer yaso. Read it?
"Those words which do not describe the glories of the Lord, who alone can sanctify the atmosphere of the whole universe, are considered by saintly persons to be like unto a place of pilgrimage for crows. Since the all-perfect persons are inhabitants of the transcendental abode, they do not derive any pleasure there." Purport. "Crows and swans are not birds of the same feather because of their different mental attitudes. The fruitive workers or passionate men are compared to the crows, whereas the all-perfect saintly persons are compared to the swans. Crows take pleasure in a place where garbage is thrown out, just as the passionate fruitive workers take pleasure in wine and women and places for gross sense pleasure. The swans do not take pleasure in the places where crows are assembled for conferences and meetings. They are instead seen in the atmosphere of natural scenic beauty, where there are transparent reservoirs of water nicely decorated with stems of lotus flowers in variegated colors of natural beauty. That is the difference between the two classes of birds. Nature has influenced different species of life with different mentalities, and it is not possible to bring them up into the same rank and file. Similarly there are different kinds of literature for different types of men of different mentality. Mostly the market literatures which attract men of the crow's categories are literatures containing refuse remnants of sensuous topics. They are generally known as mundane talks in relation with the gross body and subtle mind. They are full of subject matter described in decorative language full of mundane similies and metaphorical arrangements. Yet with all that, they do not glorify the Lord. Such poetry and prose on any subject matter is considered decoration of a dead body. Spiritually advanced men, who are compared with the swans, do not take pleasure in such dead literatures, which are sources of pleasure for men who are spiritually dead. These literatures in the modes of passion and ignorance are distributed under different labels, but they can hardly help the spiritual urge of the human being, and thus the swanlike spiritually advanced men have nothing to do with them. Such spiritually advanced men are called also manasa, because they always keep up the standard of transcendental voluntary service to the Lord on the spiritual plane. This completely forbids fruitive activities for gross bodily sense satisfaction or subtle speculation of the material egoistic mind. Social literary men, scientists, mundane poets, theoretical philosophers and politicians who are completely absorbed in the material advancement of sense pleasure are all dolls of the material energy. They take pleasure in a place where rejected subject matters are thrown. According to Sridhara Swami this is the pleasure of the prostitute hunters. But literatures which describe the glories of the Lord are enjoyed by the paramahamsas who have grasped the essence of human activities." When you said that transcendentally spiritually advanced men are called manasa, that means "with the mind," because they are always thinking of?
Prabhupada: Yes, always. Sa vai manah krsna padaravindayoh [SB 9.4.18]. They are thinking of Krsna.
tad-vag-visargo janatagha-viplavo
yasmin prati-slokam abaddhavaty api
namany anantasya yaso 'nkitani yat
srnvanti gayanti grnanti sadhavah
[SB 1.5.11]
"On the other hand, that literature which is full of descriptions of the pastimes of the transcendental glories of the name, fame, forms, pastimes, etc. of the unlimited Supreme Lord is a different creation, full of transcendental words directed toward bringing about a revolution in the impious lives of this world's misdirected civilization. Such transcendental literatures, even though imperfectly composed, are heard, sung and accepted by purified men who are thoroughly honest." Purport. "It is a qualification of the great thinkers to pick up the best even from the worst. It is said that the intelligent man should pick up nectar from a stock of poison, should accept gold even from a filthy place, should accept a good and qualified wife even from an obscure family, and should accept a good lesson even from a man or from a teacher who comes from the untouchables. These are some of the ethical instructions for everyone in every place without exception. But a saint is far above the level of an ordinary man, and he is always absorbed in glorifying the Supreme Lord, because by broadcasting the holy name and fame of the Supreme Lord the polluted atmosphere of the world will change, and as a result of propagating the transcendental literatures like Srimad-Bhagavatam, people will become sane in their transactions. While preparing this commentation on this particular stanza of Srimad-Bhagavatam we have a crisis before us. Our neighboring friend China has attacked the border of India with a militaristic spirit. We have practically no business in the political field, yet we see that previously there were both China and India, and they both lived peacefully for centuries without ill feeling. The reason is that they lived those days in an atmosphere of God consciousness, and every country over the surface of the world was God fearing, pure hearted and simple, and there was no question of political diplomacy. There was no cause of quarrel between the two countries of China and India over land which is not very suitable for habitation, and certainly there was no cause for fighting on this issue. But due to the age of quarrel, Kali, which we have discussed, there is always a chance of quarrel on slight provocation. This is due not to the issue in question but to the polluted atmosphere of this age. Systematically there is propaganda by a section of people to stop glorification of the name and fame of the Supreme Lord. Therefore there is great need for disseminating the message of Srimad-Bhagavatam all over the world. It is the duty of every responsible Indian to broadcast the transcendental message of Srimad-Bhagavatam throughout the world to do all the supermost good, as well as to bring