Room Conversation – April 14, 1976, Bombay

760414R1-Bombay [63:06 Minutes]

Mind is the controller of the senses

Prabhupada: What can young man... What do they understand the aim of life? Educated young men? They are being educated by you. [indistinct], but they do not know what is the aim of life. What kind of education?

Devotee: Srila Prabhupada, I was reading an examination book in Bengal when we were in that small village. And under the psychology section they have one question, "What is the physical basis of consciousness?" This was standard question in Bengal on psychology for high school: "What is the physical basis of consciousness?" So that is what they are asking them. This is exactly...

Prabhupada: Come. This is a physical question.

Aside: [Transl. Come. Come to this side.] The subtlety.

Eight: gross and subtle. Mind is subtle matter.

Devotee: Srila Prabhupada, how does the subtle mind connect to the gross senses?

Prabhupada: Mind is the controller of the senses.

With mind and the senses, six senses, the living being is struggling in this material world, prakrti. Everyone is struggling; that is also true. Western theories, struggle for existence. They are struggling, and this is the relief, Krsna consciousness. When he gets Krsna consciousness… Just like the other day, the Mathura meeting, one small child, two years old, was young, and one boy took him on the stage, and his mother came. So how anxiously he went to his mother, happy, steady. He was feeling vacant, all world, without mother. So many people are gathering, but because he could not find out his mother, he was abject. That is struggle for existence. Everything is there, but he is finding vacant. And that is our position. We are also part and parcel of Krsna. So without Krsna the hard struggle for existence is going on. But as soon as he will get Krsna, he will be relieved. That is natural, exactly like the child without mother. World, seeing everything vacant; at that stage he cried. That is exhibited by Caitanya Mahaprabhu,

[aside: Come on, this side.]

Gurudasa: In the Srimad-Bhagavatam you said in the purports that the subtle body-mind, intelligence and false ego....

Prabhupada: [aside:] Get the light on. Yes? Push it.

Gurudasa: The subtle body determines what goes on in the gross body, next gross body.

Prabhupada: The subtle body does not determine.

Gurudasa: His mind, intelligence and false ego?

Prabhupada: I make a situation, then the higher authorities, nature, or above nature, Krsna, decides. When you are punished or rewarded by the court, the decision is made by the authorities, not by you. [Transl. Are you leaving?]

Indian lady: [Transl. I will come tomorrow.]

Prabhupada: Eh?

Indian lady: [Transl. I will come tomorrow to take...]

[aside: Somebody give prasadam.] We create a situation, and the decision is higher authority: karmana daiva-netrena [SB 3.31.1]. Daiva-netrena, higher authority. Otherwise everyone would have decided that "I shall become a king." Why not everyone? Why one becomes a stool worm? That is higher decision. What he has done, how he has created his mentality-according to that. Krsna is there within your heart. He knows everything.

When He understands that "He wants to become like this," then He orders through the material nature, "Give him a body like this."

Krsna orders maya that "Give him a body which is just like a machine,"yantra. Yantra means a machine.

So he is seated on a certain type of machine. If he has developed pig's mentality, nature will give him a body of a pig, and he will very gladly eat stool. Similarly, if he has developed the mentality of higher demigods, he'll have body. Similarly, if he has developed Krsna consciousness, he will go to Krsna. Plain thing. It depends on him.

You develop. Therefore the best thing is to associate with devotees and develop Krsna consciousness. Try to understand Krsna, and then you go back to Krsna. That is the best utility of this life.

If you simply try to understand Krsna as He is, then you become liberated, tyaktva deham punar janma: "After leaving of this body, he does not take up any more material body." Material body is subjected to change, one body after another, one body after another. According to his mentality he is given by nature different types of body. He suffers.

