11--Darśana, November, 1970, India

Prabhupada: He is free from the desires of sense gratification, you cannot call him a yogi. This is the version of Bhagavad-gita. Eh, what is your opinion?

Guest: How is he free from desires?

Prabhupada: Eh?

Guest: How is he free from desires?

Prabhupada: Yes. Very intelligent answer. He can not be free from desires. That is not possible. The. Sometimes some yogis, some sannyasis say that, "You give up your desires." That is not possible. I am a living entity, how can I give my desires? Desires must be. That is a living symptom.

Guest: Yes.

Prabhupada: If I become desireless that means I am dead. So desires can be stopped can not be stopped but it has to be purified. The whole sensitive activities are not to be stopped but it has to be purified. Just like in our devotional service we are taking advantage of these musical instruments. Music, dancing and artistic work. Similarly the materialistic persons they also like dancing and music and art. But what is the difference? Here everything is for Krsna's satisfaction. The same desire: artistic desire, musical desire, dancing desire. Everything is here but they are meant for Krsna's satisfaction. That is desireless. But personally I have no desire but for satisfying Krsna I have got all desires. That means your, that propensity to desire. It is explained by Narottama-dasa Thakura: 'kama' krsna-karmarpane [Prema-bhakti-candrika].

This kama means desires, krsna-karmarpane. We should think of always-how to develop this Krsna consciousness movement. Just like a person is thinking always how to improve his personal material position similarly we shall think always how to improve the process to fulfill the Krsna's desire. Krsna's desires that: "Everyone should surrender unto Me." He personally comes and desires: "Give up every type of religious principles and simply surrender unto Me." He desires this. Caitanya Mahaprabhu also desires the same way. They go everywhere and speak the philosophy of Krsna. Krsna desires and Krsna in the form of Lord Caitanya, the devotee, He also desires. Our spiritual master desires, so we have to fulfill their desires, that's all. That is also another. "I shall desire to fulfill the desire's of my spiritual master." The desire is there but so long I desire to satisfy my own senses, that is materialism. But as soon as I desire to fulfill my higher authority, Krsna, Lord Caitanya, my spiritual master, that is spiritual.

So you haven't got to kill desire, you have to change the process of desire. That is purification of this. Sarvopadhi-vinirmuktam tat-paratvena nirmalam [Cc Madhya 19.170]. Our desires are now designated. I am desiring as Indian, I am desiring as Hindu, I am desiring as so many things. So these are all designated desires. They are not pure desires. As soon as I think that, "I am Indian. I have to fulfill the desires of my country, my countryman." Just like Arjuna was thinking, "I have to fulfill the desires of my family or my country of my nation or of my tradition." So many things. So these are all material desire. So this material desires has to be purified by transferring the same desire to satisfy Krsna. That is. One has to learn how to desire. Desire can not be killed. Krsnendriya-priti vancha tara nama... dhare 'prema' nama As soon as you try to fulfill the desires of Krsna, that is love of God. Why should you try to fulfill the desires of somebody else? Unless you have got love.

These boys and girls they have given up everything and they are trying to push on forward this movement. That is their only desire. The desire is there, they have also come here, leaving their own country, working very hard. The desire is there, you can not say they are desireless but they have no desire for their personal satisfaction. They are working under the direction of spiritual master to fulfill the desire of Krsna and Lord Caitanya. This is purification of desire. It is clear?

Guest: Swamiji, I have desire as you know.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Guest: So how can I transfer it to Krsna's desire?

Prabhupada: Yes.

Guest: Is it not very difficult to transfer it?

Prabhupada: No, no, no. It is not that. Then you do not understand. You work with great sincerity in your office work. Just, Krsna says in the Bhagavad-gita: yat karosi yaj juhosi yad asnasi yat tapasyasi kurusva mad-arpanam [Bg 9.27]. But if your desire is that working in the office, whatever result I get I shall utilize it for Krsna.

Guest: Yes.

Prabhupada: Then there is no disturbance. You work very sincerely, very honestly in your office. That working honestly, sincerely in the office is devotional service. If your desire is to give the result to Krsna. Now you get say one thousand rupees at the end of your month and now you make program for your sense gratification. Now if you make program for Krsna's satisfaction then it is bhakti, even by working in the office. Kutumba-bharanena va.

The whole people, they are working very hard at the daytime to acquire money-artha iha. And as soon as they get money they make a prescription for sense, sense gratification, either for personal or for family or from country or from society, like that. That desire has to be changed. That whatever you have got in your possession, that should be spent for satisfaction of Krsna. That is to be learned. You can do the same thing for the satisfaction of Krsna and that is bhakti.

Guest: Suppose you are [indistinct]

Prabhupada: Eh?

Guest: [indistinct]

Prabhupada: Ah.

Guest: [indistinct]

Prabhupada: What is that? You purch...

Guest: [indistinct]

Prabhupada: Yes. You are, you are earning money for feeding your family so you adjust your family affairs in such a way. Just like we have done. We are also eating, we are also sleeping. We have. I may be sannyasi but there are, I mean to say grhasthas also. So everyone is engaged for satisfying Krsna. Similarly you can adjust your things. You can. What we are doing here you can do the same thing at your home. What is the difficulty? Family-wise. Here is also a big family, you have got a small family, we have got a very big family. If we can manage why you can not manage? It is to be learned how to do it, that's all. How many members you have got?

