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Garden Conversation

June 23, 1976, New Vrindaban
Prabhupada: ...production of is external. Bahir-anga-sakti. But the sakti, the energy, is coming from the Supreme. Just like here we find this place is shadow and that place is sunshine. Both these places are due to the sun. When there is no sun there is no such distinction that "This is shining, sunny, and this is shadow." So this distinction is there so long we do not know the real source. But if we know the real source, we can understand that this distinction is temporary. Actually the energy is coming from the Supreme. So shadow has come from Supreme, and light has also come from the Supreme. So there is no distinction, ultimately. Just like earring, golden, manufactured from gold, and gold which is not manufactured. So this distinction-manufactured or not manufactured, secondary. But really the earring is also gold, and the lump of gold is also gold. So why should we say that earring is false? It is also gold. In relationship with the supreme source, janmady asya yatah [SB 1.1.1], there is no such distinction. In another place, while Vyasadeva was instructed by Narada, he said, idam hi visvam bhagavan ivetaro. This visva, the virat-rupa, is also Bhagavan, but it appears different from Him. Just like the shadow appears different from the sunshine, but actually, taking the central point of emanation, it is different manifestation. That's all. Treethere are so many varieties. One is trunk, one is branch, one is twig, one is leaf, one is.... So the varieties are there, but the tree is one, the root. So ultimately there is no variety, only one. Sarvam khalv idam brahma. The difference is the Mayavadis, they abruptly say everything is one. Not everything is one. The trunk is not one with the leaf, but ultimately because the root is the cause, so there is no difference between the trunk and the leaf. This is acintya-bhedabheda philosophy, simultaneously one and different. On the whole, everything is the Supreme Personality of Godhead.
Why should we think this world is mithya when it is created by God? Does God create anything false? No. When it is created by God.... When we think that "I create some business, some factory, that is my pleasure," but if somebody else thinks it, it is for his pleasure, that is maya. The world is created by God, He has got some motive, so if the world, cosmic manifestation, is utilized for His purpose, then it is spiritual. Otherwise, it is material.
Devotee (1): In the Seventh Canto, second volume, the first chapter in that volume, Prahlada Maharaja is talking how the studying of the three Vedas is external and it includes knowledge though, of education and self-realization, but he considers it material because it is external study of the Vedas. I don't understand that.
Prabhupada: Anything external is material.
Devotee (1): Self-realization is included in that list of education and self-realization and other items.
Prabhupada: Yes, self-realization, simply understanding "I am not this matter," is also external because there is chance of falldown. But when you are actually engaged in Krsna's service, that is positive platform of self-realization.
Devotee (2): Just like the brahmeti paramatmeti bhagavan iti sabdyate [SB 1.2.11]. Brahmeti.
Prabhupada: Different stages of self-realization. (pause) Today there is no wind at all.
Kuladri: Sometimes, Srila Prabhupada, when we explain that our activities are spiritual, what we are doing is spiritual.... Just like we say the quality of the tape recorder becomes spiritualized when it's used in Krsna's service. So the materialists, they don't understand. They say "Well, the tape recorder will also break, the tapes will also be burned up sometimes."
Prabhupada: That's all right. It will go to Krsna. Breaking, where it will go? Hmm?
Kuladri: They say the chemicals again become...
Prabhupada: That chemical, where it will go? Yato va imani bhutani jayante yasmin samvisanti. Everything is created from Krsna, again it returns to Krsna.
Kuladri: Then they say then we needn't play Krsna conscious music. We might as well play rock and roll if it is going back to Krsna.
Prabhupada: That is maya. This is meant for Krsna's service. As soon as you do anything else, then it is maya. Maya is also Krsna's maya. Daivi hy esa guna-mayi mama maya [Bg. 7.14]. Maya is also Krsna's. But under maya we suffer; under Krsna we enjoy.
Kuladri: So if we engage everything here in Krsna's service, then the atmosphere will change.