about the desired peace in the world. Because India has failed in her duty by neglecting this responsible work, there is so much quarrel and trouble all over the world. We are confident that if the transcendental message of Srimad-Bhagavatam is received only by the leading men of the world, certainly there will be a change of heart, and naturally the people in general will follow them. The mass of people in general are tools in the hands of modern politicians and leaders of the people. If there is a change of heart of the leaders only, certainly there will be a radical change in the atmosphere of the world. We know that our honest attempt to present this great literature conveying transcendental messages for reviving the God consciousness of the people in general and respiritualizing the world atmosphere is fraught with many difficulties. Our presenting this matter in adequate language, especially a foreign language, will certainly fail, and there will be so many literary discrepancies despite our honest attempt to present it in the proper way, but we are sure that with all our faults in this connection, the seriousness of the subject matter will be taken into consideration, and the leaders of society will still accept this, due to its being an honest attempt to glorify the almighty God. When there is fire in a house, the inmates of the house go out to get help from the neighbors, who may be foreigners, and yet without knowing the language, the victims of the fire express themselves and the neighbors understand the need, even though not expressed in the same language. The same spirit of cooperation is needed to broadcast this transcendental message of the Srimad-Bhagavatam throughout the polluted atmosphere of the world. After all, it is a technical science of spiritual values, and thus we are concerned with the techniques and not with the language. If the techniques of this great literature are understood by the people of the world, there will be success. When there are too many materialistic activities by the people in general all over the world, there is no wonder that a person or nation attacks another person or nation on slight provocation. That is the rule of this age of Kali, or quarrel. The atmosphere is already polluted with corruption of all description, and everyone knows it well. There are so many unwanted literatures full of materialistic ideas of sense gratification. The people in general want to read. That is a natural instinct. But because their minds are polluted, they want such literatures. Under the circumstances, transcendental literature like Srimad-Bhagavatam will not only diminish the activities of the corrupt minds of the people in general, but also it will supply food for their hankering after reading some interesting literature. In the beginning they may not like it, because one suffering from jaundice is reluctant to take sugar candy, but we should know that sugar candy is the only remedy for the jaundice. Similarly, let there be systematic propaganda for popularizing reading of the Bhagavad-gita and the Srimad-Bhagavatam, which will act like sugar candy for the jaundicelike condition of sense gratification. When men have a taste for this literature, the other literatures, which are catering poison to society, will then automatically cease. We are sure therefore that everyone in the human society will welcome Srimad-Bhagavatam, even though it is now presented with so many faults, for it is recommended by Sri Narada, who has very kindly appeared in this chapter."
Prabhupada: So what other literatures say? There is not one. In our society we do not read even newspaper, is it not? Do we? Huh?
Pusta Krsna: Only in context to our preaching work.
Prabhupada: That is another thing, but generally. We do not derive any benefit from those. People read it, especially in the Western counties. If there is no newspaper it is hell. I told you this story? Yes. You can repeat that.
Dhrstadyumna: The preacher was preaching to the coal miners that if they were not good, they would go to hell, and in hell it was very cold. So they were thinking, "So it is very cold in the mine." Then he was saying that it is very dark in hell. "But it is very dark in the mine." Then he said "And there are no newspapers." "Oh, how horrible, what a horrible place that must be."
Prabhupada: When they heard in the hell there is no newspaper, then came to the idea, "Oh, it is horrible." Otherwise, cold, dark, "Oh, this is our custom. We are already accustomed to these habits, we are working in the mine. So don't make any distinction between hell and our present residential quarters. But if there is no newspaper, certainly that is hell."
"Knowledge of self-realization, even though freed from all material affinity, does not look well if devoid of a conception of the infallible God. What then is the use of fruitive activities, which are naturally painful from the very beginning and transient by nature if they are not utilized for the devotional service of the Lord?" Purport. "As referred to above, not only ordinary literatures devoid of the transcendental glorification of the Lord are condemned, but also Vedic literatures and speculation on the subject of impersonal Brahman when they are devoid of devotional service. When speculation on the impersonal Brahman is condemned on the above ground, then what to speak of ordinary fruitive work, which is not meant to fulfill the aim of devotional service. Such speculative knowledge and fruitive work cannot lead one to the goal of perfection. Fruitive work, in which almost all people in general are engaged, is always painful, either in the beginning or at the end. It can only be fruitful when made subservient to the devotional service of the Lord. In the Bhagavad-gita also it is confirmed that the result of such fruitive work may be offered for the service of the Lord, otherwise it leads to material bondage. The bona fide enjoyer of the fruitive work is the Personality of Godhead. And thus when it is engaged for the sense gratification of the living entities, it becomes an acute source of trouble."