Guest: Only three.

Prabhupada: Eh?

Guest: [indistinct]

Prabhupada: Three. So if we can manage three hundred or thirty at a time you can not manage three?

Guest: I can manage but I don't know how to.

Prabhupada: That is to be learned. That is to be learned. Then you have to learn here. How we are doing. Everyone can manage his family affairs. It is not difficult. Simply you have to change the consciousness, Krsna consciousness. Then either you remain at home or here it is the same thing. Krsna must be center. You can also establish a small Deity like this. Instead of coming here your family, husband, wife, your daughter, you can have mahgala-arati.

Guest: Worship we are doing.

Prabhupada: That has to be adjusted. If you are doing then there is nothing to be done, that's another thing. But it has to be done, I don't think you are doing exactly what we are doing here.

Guest: No, not exactly.

Prabhupada: That is the art, that is the art. We have to learn that.

So desirelessness means not desiring for sense gratification, that is desireless. Otherwise we don't mean, nobody means that, that:

So this is the formula for becoming a yogi, a sannyasi-anasritaḥ karma-phalam. Everyone is trying to enjoy the fruit of his work-everyone. "I'm doing business, I shall earn millions of dollars and I shall enjoy it." This is the spirit. But one who does not think like that. "That the result I will not take." Suppose if there is profit of million dollars, "I'll not enjoy it, Krsna will enjoy it and I will spend it for Krsna." That is pure desire. And you can do it. Krsna has got so many programs to execute justly. Here, do you think we don't require money? We require money but how we are spending? These boys and girls they're lying down on the floor. They've got only one loin cloth. But do you know we are spending daily 150 rupees?

Guest: No.

Prabhupada: We have got expenditure. So much. And we have got forty centers, huge expenditure in Europe, America, it is very expensive. In a center we spent, according to Indian exchange, twenty thousand rupees per month. But a still you will see they have no any gorgeous dress, not any pompous living, but still we have got heavy expenditure. But that expenditure is for Krsna. That is the difference. Our expenditure is not less than any householder or any big family. We have got heavy expenditure but every expenditure is for Krsna. We collect every paise for Krsna and spend it for Krsna. That is the difference Anasritaḥ karma-phalam karyam-and we are doing it as duty. Not that, "Oh I may not," everyone is trying to do more and more and more. Karyam, karyam means: "It is my duty," it has to be done. It is not that voluntary, I may do or I may not do. No you must. Karyam, karyam is it not? Karyam means: "must", karyamiti karoti yaḥ. Not that, "Under the obligation of my spiritual master order I am doing." No. Karyam, it is my duty. Iti karoti yaḥ-one who acts like that, he is sannyasi. It doesn't matter whether, what dress he has got, he is sannyasi. Yogi, he is yogi. Anasritaḥ karma-phalam, karyam karma karoti yaḥ, sa sannyasi-he is sannyasi. Karyam karma, sa yogi ca-he is yogi. Na niragnir na cakriyaḥ. Not that simply one is sitting idly doing nothing and meditating. He is not yogi. Krsna says, see in the Bhagavad-gita. Meditating for hours or days or years but doing nothing for Krsna, that is not yogi. That is not yogi. Krsna very explicitly says that:

Akriyaḥ means-those who do not do anything. Simply meditate or read Vedanta philosophy or chant Hare Krsna, but does not do anything. Krsna says, "No, they're not yogis, they're not sannyasis." Only that person who is working without any desire for enjoying the result. Now the result will be there. Suppose you make a business and you got profit one million dollars, but you have promised, "I will not take the result." Then who will take? Who will take?

Guest: God will.

Prabhupada: Eh?

Guest: Krsna will.

Prabhupada: Yes. Just like you have got millions of dollars, you don't take.

Guest: We need only food and clothing.

Prabhupada: Eh?

Guest: food and clothing.

Prabhupada: Food and clothing?

Guest: Ah.

Prabhupada: So we are without food and clothing?

Guest: Suppose I have a family.

Prabhupada: Ha.

Guest: [indistinct]

Prabhupada: Yes.

Guest: So what is your [indistinct]

Prabhupada: How we are utilizing money? We are getting daily two thousand, three thousand. What you are getting?

Guest: Something

Prabhupada: You may be getting one thousand per month, we are getting daily three thousand. Just see how we are spending. And you have to work so very hard and we simply go, "Please become our life member," and he immediately gives us eleven hundred, eleven rupees. And we are spending that. Just see our accounts, how we are spending, how we are getting money. Not only three thousand, if we get three millions of rupees daily you can spend it for Krsna. We have got such program. What is three thousand? You give us the whole money of the world, we shall spend it for Krsna. We have got program. Krsna is unlimited, His service is unlimited and He wants unlimited money for His service. What the ordinary worker desires, they may desire for a few hundreds or a few thousands or a few lakhs. We want the whole world's money for Krsna. And we know how to spend it for Krsna. This is our program, Krsna consciousness. [End]