Prabhupada: Yes.
Kuladri: They can notice the change in the atmosphere.
Prabhupada: That is real atmosphere. Sva-rupena vyavasthitih. Mukti means to stay in the original form.
Devotee (1): I've heard that you use the example that spirit has form and therefore the body also has similar form, just as a hand has a form in a glove, it's the hand's similar form. So how can we understand that the trees have a certain form? That..., is there spirit in the form of a tree?
Prabhupada: Yes.
Devotee (1): Then how do we explain the transmigration of the soul?
Prabhupada: This outward is a form. What is the difficulty? Describe.
Pradyumna: Just as this human body has a human form, we say that because this body has a form, the soul also must have form.
Devotee (1): Talking about the transmigration then.
Pradyumna: Just as the glove has a certain form because the hand is shaped like that, the material body of a human has that form because the spirit is in that form? And the tree has that form because the spirit is in that form?
Prabhupada: Here difficulty is that the form is fixed up. That is not.... Just like Krsna appears in so many forms, everything is spiritual. So what do you think?
Devotee (2): So the form in the spiritual sky is not absolute either? We can take different forms in the spiritual sky?
Prabhupada: Yes, there are also many forms, but all of them are spiritual. The Vrndavana. There is tree, there is Yamuna water, there is land, there is cow, there is calf, there is gopas, gopis, they are all spiritual. Just like from earth you make many forms, but they are earth. You make pots, you make dolls, but they are all earth. Similarly, spiritual world, there are many forms, they are all spiritual. What is the difficulty?
Pradyumna: Does that form ever change? That form changes also?
Prabhupada: Yes.
Pradyumna: Krsna is young and then He's a little older.
Prabhupada: Generally, it does not change, if one likes this type of form. Santa, dasya, sakhya, vatsalya, madhurya.
Kuladri: That change is available to anyone to progress from santa to dasya?
Prabhupada: That change is not material change. The spiritual bliss is there, either in this form or that form.
Devotee (3): Srila Prabhupada, you said that if we serve Krsna we will enjoy, and if we serve maya then we suffer. How can we get over our desire to serve maya and enjoy separately from Krsna?
Prabhupada: Hmm?
Pradyumna: Says in the material world when we try to enjoy we suffer. When we try to enjoy we suffer? Then how will we get over our desire? And when we serve Krsna we become happy. But how will we get over our desire to serve maya? The attachment is strong.
Prabhupada: Hmm?
Pradyumna: He says how will we get over the desire to serve maya, to try to enjoy ourselves in this material world?
Prabhupada: Serve Krsna.
Pradyumna: It says here that yam labdhva caparam labham manyate nadhikam tatah. One obtaining this actual service of Krsna, when one tastes the service of Krsna, then he sees any other gain, he does not consider anything else. "Established thus, one never departs from the truth, and upon gaining this he thinks there is no greater gain." So when you actually taste the service of Krsna, then you won't consider anything else to be worthy of your effort. But when we do think something else to be worthy of our effort then it means that we haven't, we're not becoming advanced in Krsna consciousness. We're not developed. We should try to develop to that point. We have to develop. Prabhupada says this is the test of Krsna consciousness, that you will not want to depart from Krsna consciousness to enjoy himself in material nature. And when one still wants to do that, that means he hasn't advanced to that point of stability in Krsna consciousness. Drdha-vrata, who's completely fixed in his service. Avasthitih. Yatra sthito na calati. When one is situated there, he doesn't depart from there, he doesn't want to go out from there. So we have to reach that point.
Devotee (3): So, Srila Prabhupada, if at this platform we are not yet..., we are still desiring to depart from Krsna's service and enjoy, then we are not, we have not yet tasted devotional service, what is it that we have tasted that is keeping us temporarily connected to Krsna?