"O Vyasadeva, your vision is completely perfect. Your good fame is spotless, you are firm in vow and situated in truthfulness, and thus you can think of the pastimes of the Lord in trance for the liberation of the people in general from all material bondage." Purport. "People in general have a taste for literature by instinct. They want to hear and read from the authorities something about the unknown, but their taste is exploited by unfortunate literatures, which are full of subject matter for satisfaction of the material senses. Such literatures contain different kinds of mundane poems and philosophical speculations more or less under the influence of maya, ending in sense gratification. These literatures, although worthless in the true sense of the term, are variously decorated to attract the attention of the less intelligent men. Thus the attracted living entities are more and more entangled in material bondage without hope of liberation for thousands and thousands of generations. Sri Narada Rsi, being the best among the Vaisnavas, is compassionate on such unfortunate victims of worthless literatures, and thus he advises Sri Vyasadeva to compose transcendental literature which is not only attractive but can also actually bring liberation from all kinds of bondage. Srila Vyasadeva or his representatives are qualified because they are rightly trained to see things in true perspective. Srila Vyasadeva and his representatives are pure in thought due to their spiritual enlightenment; fixed in their vows, due to their devotional service; and determined to deliver the fallen souls rotting in material activities. The fallen souls are very eager to receive novel informations every day, and the transcendentalists like Vyasadeva or Narada can supply such eager people in general with unlimited news from the spiritual world. In the Bhagavad-gita it is said that the material world is only a part of the whole creation, and that this earth is only a fragment of the whole material world. There are thousands and thousands of literary men all over the world, and they have created many, many thousands of literary works for the information of people in general for thousands and thousands of years. Unfortunately [break] ...effect of liberation from the pangs of material civilization, which is eating the vital parts of the human energy. The Bhagavad-gita, which is the spoken message of the Lord Himself recorded by Vyasadeva, and the Srimad-Bhagavatam, which is the transcendental narration of the activities of the same Lord Krsna, which alone can satisfy the hankering desires of the living being for eternal peace and liberation from miseries. Srimad-Bhagavatam is, therefore, meant for all the living beings all over the universe for total liberation from all kinds of material bondage. Such transcendental narrations of the pastimes of the Lord can only be described by liberated souls like Vyasadeva and his bona fide representatives, who are completely merged in the transcendental loving service of the Lord. Only to such devotees do the pastimes of the Lord and their transcendental nature become automatically manifest by dint of devotional service. No one else can either know or describe the acts of the Lord, even if they speculate on the subject for many, many years. The descriptions of the Bhagavatam are so precise and accurate that whatever has been predicted in this great literature about five thousand years before is now exactly happening. Therefore the vision of the author comprehends past, present and future. Such liberated persons like Vyasadeva are not only perfect by the power of vision and wisdom but also in aural reception, in thinking, feeling and all other sense activities. A liberated person possesses perfect senses, and with perfect senses only can one serve the sense proprietor, Hrsikesa, Sri Krsna, the Personality of Godhead. Srimad-Bhagavatam is therefore the perfect description of the all-perfect Personality of Godhead by the all-perfect personality, Sri Vyasadeva, the compiler of the Vedas."
tato 'nyatha kincana yad vivaksatah
prthag drsas tat-krta-rupa-namabhih
na karhicit kvapi ca duhsthita matir
labheta vatahata-naur ivaspadam
"Whatever you desire to describe which is separate in vision from the Lord simply reacts with different forms, names and results to agitate the mind, as the wind agitates a boat which has no resting place." Purport. "Sri Vyasadeva is the editor of all descriptions of the Vedic literatures, and thus he has described transcendental realization in different ways, namely by fruitive activities, speculative knowledge, mystic power and devotional service. Besides that, in his various Puranas he has recommended the worship of so many demigods in different forms and names. The result is that people in general are puzzled how to fix up their minds in the service of the Lord. They are always disturbed to find out the real path of self-realization. Srila Naradadeva is stressing this particular defect in the Vedic literatures compiled by Vyasadeva, and thus he is trying to emphasize describing everything in relation with the Supreme Lord and no one else. In fact there is nothing existent except the Lord. The Lord is manifested in different expansions. He is the root of the complete tree. He is the stomach of the complete body. As such, pouring water on the root is the right process to water the tree, as much as feeding the stomach supplies energy to all parts of the body. Srila Vyasadeva should not have compiled any Puranas other than the Bhagavata Purana, because a slight deviation from that may create havoc for self-realization. If a slight deviation can create such havoc, then what to speak of deliberate expansion of the separatist idea from the Absolute Truth, Personality of Godhead? The most defective part of worshiping demigods is that it creates a definite conception of pantheism, ending disastrously in many religious sects detrimental to the progress of the principles of the Bhagavatam, which alone can give the accurate direction for self-realization in eternal relation with the Personality of Godhead by devotional service in transcendental love. The example of the boat disturbed by whirling wind is suitable in this respect. The diverted mind of the pantheist can never reach to the perfection of self-realization due to the disturbed condition of the selections of object."