So if you want to stop this suffering, [Transl. Please come.] bhūtva bhūtva praliyate, taking one birth or again giving up this body and again accepting another… They do not… They have… The conditioned soul has become so dull and rascal, he does not take seriously that "Why I am dying?" Therefore they have made their own theory, that there is no life after death, everything finished after death. This is the opinion of the Western philosophers, big, big professor, like Professor Kotovsky, Indologist. He said, "Swamiji, after death everything is finished." That means they have no spiritual idea. And our spiritual idea begins from the acceptance of transmigration of the soul. You go even to a village, illiterate, he believes in transmigration of the soul. Ordinary illiterate villagers, he believes. You have seen in Vrndavana? The other day, four or five days before, he was. You know? He was with me, walking in the field, and the krsan-some of them were poor [indistinct]-they came to congratulate me: "Sir, you have come to our field. It is a great fortune. Come here!" And your country it is trespass. [laughter] "Beware of the dog!" "Private!" Warns everyone not to come to my jurisdiction. And here the illiterate, the kishan, he saw one saintly man, he thought, "It is my great fortune that he has come." That is the difference between East and West. There they take it as trespass: "Why this man has come to my land?" He can fire even. But still.

So taking birth in India, where Bhagavad-gita was spoken by the Supreme Lord, we are so bewildered that we do not take the knowledge seriously. How much unfortunate? We question about Krsna's instruction and do not take it, and daily manufacture a type of dharma. Big, big men like Mr. Nanda-such a nice man-he has manufactured religion, manava-dharma [service to mankind is religion]. Every day, one becoming a different type of incarnation and a different type of religious system. And to make a compromise big, big swamis they are saying, "Yes. Yata mata tata patha [as many opinions as many ways]. Whatever you manufacture, it is all right." This is India's misfortune. By birth he is fortunate; by work he is misfortunate. This is the situation. He has taken birth in India, it is a great fortune: bharata-bhūmite manusya janma haila .

And without taking advantage of the great birth, he is misguided by the rascals. The whole country is now bewildered. This is the position. The demigods desired to come to take birth again in India. That is stated in the Bhagavata. The climate, the atmosphere, the education, the knowledge, stock of knowledge, saintly persons… Krsna comes here; Lord Ramacandra comes here; Caitanya Mahaprabhu. We are so unfortunate, and it is due to these bad leaders. Andha yathandhair upaniyamanas [SB 7.5.31]. One blind man is leading hundreds of blind men, and everyone is falling to the ditch. [break]

...for business... Because they have become so mad that directly they will simply argue. They will not accept. Therefore our business is to flatter them and request them, "Kindly take this. Kindly take this." Dante nidhaya trnakam padayor nipatya [Caitanya-candramrta]. After taking the grass in the mouth-because this is Indian way of humbleness, to take a grass and approach a gentleman-that means he has become a very humble and submissive.

And many flattering words I am submitting. So the man, he's approached, he may say, "All right, you can say what is your desire."Kaku-satam krtva aham bravimi he sadhavaḥ. When you give chance, "All right, speak what you want to say." If he says, he sadhavaḥ. Oh, you are a great sadhu. He sadhavaḥ, sakalam eva vihaya dūrad: "You are great sadhu, but kindly give up whatever nonsense you have learned." This is the approach. Sakalam eva vihaya dūrad: "You are such a great person, but you are full of all nonsense knowledge. Kindly give it up." "Then what have I to do?"Caitanya-candra-carane kurutanuragam: "You kindly be attached to Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu." This is all right. We know he is a first-class fool, but he pretends to be a very learned scholar. So how he can be applaused? He sadhavaḥ sakalam eva vihaya: "Kindly give up all nonsensical ideas you have learned, and take to Krsna consciousness." This is our mission. That is our preaching. So much nonsensical ideas they have developed. That is why it is very difficult.

So this is the way of approach: he sadhavaḥ. If I say that you are rascal, [laughter] then you will be angry. Murkhayopadeso hi prakopaya na santaye: if you advise good thing to a rascal, he will be angry, that is all. [Canakya Panḍita] Therefore very politely, he sadhavaḥ: "You are a great sadhu, but one request, that is: forget all nonsense you have learned." That's all. In India they have simply learned all nonsense at the present moment. They have given up Krsna's instruction, and they have learned all nonsense. Rubbish. This is going on. So if intelligent learn are at all, we shall give up all nonsense ideas and take to Krsna's instruction. That is the success of life. Are you agreeable? [laughter] Ha!

Gurudasa: [to guest] Are you agreeable?

Guest: [indistinct] I am all right?

Prabhupada: Huh? "All right," here you say. As soon as you go you will say, "No, you are nonsense. I am right."