Prabhupada: That is the Vedic injunction: You keep yourself connected with Krsna, then you will develop the taste. Just like a jaundice patient does not taste sugar as sweet, but if he continues to take sugar candy, then he will have the real taste for sugar candy, sweet, not bitter. So he has to continue to eat sugar candy continually. Sravanam, kirtanam. Then he'll have the taste.
Kuladri: But the patient must be intelligent to keep.... Even though he does not want...
Prabhupada: Patient is always rascal fool. You cannot expect him to be intelligent. He must agree to the physician's directions. That is intelligence. He must know that he's diseased, he must follow the instruction of the physician. That much will help him. Unless one is rascal, he does not fall sick. As soon as you violate the hygienic principles, you become sick. All commit sinful activities on account of ignorance. So therefore the best advancement of civilization is not to open hospitals, but to give them a lesson that they may not fall sick and go to hospital. That is real...But they do not know. They keep the mass of people in ignorance, they fall sick and they come to hospital and number of hospitals increase, they think it is advancement. This is their idea. So even the Christians, religious persons, they also open hospital to give relief to the patient. So that is not the program. The program is why he should fall sick and come to the hospital? Precaution is better than cure. One comes to the hospital for cure, but why not take the precaution so that he may not have to come to the hospital for cure? That is Vedic civilization. They have different prescribed rules and regulations so that a person may not fall sick. The modern idea is that "Let them fall sick; we have got hospitals and treat them, and they'll be cured." But he is cured, again he falls sick. That is going on. They have no program for precaution. They have program for cure. But actually, precaution is better than cure. We are taking precaution. The other fools, rascals, they are thinking, "What these people are doing? They are (indistinct) to have no this program, that," according to them. Just like our Vivekananda, he prescribed, daridra-narayana-seva. The same thinghospital. We kill all animals, and the hospital patient is given the meat for improvement of the health. But he does not know that this is not curing; he is become implicated in his karma. He has to be killed again, and eaten by the other animals. That he does not know. They do not accept karma-phala. Eh? The result of fruitive activities, (indistinct). But you will have to accept. There is no excuse. If you contaminate some disease, you must suffer from that disease. There is no excuse. So kriya(?) karma, you have to enjoy or suffer the result of karma. Karma-bandhana. But when you act for Krsna, then you are mukta. Yajnarthat karmano 'nyatra loko yam karma-bandhanah [Bg. 3.9]. Karma must be there. If you work for Krsna, then it is all right, and if you act for your sense gratification, then there is bondage. If you do not take education, if you remain fools and rascals, then you will suffer and create disturbance for others also. Therefore everyone must be educated, good citizens. It is good for him, good for others. (long pause) So you go on reading.
Translation: "One should engage oneself in the practice of yoga with undeviating determination and faith. One should abandon, without exception, all material desires born of false ego and thus control all the senses on all sides by the mind." Purport: "The yoga practitioner should be determined and should patiently prosecute the practice without deviation. One should be sure of success at the end and pursue this course with great perseverance, not becoming discouraged if there is any delay in the attainment of success. Success is sure for the rigid practitioner. Regarding bhakti-yoga, Rupa Gosvami says: utsahan niscayad dhairyat tat-tat-karma-pravartanat, sanga-tyagat sato vrtteh sadbhir bhaktih prasidhyati [Upadesamrta 3]. 'The process of bhakti-yoga can be executed successfully with full-hearted enthusiasm, perseverance, and determination by following the prescribed duties in the association of devotees and by engaging completely in activities of goodness.' As for determination, one should follow the example of the sparrow who lost her eggs in the waves of the ocean. A sparrow laid her eggs on the shore of the ocean, but the big ocean carried away the eggs on its waves. The sparrow became very upset and asked the ocean to return her eggs. The ocean did not even consider her appeal. So the sparrow decided to dry up the ocean. She began to pick out the water in her small beak, and everyone laughed at her for her impossible determination. The news of her activity spread, and at last Garuda, the gigantic bird carrier of Lord Visnu, heard it. He became compassionate toward his small sister bird, and so he came to see the sparrow. Garuda was very pleased by the determination of the small sparrow, and he promised to help. Thus Garuda at once asked the ocean to return her eggs lest he himself take up the work of the sparrow. The ocean was frightened at this, and returned the eggs. Thus the sparrow became happy by the grace of Garuda. Similarly, the practice of yoga, especially bhakti-yoga in Krsna consciousness, may appear to be a very difficult job, but if anyone follows the principles with great determination, the Lord will surely help, for God helps those who help themselves."