"The people in general are naturally inclined to enjoy, and you have encouraged them in that way in the name of religion. This is verily condemned and is quite unreasonable. Because they are guided under your instructions, they will accept such activities in the name of religion and will hardly care for prohibitions." Purport. "Srila Vyasadeva's compilation of various Vedic literatures on the basis of regulated performances of fruitive activities as depicted in the Mahabharata and other literature is condemned herewith by Srila Narada. The human beings, by long material association life after life, have a natural inclination by practice to endeavor to lord it over material energy. They have no sense of the responsibility of human life. This human form of life is a chance to get out of the clutches of illusory matter. The Vedas are meant for going back to Godhead, going back home. To revolve in the cycle of transmigration in a series of lives numbering 8,400,000 is an imprisoned life for the condemned conditioned souls. The human form of life is a chance to get out of this imprisoned life, and as such the only occupation of the human being is to reestablish his lost relationship with God. Under the circumstances, one should never be encouraged for making a plan for sense enjoyment in the name of religious function. Such diversion of the human energy results in a misguided civilization. Srila Vyasadeva is the authority in Vedic explanations and the Mahabharata, etc., and his encouragement in sense enjoyment in some form or other is a great barrier for spiritual advancement, because the people in general will not agree to renounce material activities which hold them in material bondage. At a certain stage of human civilization such material activities in the name of religion, as sacrificing animals in the name of yajna, were too much rampant. The Lord incarnated Himself as Buddha and decried the authority of the Vedas to stop animal sacrifice in the name of religion. This was foreseen by Narada, and therefore he condemned such literatures. The flesh eaters still continue to perform animal sacrifice before some demigod or goddess in the name of religion, because in some of the Vedic literatures such regulated sacrifice is recommended. They are so recommended to discourage flesh eating, but gradually the purpose of such religious activities is forgotten and the slaughterhouse becomes prominent. This is because foolish materialistic men do not care to listen to others who are actually in a position to explain the Vedic rites. In the Vedas it is distinctly said that the perfection of life is never to be attained either by voluminous work or by accumulation of wealth or even by increasing the number of population, but it is so attained only by renunciation. The materialistic men do not care to listen to such injunctions. According to them, the so-called renounced order of life is meant for those who are unable to earn their livelihood because of some corporeal defects or for persons who have failed to achieve prosperity in family life. In histories like the Mahabharata, of course, there are topics on transcendental subjects along with material topics. The Bhagavad-gita is there in the Mahabharata. The whole idea of the Mahabharata is culminated in the ultimate instructions of the Bhagavad-gita, that one should relinquish all other engagements and should engage oneself solely and fully in surrendering unto the lotus feet of Lord Sri Krsna. But men with materialistic tendencies are more attracted to politics, economics and philanthropic activities mentioned in the Mahabharata than to the principle topic namely the Bhagavad-gita. This compromising spirit of Vyasadeva is directly condemned by Narada, who advises him to directly proclaim that the prime necessity of human life is to realize one's eternal relation with the Lord and thus surrender unto Him without delay. A patient suffering from a particular type of malady is almost always inclined to accept eatables which are forbidden for him. The expert physician does not make any compromise with the patient by allowing him to take partially what he should not take at all. In the Bhagavad-gita it is also said that a man attached to fruitive work should not be discouraged from his occupation, for gradually he may be elevated to the position of self-realization. This is sometimes applicable for those who are only dry empiric philosophers without spiritual realization, but those who are in the devotional line need not be always so advised."