And you become attached to Caitanya, Caitanya-candra. If you become really attached to Caitanya-candra, then you will become guru immediately. Caitanya-candra said, amara ajnaya guru hana tara' ei desa [Cc Madhya 7.128]: "Wherever you are, there is a country," Caitanya-candra says, "you become a guru." That is Caitanya-candra. He asks everyone, everyone of India, bharata-bhūmite manusya janma haila . Anyone who has taken birth as human being in India is given so much facility. Janma sarthaka kari': make your life successful and become a guru. You have got the capacity.

Gurudasa: Of course, the concept of transmigration of the soul is…

Prabhupada: By birth you, you are so advanced. [aside: Take this.] Simply by taking birth in India. Just like in the village, you go, mostly illiterate, personally they will see you immediately a saintly person, immediately believe in the transmigration of the soul. Still, how much advantage it is in India? Simply he has to adjust only things a little. That is Caitanya Mahaprabhu's mission, amara ajnaya guru hana [Cc Madhya 7.128]:

"Every one of you become a guru." "How? What shall I do to become a guru? I am illiterate; I have no education. How I can become guru?" Yare dekha, tare kaha 'krsna'-upadesa: [you hear instruction of Krsna and just transfer it]. [aside: Go on.] You hear from the right person that Krsna is the Supreme, and you simply say, "Krsna is the Supreme." But you do not do it. Where is the difficulty? Krsna says, mattaḥ parataram nanyat [Bg 7.7]:

"I am the Supreme."Aham adir hi devanam [Bg 10.2]. You hear it from right person and go everywhere and say, "Krsna is the Supreme Being," and you just become a devotee of Him. Then you become a guru. And if you cheat them, show them some jugglery and become yourself Krsna, then what can you do? That is going on. The so-called gurus, rascals, they are trying to become Krsna. Instead of preaching Krsna's they are trying to become Krsna. Is it possible? But they think Krsna very insignificant. They do not know what is the meaning of Krsna.

[Transl. Please come.] Maha-Visnu, from whose breathing millions of universes are coming out and going in, this Maha-Visnu is a partial representation of Krsna. This is Krsna. Yasyaika-nisvasita-kalam athavalambya. Just like we inhale, exhale out, and so many atoms are coming out and going in. Similarly, Maha-Visnu is breathing, and millions of universes are coming and going. That Maha-Visnu, visnur mahan sa iha, yasya kala-viseso, govindam adi-purusam, that is Krsna. [Transl. What can be done?] Avajananti mam mūḍha [Bg 9.11]: those who are rascals are thinking of Krsna, "Huh, Krsna may be a little more intelligent than me. I am as good as Krsna." This is going on, mūḍhas.

[aside: Got it?]

Devotee: [indistinct]

Prabhupada: Hm?

Devotee: [indistinct]

Prabhupada: What is that?

Gurudasa: Flowers.

Prabhupada: Hm.

Guest: May I ask you a question?

Prabhupada: Hm.

Guest: Is the guru an absolute necessity for spiritual advancement?

Prabhupada: Hm?

Guest: Is the guru an absolute necessity for spiritual advancement?

Prabhupada: What do you think?

Guest: Because they are so rare, as you say it. There are so many gurus who are posing as Christians which Christians disqualifies them to be gurus, and they are very rare. And how can one have gurus when they are so rare?

Prabhupada: Yes. When you go to purchase gold, you must have some idea what is gold. Otherwise you will be cheated. When you want to purchase gold you must have some idea of gold. If you have no idea, then you will be cheated.

Guest: Then…

Prabhupada: First of all you must have to know, knowledge, what is guru. Otherwise you will be cheated.

Guest: If one hasn't got a guru, then how shall he advance?

Prabhupada: Yes, that is essential: adau gurvasraya. [Bhakti-rasamrta-sindhu 1.2.74]. But you do not know, at least, what is the nature of guru, then you will be cheated. Just like here the definition of guru I was speaking. You did not hear. You did not hear?

Guest: No.

Prabhupada: I was speaking, and you did not hear? The symptom of guru?

Guest: Yes. [indistinct]

Prabhupada: What is that?