Prabhupada: Now questions?
Devotee (1): So is there ever, for someone whose determination wavers and slackens here and there, is there ever a point where the neophyte devotee is in danger of just forgetting everything and falling, tumbling completely back?
Prabhupada: Everyone is neophyte. He should practice determination, that's all. If he cannot practice, then why should he enter into this association? Let him remain aloof. One who has entered with the determination that "I must practice," so if he cannot practice, then why this makeshow that "I belong to Krsna consciousness movement. I am initiated." Why this farce? He must practice with determination that "By practicing I'll be success." That is wanted. He has no determination, why should he make a show? Drdha-vrata. Bhajante mam drdha-vratah. Drdha-vrata, that is wanted, determination. Hmm, go on. When one is determined, his success is assured. If he's not determined, then success or failure.
Devotee (1): Can one develop determination gradually?
Prabhupada: Why gradually? When you promise before your spiritual master that no illicit sex, no gambling, no meat-eating, why should you fall down? If you have no determination, why should you promise in presence of the Deity, fire, spiritual master, Vaisnava? Why do you make this farce, if you have no determination? If you want to make it a farce, that depends on you. But you should not.
Devotee (1): When we make that promise...
Prabhupada: Yes, you should not fall down, that is determination. That is gentleman's determination, that "I have given my promise. Why shall I fall down?" That is determination. "I must respect promise." That is called drdha-vrata. So he'll success. Where is the difficulty? There is no difficulty. But if we want to cheat, that is another thing. If we have no determination, we should not take up this life. Therefore, chance is given that "Stay with us for six months or one year, be determined. Then be initiated." If you are not determined, what is the use of false initiation?
Devotee (1): Sometimes this weakness seems to be...
Prabhupada: Weakness there, you should rectify weakness. Why you should give any importance to weakness? Weakness is weakness. Rectify it.
Kuladri: This promise is the minimum determination.
Prabhupada: Hmm?
Kuladri: This promise of following four regulative principles, chanting sixteen rounds daily, that is the minimum determination. Then, from there, he must increase.
Prabhupada: Initiation means minimum, just beginning. That is the dictionary meaning, initiation. In the Caitanya-caritamrta there is a verse, sraddha-sabde-visvasa kahe sudrdha niscaya, krsne bhakti kaile sarva-karma krta haya [Cc. Madhya 22.62]. Explain. You understand? Sraddha, sabde, visvasa, sudrdha, niscaya. Krsne, bhakti, kaile, sarva-karma, krta, haya.
Pradyumna: The word sraddha means faith. So by the word faith, we need firm determination or conviction, sraddha-sabde visvasa sudrdha niscaya. Visvasa means faith which is sudrdha, very..., sudrdha, drdha means firm, and sudrdha means very firmly. Niscaya. Niscaya is used here also, sa niscayena yoktavyah. Yoga is to be engaged in, applied with firm...
Prabhupada: Faith, niscaya means conviction.
Pradyumna: Conviction. Krsne...
Prabhupada: Bhakti kaile.
Prabhupada: Sarva-karma krta haya.
Pradyumna: Sarva-karma krta haya. And if one engages, if one performs service to Krsna, then everything else becomes accomplished. Everything else becomes accomplished. If one renders service to Krsna, then automatically everything else, one has no obligations to the material world.