vicaksano 'syarhati veditum vibhor
ananta-parasya nivrttitah sukham
pravartamanasya gunair anatmanas
tato bhavan darsaya cestitam vibhoh
"The Supreme Lord is unlimited. Only a very expert personality retired from the activities of material happiness deserves to understand this knowledge of spiritual values. Therefore those who spurare not so well situated due to material attachment should be shown the ways of transcendental realization by Your Goodness through descriptions of the transcendental activities of the Supreme Lord." Purport. "Theological science is a difficult subject, especially when it deals with the transcendental nature of God. It is not a subject matter to be understood by persons who are too much attached to material activities. Only the very expert, who have almost retired from materialistic activities, by culture of spiritual knowledge can be admitted to the study of this great science. In the Bhagavad-gita it is clearly stated that out of many hundreds and thousands of men, only one person deserves to enter into transcendental realization, and out of many thousands of such transcendentally realized persons, only a few can understand the theological science specifically dealing with God as a person. Sri Vyasadeva is therefore advised by Narada to describe the science of God directly by relating His transcendental activities. Vyasadeva is himself a personality expert in this science, and he is unattached to material enjoyment; therefore he is the right person to describe it. And Sukadeva Gosvami, the son of Vyasadeva, is the right person to receive it. Srimad-Bhagavatam is the topmost theological science, and therefore it can react on the layman as medicinal doses. Because it contains the transcendental activities of the Lord, there is no difference between the Lord and the literature. The literature is the factual literary incarnation of the Lord so the laymen can hear the narration of the activities of the Lord. Thereby they are able to associate with the Lord and thus gradually become purified from material diseases. The expert devotees also can discover novel ways and means to convert the nondevotee in terms of particular time and circumstance. Devotional service is dynamic activity, and the expert devotees can find out competent means to inject it into the dull brains of the materialistic population. Such transcendental activities of the devotees for the service of the Lord can bring a new order of life to the foolish society of materialistic men. Lord Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu and His subsequent followers exhibited expert dexterity in this connection. By following the same method one can bring the materialistic men of this age of quarrel into order for peaceful life and transcendental realization."
Prabhupada: What is the time now?
Pusta Krsna: About 7:20, Srila Prabhupada. Should we take your leave?
Prabhupada: Any question regarding this?
Pradyumna: Says Srimad-Bhagavatam is the topmost theological science, therefore it can react on the layman as medicinal doses?
Prabhupada: If they simply hear, it will act as medicine.
Devotee (1): Vyasadeva is called tri-kala-jnahe sees past, present and future. How is it that he sees the future, Srila Prabhupada?
Prabhupada: (microphone rattling) Just like common business. Bring that black (indistinct) Bhagavata. Five thousand years before Bhagavatam was written, and so many foretelling are there. (microphone rattling-indistinct) If you like, you can keep...
Devotee: (indistinct)
Prabhupada: Twelfth Canto, Third Chapter.
Pradyumna: Tatas canu-dinam dharmah?
Prabhupada: Hmm, before that.
Pradyumna: That is first chapter.
Prabhupada: Read it, tatas canu-dinam, it is third chapter.
Pradyumna: This is second.
Prabhupada: First chapter, by the end, what is written?
tan-nathas te janapadas
anyonyato rajabhis ca
ksayam yasyanti piditah
Prabhupada: What is the last verse you read?
Pradyumna: Yes, this is the last verse. It says everyone is rajabhis ca ksayam yasyanti piditah.
tan-nathas te janapadas
anyonyato rajabhis ca
ksayam yasyanti piditah
Prabhupada: What is the note?
Pradyumna: (Sridhara Svami's commentary) kim ca, tan nathas te natha yesam te jana-pada desa-vartino manusyas tac-chilacaradinas tesam iva srilamacaro.... (vadas ca tad vantah.)
Prabhupada: The purport is that in the Kali-yuga, the government men, they will be all rogues and thieves. So the citizens also follow them. Tan-nethe, silacarya. Silacarya is their behavior. The politicians, secretaries and big, big officers going to the brothels and drinking wine and enjoying, then what others will not? They will... Go on, second chapter.
Prabhupada: Note?
Pradyumna: Kali-dharman prapancayati-tatas cetyadina.
Prabhupada: That's all?
Pradyumna: Yes. He doesn't say.
Prabhupada: How things will deteriorate, that is explained here. Tatas canu-dinam?
Prabhupada: With the progress of the Kali-yuga... The Kali-yuga has begun after the Battlefield of Kuruksetra. So five thousand years ago. The whole duration of life of Kali-yuga is thirty-two hundred thousands of years. Thirty-two hundred thousands of years, out of which we have passed only five thousand years. Still, the balance is twenty-seven hundred thousands of years. So with the progress of this age, these things will happen. What is that? Tatas canu-dinam?
Prabhupada: Dharmah. People will gradually decrease in their sense of religiosity, dharmah. Then?
Prabhupada: They will be untruthful. Partly because there is no training of brahminical culture how to become truthful. People think that "What is the wrong there, I shall speak something untruth?" So that means the value of truthfulness will decrease. And the importance of religion will decrease. This is the symptoms of Kali-yuga. Then?