Guest: He should know…, he himself should have realized, given…

Prabhupada: What is that realization?

Guest: He should have experienced what is given...

Gurudasa: What is that experience?

Prabhupada: That means you are hearing, you're thinking something else. I was just explaining what is guru a minute before, and you are asking the same question. Caitanya Mahaprabhu gives you the idea of guru, that amara ajnaya guru hana, tara' ei desa [Cc Madhya 7.128]. He is saying that "You become a guru. I order you." So what you will answer, sir? "I do not know anything. How shall I become guru? Are you asking me to become a guru?" The next line He says, "Yes. You can become guru immediately."Yare dekha, tare kaha 'krsna'-upadesa: "You simply repeat the instruction of Krsna; then you become a guru." What is the difficulty? Is there any difficulty? [Transl. Keep here.] So if you simply understand Bhagavad-gita, then you will understand guru also. You will not be cheated by so-called gurus. [break]

Sisyas te 'hamsadhi mam tvam prapannam [Bg 2.7]. Therefore a guru means one who speaks on behalf of Krsna, aiyee, he is guru. This is the definition of guru. Aiyee. There is no difficulty to find out guru. Just like if you want to purchase gold, you can purchase, although there is chance of being cheated. But you do not say that there is no gold. That you cannot say. Gold is there, but if you are a rascal you will be cheated. That is…, depends on your knowledge. Gold is there; otherwise the world cannot go on. There are so many volumes of business in transactions of gold-going, coming, purchasing, selling. You cannot say there is no gold. But if you are a rascal, then you will be cheated. Somebody will give you iron and say, "It is gold. Take it." It depends upon you, a little intelligence. You cannot say because I have been cheated that there is no gold. Can you say like that? You do not know; you are a rascal. You do not know to find out where is gold, but you cannot say there is no gold. That is not possible. Real gold. Huh? [Transl. Isn't it?] Because one has been cheated, he cannot say that there is no gold. Because you have been cheated by some counterfeit coins or notes, you cannot say there is no real note. It is your less intelligence you have been cheated. So guru's definition is given there in the sastra, by the authorities. These are given, guru's symptoms. Just like we offer prayer to guru:

Samsara-davanala: this material world is just like blazing fire-davanala, forest fire. In the forest nobody goes to set fire; it takes automatically by friction of dried bamboos. Nobody is interested to go to the forest to set fire, but still the fire takes place. Similarly, in this material world everyone wants to live very happily, but it is not allowed; there is fire. So guru means one who can save you from this blazing fire. Praptasya kalyana-ghnaghantvam: that this forest fire… Sometimes I was only Kathagodama station, and there was forest fire upon the hill, and I asked them, "Why there is smoke?" They said, "There is fire, the very, very top height." Now who will go there to extinguish the fire? Will your fire brigade or bucket of water will be able to extinguish that fire? Then how the fire will be extinguished? Ghanaghanatvam: when there will be sufficient rainfall from the sky. That is guru's business.

Karunya-ghana: guru is bestowed his so much mercy-cloud. A cloud is merciful, pours down rain and the fire becomes extinguished. Similarly, the guru, he has received such mercy from Krsna, and he pours over, and the whole fire becomes extinguished. That is guru.

Guest: Another question: how there are unworldly forces in the world.

Prabhupada: Hm?

Guest: If the whole world is created by spiritual persons who found a spiritual source, how can there be unworldly forces?

Devotee: [explaining] He is asking why there is evil in the world. If Krsna is the creator of everything, why is there evil in the world? This is your question?

Prabhupada: So Krsna has created evil, or you have created evil? Answer this question.

Guest: There is so many devils after...

Prabhupada: No, first of all answer this question. Evil...

Guest: It is very puzzling, so I am asking you.

Prabhupada: No, whether you have created evil or Krsna has created evil? Suppose you are infected with some disease, so you have infected or Krsna has infected you? You are suffering from cholera, and the doctor says that you have infected cholera germ. So you have done it, or Krsna has done it?

Guest: It is a great riddle. Nobody has so far solved it.

Devotee: [explaining] He says it is an unsolvable riddle so far.

Prabhupada: Not unsolvable. You are…, you are going to jail, so your position of your going to jail is created by you or by Krsna? Who has created that position? Hm? Answer this.