Prabhupada: Otherwise, why Krsna will say sarva-dharman parityajya mam ekam saranam vraja [Bg. 18.66]? Because by that action everything will be done. Krsna says sarva-dharman parityajya mam ekam, that means He is cheating? There are so many other occupations, say veda-dharma, samaja-dharma, brahmana-dharma, ksatriya-dharma, medical dharma, lawyer dharma. You can manufacture so many occupations. Dharma means occupational duty. But if you take only one occupational duty, to serve Krsna, all things will be included. Mam ekam saranam vraja. This is instruction. So to accept this principle means firm determination, firm conviction: "Yes, if I serve Krsna, then all my other duties will be automatically done." This is firm conviction. "By one stroke, I'll kill so many birds."
Kuladri: Anartha-nivrtti?
Prabhupada: Hmm?
Kuladri: Rupa Gosvami says bhajana-kriya and then anartha-nivrtti. Then all the unwanted things go away.
Prabhupada: First of all, beginning with krsne bhakti kaile sarva-karma krta haya. So bhakti, beginning is adau sraddha tatah sadhu-sanga bhajana-kriya anartha-nivrttih [Cc. Madhya 23.14-15]. The material world means simply creating unnecessary duties. Simply anartha. Any material activities, you take, analyze, it is simply useless. Therefore we have called anartha. Anartha-nivrttih syat. Take for example we say no meat-eating. So what is the difficulty there? I have seen in the airplane, they eat meat, a little piece, not a lump. But because everyone is eating little, little, we require huge number of slaughterhouses. But if one decides, "I have got so many preparations to eat, so why shall I eat little meat?" (indistinct) I shall forego. Immediately he is saved from so many sinful activities. It is not that he will die if he does not eat a little piece of meat, he will die. He'll not die. We are not dying, and we don't take. So similarly everyone, without eating meat, he can live very nicely. In the whole principle, there is no difficulty. So on this principle this whole world is merged into sinful activity. (Sanskrit), unnecessary. That is material position-unnecessarily creating trouble. There is no necessity. But on account of ignorance, foolish association, sinful life, more and more and more and more going on. Andha yathandhair upagiyamanah. And the deed is encouraged: "Yes, you do this. Enjoy life." What is his enjoyment? If anyone sees slaughterhouse, will he enjoy? Eh? What is...? He visits a slaughterhouse, is it enjoyment? But he takes as enjoyment. (Sanskrit), unnecessary, without any meaning. Mad, just like a madman acts, without any meaning. The monkey acts without any meaning. (Sanskrit), unnecessarily creating disturbance. (Sanskrit) saksad bhakti-yogam adhoksaje. If you take to Krsna consciousness, then all (Sanskrit) is finished. (Sanskrit) We are no more interested in unnecessary things. Illicit sexone side they are encouraging contraceptive method, so why they'll not stop illicit sex, then automatically there is contraceptive method? So one side there is encouraged, contraceptive method, another, unlimited, unrestricted sex. This is their civilization. Why not teach him not to practice illicit sex? Then everything is done automatically. There's no need of contraceptive method. If one is trained up to indulge in sex only for begetting nice children, there is already contraceptive method. There is no necessity of unnecessarily producing cats and dogs children. So that requires training, determination. The sastra says you should not become father if you cannot train up your children to save him from death. Who is the father who's training? To save him from the cycle of birth and death means to make him Krsna conscious. So if you are not yourself Krsna conscious, how you can train up your children to become Krsna conscious? This is determination, that "If I cannot train my children to become Krsna conscious and thus avoid the botheration of birth and death, I shall not have sex." That determination will save so many troubles. That can be done by practice. By engaging the mind in Krsna, it is possible. The more you advance in Krsna consciousness, you'll lose interest in this sex life. In Vaikuntha there is no sex life because the sex pleasure is not the foremost pleasure in the Vaikunthaloka. The sex pleasure is foremost here in this material world. They have got so much transcendental spiritual pleasure, this sex pleasurethey are astonished: is that pleasure? (Makes spitting sound) Phu! Yad-avadhi mama cetah krsna-padaravinde nava-nava-rasa-dhama... That stage is possible. Still there are so many brahmacaris. So everything depends on practice. Abhyasa yoga-yuktena [Bg. 8.8]. That requires determination. (aside:) Where did you go, to take bath?