Pradyumna: Saucam.
Prabhupada: Saucam, cleanliness. People will become unclean more and more. Then?
Prabhupada: Ksama. Formerly saintly persons and leaders, they used to excuse. Now that, the sense of excusing, "All right, this man has done something, excuse him," that will decrease. The sense of religiosity, truthfulness, and?
Pradyumna: Truthfulness, cleanliness, saucam.
Prabhupada: Cleanliness.
Prabhupada: And ksama, pardon. Then?
Prabhupada: Daya, mercifulness. People will have no mercy. It has already begun. If somebody is attacked, being killed, nobody takes care; he goes in his own way. There is no mercy. There is no mercy to the animals. Now there is no mercy even to one child, one's own child, they killing. Just see how degraded, daya. What to speak of no daya, no mercy for the animalsall right, you are not so advancedbut the mother's mercy to the child will be diminished. This is foretelling. This is called tri-kala-jna. Who expected that mother will kill the child? But Vyasadeva, five thousand years ago, said, "Yes, mercy will be reduced." Then?
Pradyumna: Ayur.
Prabhupada: Ayur, duration of life. The maximum duration of life in Kali-yuga is hundred years, but who is living hundred years? It is being reduced, and it will be so reduced that if a man would live twenty years, he is an old man. It will come to that stage. Now it reducing, from hundred years to ninety years to eighty years.
Hari-sauri: The average is seventy-three years now.
Prabhupada: Seventy, then sixty then fifty. In this way, if a man lives from twenty to thirty years he will be considered grand old man. These are the symptoms, ayur. Then?
Prabhupada: And bodily strength. Bodily strength... In India we, in our childhood, I have seen when British rule was there, all the Europeans were coming, very tall and stout and strong. Now such Europeans are not coming. Even bodily strength reduced. Then?
Prabhupada: And memory. It will reduce. Just see, compare everything, religiosity and the power of mercifulness, pardoning, truthfulness, cleanliness, bodily strength, duration of lifethey're all reduced. Now who can say it is not reduced? Can you say? This is called tri-kala-jna. Tatas, what is that? Canu-dinam rajan?
Prabhupada: Kalena, in due course of time, all these items, there are eight items it will be reducing, reducing, reducing, reducing, reducing so much. So what is that?
Devotee (2): They say that men are living longer now compared to five hundred or six hundred years ago.
Prabhupada: Huh?
Devotee (2): They say that men are living longer now. The scientists, they say that there's less disease. They say that a hundred years ago people had more disease than...
Prabhupada: That these rascals say, we do not say. We have seen in our childhood that my grandmother, she died at the age of ninety-six years. There was no disease. The scientists say that there was disease, now there is no disease?
Devotee (2): They say there is less disease now.
Prabhupada: Less disease, everyone suffering from cancer.
Dhrstadyumna: They are building more hospitals.
Prabhupada: Yes.
Dhrstadyumna: Not less.
Prabhupada: Just see. They're increasing number of hospitals, and there is no disease?
Devotee (2): They say that a child has more of a chance of living now than...
Prabhupada: "They say," but what is the practical? They say all, as I repeatedly, pagale ke na bole chakole ke na khai (indistinct). A madman, what does he not say, and a goat, what does he not eat? So they are all madmen. (laughter) They can say all everything.
Devotee (1): They are experimenting, Srila Prabhupada, with genes now.
Prabhupada: Hmm?
Devotee (1): You say that we are losing the qualities of memory, strength, but they are experimenting where they can isolate genes of persons who have those qualities and put on...
Prabhupada: But we have to see actually what is happening.
Devotee (4): They are also transplanting livers and hearts, increasing the duration of life.
Prabhupada: So whatever they may do, things will happen like this. This is a fact. Can they increase the duration of life? People, can they make any scientific discovery that no man will die less than hundred years? Is there any such discovery?
Hari-sauri: The only discoveries they have made so far are how to kill people quicker.
Prabhupada: Yes. Is there any discovery that here is a pill, you go on taking it, you'll not die before hundred years? Is there any discovery? Then what is the use of talking nonsense? They are reducing their life, that's a fact. And so far as mercy is concerned, we see how much it is reduced. The mother is killing child. Where is mercy now? So they may say anything like madman, but we see practically what is happening. Then?
vittam eva kalau nrnam
karanam balam eva hi
Prabhupada: So vittam, money. Money is the criterion, not family. Formerly, there was family, respectable family, aristocratic family, brahmana family, ksatriya family. All these things are gone now. If you accumulate some money some way or other, then you are respectable, never mind what you are. That is Kali-yuga symptom, that position in society, if you want to be respectable man, you somehow or other gather money. Never mind how we have gathered, what is the method. It doesn't matter. Get some money and you become respectable. Vittam eva hi.