Guest: What I wanted to say is that....

Prabhupada: You want to say; I want to say this. Answer this.

Devotee: [explaining to guest] You commit a crime and go to jail. Are you responsible or is Krsna responsible?

Guest: Well, He will also have...

Prabhupada: Why don't you understand that evil you create? Krsna does not create. Krsna wants to save you, that "You rascal, don't create evil. You surrender unto Me." Mūḍha. Why you are creating evil? That is Krsna's concern. Krsna says "You don't do it. Why you are doing that?" So who is creating evil? You are creating. You are creating your own evil, and you are accusing Krsna. How much fool you are, just imagine. Krsna says, sarva-dharman parityajya, mam [Bg 18.66]. "Why you are creating evil? You give up everything, come to Me." Why don't you go? And Krsna is creating your evil? He is trying to save you from evil, and you are accusing Krsna that He is creating. Aham tvam sarva-papebhyo, moksayisyami [Bg 18.66], and still you are accusing Krsna. How much fool you are? Mūḍho nabhijanati mam ebhyaḥ param avyayam [Bg 7.25]. Find out this verse, tribhir guna-mayair bhavair [Bg 7.13].

Devotee: Srila Prabhupada, isn't it also true that if we think that Krsna is creating this evil then we will never take a step to cure our own problem?

Prabhupada: Then that is avoiding Krsna. "Krsna has created evil; why should I go to Krsna?" This is the argument. "I shall create my own religion." That's all. Yata mata tata patha, [as many opinions as many ways]. Read it.

Gurudasa:

Prabhupada: What is the translation? Read loud.

Gurudasa: "Deluded by the three modes, goodness, passion and ignorance, the whole world does not know Me, who am above the modes and inexhaustible."

Prabhupada: Purport.

Gurudasa: "The whole world is enchanted by three modes of material nature. Those who are bewildered by these three modes cannot understand that transcendental to this material nature is the Supreme Lord, Krsna. In this material world everyone is under the influence of these three gunas and is thus bewildered.

"By nature living entities have particular types of body and particular types of psychic and biological activities accordingly. There are four classes of men functioning in the three material modes of nature. Those who are purely in the mode of goodness are called brahmanas. Those who are purely in the mode of passion are called ksatriyas. Those who are in the modes of both passion and ignorance are called vaisyas. Those who are completely in ignorance are called sūdras. And those who are less than that are animals or animal life. However, these designations are not permanent. I may be either a brahmana, ksatriya, vaisya or whatever-in any case, this life is temporary. But although life is temporary and we do not know what we are going to be in the next life, still, by the spell of this illusory energy, we consider ourselves in the light of this bodily conception of life, and we think that we are American, Indian, Russian or brahmana, Hindu, Muslim, etc. And if we become entangled with the modes of material nature, then we forget the Supreme Personality of Godhead, who is behind all these modes. So Lord Krsna says that men deluded by these three modes of nature do not understand that behind the material background is the Supreme Godhead.

"There are many different kinds of living entities-human beings, demigods, animals, etc.-and each and every one of them is under the influence of material nature, and all of them have forgotten the transcendent Personality of Godhead. Those who are in the modes of passion and ignorance, and even those who are in the mode of goodness, cannot go beyond the impersonal Brahman conception of the Absolute Truth. They are bewildered before the Supreme Lord in His personal feature, which possesses all beauty, opulence, knowledge, strength, fame and renunciation. When even those who are in goodness cannot understand, what hope is there for those in passion and ignorance? Krsna consciousness is transcendental to all these three modes of material nature, and those who are truly established in Krsna consciousness are actually liberated."

Prabhupada: So the conclusion is that we create our own evils.

Guest: What about the destructive forces like volcanic eruptions and tornado have taken all these things? It is not created by demons.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Guest: They are also destructive forces...

Prabhupada: Yes. To destroy you, because you are accusing Krsna, then you shall be destroyed. Yes. [aside: Some of our men may... Now make place for the outsiders. You can go upstairs. Eh?] [Transl. All of you go.]

Devotee: …go and see one minute.

Prabhupada: Yes. That'll be nice. [break]

Devotee (2): ...Bhagavatam that when there was a God conscious king, there was no natural disasters in the kingdom.