Palika: This house just across.
Prabhupada: There is water? Well? No.
Palika: There are barrels there, filling them daily.
Prabhupada: Why not well? Have a big well?
Kuladri: They are getting water also, Srila Prabhupada, from this well. Your well is also going to that side.
Prabhupada: Yes. Have several wells in all places. That is nice. Is it very expensive?
Kuladri: It's expensive.
Prabhupada: It is more expensive than carrying water and consume petrol? That is laziness. Once you have a well, then you save so much trouble. Get one well in each, our house. It is here very deep, uh? To get well? Tube-well? But there are so many creeks.
Kuladri: We have what is called a springhouse. It's pure spring water, it's caught in reservoir.
Prabhupada: Where is it?
Kuladri: At the other farm we have, as well as tube-well,
Prabhupada: Water must be.
Devotee (1): Srila Prabhupada, if in the spiritual sky there is no sex life...
Prabhupada: You can store the snow. Yes. Big, big hole and collect the snow and put it here and cover it, it will stay. Is it not?
Kuladri: We have so much water, though, running off the hill, we can make lakes. We have three lakes now.
Prabhupada: Then? Why don't you do it?
Kuladri: You saw the Radha-kunda in the movie, in the film.
Devotee (1): Srila Prabhupada, when one returns to his svarupa, his natural form, how does...
Prabhupada: First of all, anartha-nivrtti. You are accustomed to so many bad habits. First of all try to rectify it, then talk of svarupa. Where is your svarupa? Simply wasting time. A man is diseased, he's thinking, "When I shall be cured I shall eat, go to this hotel, I shall eat like this." First of all cure, then talk of eating this and that. Svarupa, when you are cured, that is svarupa. So long you are not cured, what is the use of talking svarupa? First business is cure yourself. Anartha-nivrtti, that is anartha-nivrtti. Then svarupa will come. That is the babajis. In Vrndavana, you have seen? Siddha-pranali.
Pradyumna: Ah, siddha-pranali, siddha-deha?
Prabhupada: They are smoking and having illicit sex with one dozen women-svarupa. Rascal. This is called sahajiya, a rascal. Condemned. Where is your svarupa? Don't talk unnecessarily. First of all come to svarupa, then talk of svarupa.
Devotee: So our motivation should be to get free from birth, disease, old age and death.
Prabhupada: That is already explained. But you must be determined how to execute devotional service. Without determined devotional service, how we can attain that position? So what is the use of talking utopian? First business is anartha-nivrttih syat. Adau sraddha tathah sadhu-sango 'tha bhajana-kriya tato anartha-nivrttih syat. You adopt this means that you have got full faith that "Krsna consciousness will save me." Then you live with devotees who are similarly determined. Then you execute devotional service. Then anartha-nivrttih syat, you'll be free from all these.... These are the stages. There is.... Up to anartha-nivrtti, you have to struggle very hard with determination, and then automatically everything will come. Tato nistha tato rucis tatah, athasaktis tato bhavah. So before svarupa, anartha-nivrtti, don't expect all these. Read.
Prabhupada: This is practice.
Pradyumna: "Gradually, step by step, with full conviction, one should become situated in trance by means of intelligence, and thus the mind should be fixed on the self alone and should think of nothing else." Purport: "By proper conviction and intelligence one should gradually cease sense activities. This is called pratyahara. The mind, being controlled by conviction, meditation, and cessation of the senses, should be situated in trance, or samadhi. At that time there is no longer any danger of becoming engaged in the material conception of life. In other words, although one is involved with matter, as long as the material body exists, one should not think about sense gratification. One should think of no pleasure aside from the pleasure of the Supreme Self. This state is easily attained by directly practicing Krsna consciousness."