Pradyumna: Vittam eva kalau nrnam janmacara-gunodayah.
Prabhupada: Ah, janmacara. First of all, janma, the family, heredity, was taken into consideration, but that is now forgotten. Get money. Just like in England the British empire's policy was that you bring money from outside and deposit in the government treasury and you become lord. Is it not? Bring money, some way or other. So that was going on, exploiting, they used to go to the foreign countries and somehow or other accumulate money. Just like Lord Clive. He was a street boy, but he made some policy. In this way, diplomacy, he entered into Bengal and got some money, and Lord Clive, he became Lord Clive. So money is the criterion. Some way or other, bring money. That's all. That's a fact. These are the symptoms. Just try to understand.
Pradyumna: Vittam eva kalau nrnam janmacara-gunodayah.
Prabhupada: If you have money, then you are aristocratic, then whatever you do, it is all right. Janmacara, then?
Prabhupada: Guna. You are most qualified man. You may be a drunkard, you may be a prostitute hunter, whatever you may be, but because of money you are a qualified man. Then?
Pradyumna: Janmacara-gunodayah.
Prabhupada: Go on.
Prabhupada: Dharma-nyaya. Now if you want justice, you can get it according to your desire, justice, if you have got money. That is going on. That if you bribe to the court's men and even to the judge or magistrate, you get justice accordingly. That is going on. Dharma acara. Then?
Pradyumna: Dampatye 'bhirucir hetur.
Prabhupada: Hmm? Dampatya?
Pradyumna: Dampatye abhirucir, hetur...
Prabhupada: Abhirucir, yes. Now formerly marriage was a religious ceremony. Marriage was, this boy and this girl should be married, it is a religious function where the father and mother will see their horoscope and see if they are compatible, they will agree, they will live peacefully, so many things are there. Still, in India such things are calculated by the parents of the boy and the girl. But in this Kali-yuga, dampatye abhirucir. Abhirucir means the boy and the girl, if he likes, if he says, that's all. No other calculation. And the, after three days after marriage, there is divorce. (laughter) Because abhirucir, "I like, I don't like," that's all. Now I like, and after three days I don't like, finished, business. In Chicago I saw a newspaper. One girl, within three weeks she has divorced two husbands. (laughter) Yes, I saw it in the newspaper. So this, formerly the father, mother used to see that this boy and this girl are going to be married. So by horoscope, by other circumstances, by family, cultural, by education, so many things, whether they will live peacefully. That was the understanding. Husband-wife means, a man requires a woman, a woman requires a man. They should be combined in such a way that they can live peacefully. If there is no disturbance of the mind, then they can make further progress in spiritual life. Therefore marriage is also necessary, and that must be properly done. This was the... Now there is no such consideration. The boys and girls are free, and if one likes the other... Dampatye, what is that?
Pradyumna: Dampatye 'bhirucir hetur.
Prabhupada: Hmm. Ruci. Ruci means liking. Then?
Pradyumna: I think it is mayaiva vyavaharike.
Prabhupada: Ah, mayaiva vyavaharike. In ordinary dealings there is cheating. This is Kali-yuga. Ordinarily even when gentleman-gentleman, so-called gentlemen talking, he's trying to cheat him, he's trying to cheat him. By talking. And ordinarily. Mayaiva vyavaharike. To talk with gentleman-gentleman, it is ordinary thing, but still there will be so many untruthfulness. Mayaiva vyavaharike. Then?
Pradyumna: Stritve pumstve ca hi ratir vipratve sutram eva hi.
Prabhupada: Hnm. And woman is nice, man is nice, this should be considered by sex power. Stritve pumstve ca hi ratir. Then?
Pradyumna: Vipratve sutram eva hi.
Prabhupada: Vipratve sutram eva hi. And there is a brahmana. What is the proof that he is a brahmana? He has got a sacred thread, that's all. Or thread. It may not be sacred; purchased on the market. So at least we try to give a sacred thread by ceremony. But anyone can purchase a thread from the market, two-paisa worth or one-cent worth, and become a brahmana. "You are a brahmana?" "Yes, you see my sacred thread?" (laughter) Finished. "What you are doing?" "Never mind." Don't be such brahmanas, at least in our camp. You must follow the rules and regulations. Don't show that "I am now doubly initiated, sacred thread." Don't cheat in that way. Vipratve sutram eva hi. Then?
Pradyumna: Lingam evasrama-khyatav.