Prabhupada: Yes, because he was guiding the citizens to become God conscious. That is the duty of the king-to see that everyone is following his principles: brahmana, ksatriya, vaisya, sūdra. That is secular state: that you may follow any path of religious system, but you must follow it. That is the duty of the state. If you say that you are Hindu, then you must follow the Hindu codes. If you say that you are a Christian, you must follow the Christian codes. But secular state does not mean that you become without religion. Whatever you profess, you do it nicely. That is government's duty to see-don't cheat. I am talking that I am a brahmana, and I am doing the cobbler's business-that is cheating. If you are doing the cobbler's business, you say that you are a cobbler. Why do you say that "I am brahmana"? That is governments business. If you are doing the cobbler's business and professing as brahmana, you should be punished immediately. Just like a layman, he does not know anything about medical science, and keeping some bottles, false bottles, colored water. And if you declare sincerely that "I am doctor, medical man," he is a cheater; he should be punished. Similarly, you profess your own way of religion, it doesn't matter, but you must follow that religion properly.

Just like Hindu religion: so who is a Hindu who does not accept Bhagavad-gita? Then how he is Hindu if he does not accept Bhagavad-gita? If he says, "I am Hindu, but I don't believe in Bhagavad-gita," he should be immediately punished, that either you shall give up your name as Hindu or you must accept it, Bhagavad-gita. If you say that you are Christian, you must accept Bible, the teachings of Bible. The teachings of Bible, the Ten Commandments, Christ says, "Thou shall not kill," and if you are killing, then you are not a Christian; you are cheater. The Muhammad says you must go five times to the mosque and offer prayers; if you want to kill animals, you must sacrifice it in this mosque. But he is not following that tenet, he is a cheater. It is state's duty is to see that either a Hindu or Muslim or Christian or anyone, he must following the religious principles. That is the duty. That is secular state. Not that because the state is secular you can do whatever you like. That is very irresponsible state. There is no harm, either you become a Christian or Hindu or Muslim. It doesn't matter. But you must follow the principles; then the state will be nice. If a man is strictly following some religious principle, it doesn't matter what religion he is following-then he is a good man. There is no doubt about it. No religion says that "You become a thief, rascal." Just like in Muhammadan religion intoxication is strictly prohibited. In our Bhagavad-gita also, the Buddha religion, ahimsa-but all the combined instruction of all the other religions you will find in Bhagavad-gita. You find out this verse, ahimsa:

It includes all religious principles, the summary of all religions. Either a Hindu or a Muslim or a Christian-anyone can follow the teachings of Bhagavad-gita. In Durban I was talking in some scholarly society. So there was a Indian, he belongs to the Arya-samaj, so he said that "Swamiji, you are speaking on the Hindu conception of religion." Hindu conception of religion? When Krsna says,

Dehantara-praptir: a child is becoming a boy; a boy is becoming a young man; and a young man becoming an old man-is this Hindu conception? Just see. Rascals. A Muhammadan's child does not become a Muhammadan young man? The people are thinking "Hindu conception." What do you mean by Hindu conception? When Krsna says, annad bhavanti bhūtani [Bg 3.14], that "You produce sufficient quantity of food grains, and everyone will be happy," is it meant for the Hindus, not for the Muhammadans? In this way study each and every verse of Bhagavad-gita. It is applicable to the whole human society. It is not a sectarian thing. Krsna cannot speak anything sectarian. He says, aham bija-pradaḥ pita [Bg 14.4]:

"I am the father of everyone." Does the father say anything particularly to one son and not for the others? If the father advises one son, "My dear boy, you do business like this. This is the way," is it meant for that particular boy and not for the others? Each and every verse you study, and you will see that it is meant for the whole human society. When He says, man-mana bhava mad-bhakto mad-yaji mam namaskuru [Bg 18.65], then what is that religion who will not think of God? Is there any religion which does not think of God? If one does not think of God, what kind of religion it is? So Bhagavad-gita says, man-mana bhava mad-bhakto [Bg 18.65]: "Always think of Me-Krsna, or God." So what is the wrong there? If I advise you, "You always think of God," it is a very wrong thing?