Kuladri: Srila Prabhupada, before you said the patient has no intelligence.
Prabhupada: Therefore he requires spiritual master's guidance. Because he is rascal. What is the use of accepting a spiritual master? If you want to be cured independently, what is the use of calling a physician, consulting a physician? You do it yourself. (pause) Whether our cows are left now? We don't find cows.
Kuladri: They are at Govindaji temple. They are at the, where we will build Govindaji, at the main farm, Bahulavana, for Radha-Vrndavanacandra, and some at Vrndavana. In Vrndavana they are kept free to roam around, but at our farm in Bahulavana they have to be in pastures.
Prabhupada: Last time I saw some cows here.
Kuladri: Yes, this pasture.
Prabhupada: Still there?
Kuladri: No.
Devotee (4): This pasture is through now, is it not? For a while. This pasture is through for a while, it must grow back. They are on another pasture.
Kuladri: Today we had three calves born, all female heifers.
Prabhupada: Yes, go on.
Devotee (4): The difficulty is that we cannot understand, we cannot feel what pleases Krsna now, yet we can feel what pleases us, and that is the difficulty?
Prabhupada: You have no feeling, that everyone knows. Therefore you have to carry out the order of spiritual master, that's all.
Devotee (1) : If we try to please Krsna with all of our service and activities, that automatically brings pleasure to the self?
Prabhupada: You cannot please Krsna directly. You please your spiritual master, Krsna will be pleased. If you want to please directly Krsna, that is not possible. That is concoction You cannot please. Yasya prasadad bhagavat-prasadah **. You have to please your spiritual master, then Krsna will be pleased. Don't jump. Guru-mukha-padma-vakya, cittete koriya aikya **. What is that song you daily sing? What is that?
Pradyumna: By the words of the spiritual master our mind becomes conclusive from...
Prabhupada: Ara na koriha mane asa. Don't concoct. Don't you sing daily? Ara na koriha mane asa. Don't manufacture ideas. That is dangerous. Caitanya Mahaprabhu teaches by His example. Guru more murkha dekhi' karila sasana [Cc. Adi 7.71]. Caitanya Mahaprabhu said to Prakasananda Sarasvati that "My spiritual master saw Me fool number one, so he has chastised Me, that 'Don't try to read Vedanta; chant Hare Krsna.' So I'm doing." (motorcycle in background) Just hear. He has come to this turn. This sound is purposefully created? (motorbike going back and forth through much of the tape)
Kuladri: Yes, Srila Prabhupada.
Prabhupada: Just to show that he has a motorcycle? Or what is purpose?
Kuladri: They have given us trouble sometimes.
Prabhupada: Demons.
Kuladri: When your palace is on the other side, they won't disturb. And we will have walls.
Prabhupada: No, they don't like us.
Kuladri: They are doing better than before, but still they are somewhat envious.
Prabhupada: Everywhere this world is like that. Even the father will give trouble, Prahlada Maharaja, what to speak of others. Demon father is giving trouble to a Vaisnava son. And not grown-up son, five years old, innocent, but he's giving trouble.
Devotee (3): When we had sickness the state police became very interested in us, and today a state policeman stopped me and asked if you were here. So he seems to be paying special attention that you are here now. He's very interested.
Prabhupada: However demon may be, they can appreciate that these are ideal characters.
Devotee (4): All these state police, they purchase Bhagavad-gita.
Prabhupada: Huh?
Devotee (4): All these state police, they purchased Bhagavad-gita. (sound of motorcycle comes very close, idles) (end)

Link to this page: https://prabhupadabooks.com/conversations/1976/jun/garden_conversation/new_vrindaban/june/23/1976

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