Prabhupada: Lingam evasrama-khyatav. There are asramas, brahmacari, sannyasi, grhastha. So they have got different dresses. So Kali-yuga, simply by dress, he becomes a brahmacari, he become a grhastha, he becomes a sannyasi, simply by dress. What he is acting, nobody cares, that's all. Then?
Prabhupada: Lingam means the external feature. This is the dress of a sannyasi, this is the dress of a grhastha. Just like danda. Danda is the symptom that he is a sannyasi. Then?
Pradyumna: Lingam evasrama-khyatav anyonyapatti-karanam.
Prabhupada: Hmm. Then?
Prabhupada: Avrttya nyaya-daurbalyam. If you have no money, then you cannot get justice. First of all you have to pay government so many percentage of money. Suppose somebody owes to you some money and he's not giving you. So if you have to go to the court, first of all you have to spend so much money, and if you have no money, then you cannot get your money back. You have to pay this lawyer's fee, the stand duty, and so on, so on. But if you say "I have no money," then forget justice. That's all. Avrttya nyaya-daurbalyam.
Prabhupada: Pandita, if you can speak very vehemently, any subject matter, people may or may not understand, and they will certify you: "Oh, this man is very learned." "What you have learned from him?" "Oh, I could not understand, but he's spoke very nicely." He spoke very nicely. What is that nicely? That capala. (Prabhupada speaks some gibberish) You go on speaking like that, (devotees laugh) and people will appreciate, "Oh, he's a big speaker!" What have you learned from him? Then?
Pradyumna: Anadhyataivasadhutve sadhutve dambha eva tu.
Prabhupada: And if you are poor man, then you are not honest. That is the criterion. "Oh, here is a..." When the poor man comes, you'll not give place at your place. If he wants to stay, you'll refuse, "No." Because he's poor, he's immediately accepted as dishonest. He may be honest or dishonest, but poverty is a sign for accepting a man as dishonest. Then?
sadhutve dambha eva tu
svikara eva codvahe
snanam eva prasadhanam
[SB 12.2.5]
Prabhupada: Hmm. Svikara eva codvahe. Marriage will go on simply by agreement, not by qualification. Svikara eva codvahe. Snanam eva prasadhanam. And if you take bath, then all bodily cleanliness is finished, that's all. Then?
Pradyumna: Dure vary-ay...
Prabhupada: Vary-ayanam.
Pradyumna: Oh. Dure...
Prabhupada: Dure vary-ayanam tirtham. Tirtham. If you go... Just like there is Vrndavana and here is New Vrindaban. But if you spend ten thousand dollars and go to Vrndavana, then it is pilgrimage. And here is Vrndavana-candra. So that is not very important. Dure vary-ayanam. You have to go far, far away, (laughter) then it will be pilgrimage. In India, there is Ganges in Calcutta. But they go to Hardwar. Then it is pilgrimage. (laughter) The same Ganges, coming from Hardwar. Then?
Prabhupada: Hmm. Lavanyam, now you know very well in the Western country. Beauty increases by having long hair. (laughter) I was just trying to recite this verse only, and now see how it is current. Who expected that this foretelling is there in the Bhagavatam? To increase beauty, have long hair. Is it not? Now just see. How five thousand years this thing was foretold? That is the proof. There was no hippie movement then. (laughs) But Vyasadeva foretold that in the Kali-yuga if one keeps long hair he will think himself as very beautiful. There are so many things. Ultimately, with the advancement of Kali-yuga you'll have no food. Food means there will be no food grains, there will be no milk, there will be no sugar, like that. No fruits. If you get fruits, there will be no pulp, it is simply seeds. These things are there. You get a mango, but a mango means simply the big seed, that's all. So how can you check it? If nature's way, things are going to happen like that, what the scientists will do? If there is no rice, no wheat, will the scientists...? They can say replace with a pill, but they cannot produce wheat or rice or dahl or milk, sugar. That is not possible.
Dhrstadyumna: Srila Prabhupada? They have fashioned a way for the spacemen that they can drink their own urine and eat their own stool.
Prabhupada: Yes, that is the most scientific improvement. (laughter) Yes. That they can do. (laughter) By scientific improvement, they can drink their own urine, very tasty. That is possible.
Devotee (1): With all these disqualifications, how can the general mass of people take to Krsna consciousness?
Prabhupada: Yes. That is the only remedy. That is stated here. You'll find this verse,
kaler dosa-nidhe rajann
asti hy eko mahan gunah
kirtanad eva krsnasya
mukta-sangah param vrajet
[SB 12.3.51]
It is, the Kali-yuga, it is an ocean of faults. How...? Suppose all over your body there are boils. So where you will apply ointment? You just dip down. (laughter) (end)

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