So you study analytically. What is that verse, ahims…, amanitvam adambhitvam [Bg 13.8]. If you become humble and gentle, does it mean that you have to become a Hindu or Muslim? Every person should become humble and gentle, amanitvam adambhitvam. Ahimsa: you should not be violent. Every, each and every verse you study, it is not for the Hindus or Muhammadans. Everyone. For the human society.

Gurudasa:

Prabhupada: Read the translation.

Gurudasa: "Humility, pridelessness, nonviolence, tolerance, simplicity..."

Prabhupada: So is it for only for the Hindus? This instruction, what is that?

Gurudasa: "Humility, pridelessness…"

Prabhupada: Humility. Pridelessness.

Gurudasa: "…nonviolence..."

Prabhupada: Nonviolence.

Gurudasa: "…tolerance…"

Prabhupada: Tolerance.

Gurudasa: "…simplicity..."

Prabhupada: Simplicity. What? What is that? Is it for the Hindus only? Or Muslims? Or Christians? How they are misguided, just see. And we are preaching this Bhagavad-gita as it is. How these Christians, they are taking? Even it is for Hindus, the Bible also teaches the same thing: "Kingdom of God is for the humble and meek." It is not sectarian at all. No religious book is sectarian, but according to the country, man. Just like in the Bible, Christ says, "Thou shalt not kill." So you can understand what kind of men they were-they are very expert in killing. Therefore the first instruction, "Thou shalt not kill" Because those who are sinful, killers, how they will understand about God?

One who is freed from all sinful activities, he can understand God. God is not so cheap. Yesam tv anta-gatam papam. These things have to be understood. I shall remain the most sinful man, and I want to understand God and I want to create God-this is going on.

Guest: What is the difference between God, father and guru?

Prabhupada: God is the supreme father. Guru is your father, your father is your father. God is supreme father. The Christian idea, God is the supreme father: "O God, give us our daily bread." Just like children in a family ask father, "Give me a biscuit," the father supplies. So God is supreme father-for everyone. Is there any difficulty? Is there any difficulty to understand? If God is the supreme father-is there any difficulty?

Guest: If I pray "Our Mother, Father," then why I pray to God?

Prabhupada: Eh? What? He is the supreme father. He is father's father, grandfather's father, great-grandfather's father-you go on. That is therefore He is called supreme father. If you stick to your father, there is no harm.

Guest: [Transl. One guruji had said: guru govinda dau khaḍe, kake lagun paya, balihari guru ap ki, govinda diyo bataya : If guru and Govinda are both present before you, whom should you pay obeisances first? It must be the guru for he has revealed Lord Govinda to you. [Poet Kabir] In that it says one should touch the feet of guru…]

Prabhupada: [Transl. Did the guru say to drink wine? Is he a guru or a rogue?]

Guest: I am also asking this question...

Prabhupada: First of all find out guru. [Transl. Guru. Who is guru? I just explained repeatedly. Guru is he who speaks about the Supreme Personality of Godhead. He is a guru, otherwise he is a thief. He doesn't know anything, so how is he a guru? Just by the name? That's what I was telling. What is the duty of a guru? One who takes you back to Godhead, he is a guru. Guru doesn't mean a pickpocket. Whatever is there in your pocket, he will snatch away. Is that is guru? He is not guru. Guru is he who saves…]

[break] [Transl. Guru. Guru's business is to save him from death.]

Pradyumna:

"One who cannot deliver his dependents from the path of repeated birth and death should never become a spiritual master, a father, a husband, a mother or a worshipable demigod."

Prabhupada: Purport

Pradyumna: "There are many spiritual masters, but Rsabhadeva advises that one should not become a spiritual master if he is unable to save his disciple from the path of birth and death. Unless one is a pure devotee of Krsna, he cannot save himself from the path of repeated birth and death. Tyaktva deham punar janma naiti mam eti so'rjuna. One can stop birth and death only by returning home, back to Godhead. However, who can go back to Godhead unless he understands the Supreme Lord in truth? Janma karma ca me divyam evam yo vetti tattvataḥ. We have many instances in history illustrating Rsabhadeva's instructions. Sukracarya was rejected by Bali Maharaja due to his inability…" [break] [end]