Conversation – January 25, 1977, Jagannātha Purī

Unfortunately, we have on the heads of government all men of the low-grade character

Prabhupada: Just imagine what kind of astrologer. The modern astrologers, they cannot foretell like that, neither they can believe that it is possible.

Satsvarūpa: [reading] "The real qualification is to become a devotee of the Lord, and gradually all the good qualities worthy of possession developed. Maharaja Pariksit was a maha-bhagavata, or a first-class devotee, who was not only well versed in the science of devotion but also able to convert others to become devotees by his transcendental instructions. Maharaja Pariksit was, therefore, a devotee of the first order, and thus he used to consult great sages and learned brahmanas who could advise him by the sastras how to execute the state administration."

Prabhupada: So who is going to do that? All these... All rogues and thieves, drunkards and fourth-class character, meat-eaters, they are the government. How you can expect good government for the benefit of the people? This is Kali-yuga. Unfortunately, we have on the heads of government all men of the low-grade character. You... Your President?

Satsvarūpa: New President?

Prabhupada: No, that Kennedy.

Satsvarūpa: Kennedy.

Prabhupada: He was always associating with naked woman.

Satsvarūpa: Yes, it's been discovered.

Prabhupada: Just see. And he is the President.

Satsvarūpa: Now Gargamuni says a new book has come out about Gandhi, telling things about Gandhi that are shocking.

Prabhupada: Gandhi was actually very sexually inclined. In his autobiography he has written that when his father was dying, he was having sex with his wife. After finishing sex with his wife, then he came to see his dead father. He has admitted. And his association with his granddaughters, granddaughter-in-law, that is also this... A new book has come out?

Satsvarūpa: Yes. He says it tells about that even after he pledged to be brahmacari he traveled with some young girl, and...

Prabhupada: No, even when he was old man and leader he would go, keeping, resting his hand on two young girls. That means he was very fond of sex. There is no doubt about it. What business he...? He is speaking of "Mahatma" Gandhi. He could not get the help of two young men? Why two young girls?

Satsvarūpa: "Such great kings were more responsible than modern elected executive heads because they obliged the great authorities by following their instructions left in Vedic literatures. There was no need to enact daily a new legislative bill by impractical fools and to alter it again and again conveniently to serve some purpose. The rules and regulations were already set forth by great sages like Manu, Yajnavalkya, Parasara and other liberated sages, and the enactments were all suitable for all ages and all places. Therefore the rules and regulations were standard and without flaw or defect. Kings like Maharaja Pariksit had their council of advisors, and all..."

Prabhupada: Our things on the veranda can be kept inside. Because they are here, somebody may... So many men are coming and going.

Satsvarūpa: "All the members of the council were either great sages or brahmanas of the first order. They did not accept any salary, nor had they any necessity for such salaries. The state would get the best advice without expenditure. They were themselves sama-darsi, equal to everyone, both man and animals. They would not advise the king to give protection to the man and instruct him to kill the poor animals. Such council members were not fools or representatives to compose a fool's paradise. They were all self-realized souls, and they knew perfectly well how all living beings in the state would be happy both in this life and the next. They were not concerned with the hedonistic philosophy of 'Eat, drink, be merry and enjoy.' They were philosophers in the real sense, and they knew well what is the mission of human life. Under all these obligations, the advisory council of the king would give correct directions, and the king or executive head, being himself a qualified devotee of the Lord, would scrutinizingly follow them for the welfare of the state. The state in the days of Maharaja Yudhisthira or Maharaja Pariksit was a welfare state in the real sense of the term, because no one was unhappy in that state, be he man or animal. Maharaja Pariksit was an ideal king for the welfare state of the world."

"King Pariksit married the daughter of King Uttara and begot four sons, headed by Maharaja Janamejaya."

Purport: "Maharaja Uttara was the son of Virata and maternal uncle of Maharaja Pariksit. Iravati, being the daughter of Maharaja Uttara, was the cousin-sister of Maharaja Pariksit, but cousin-brothers and -sisters were allowed to get married if they did not belong to the same gotra, or family. In the Vedic system of marriage, the importance of the gotra, or family, was stressed. Arjuna also married Subhadra, although she was his maternal cousin-sister.

"Janamejaya: One of the rajarsi kings and the famous son of Maharaja Pariksit. His mother's name is Iravati, or according to some, Madravati. Maharaja Janamejaya begot two sons of the names Jnatanika and Sahkukarna. He celebrated several sacrifices in the Kuruksetra pilgrimage, and he had three younger brothers, named Srutasena, Ugrasena and Bhimasena II. He invaded Taksasila [Ajanta], and he decided to avenge the unlawful curse upon his great father, Maharaja Pariksit. He performed a great sacrifice called Sarpa-yajna, to kill the race of serpents, including the taksaka which had bitten his father to death. On request from many influential demigods and sages, he had to change his decision to kill the race of snakes, but despite stopping the sacrifice, he satisfied everyone concerned in the sacrifice by rewarding them properly and stopping further procedure of the sacrifice. In the ceremony, Mahamuni Vyasadeva also was present, and he personally narrated the history of the Battle of Kuruksetra before the king. Later on, by the order of Vyasadeva, his disciple Vaisampayana narrated before the king the subject matter of Mahabharata. He was much affected by his great father's untimely death and was very anxious to see him again, and he expressed his desire before the great sage Vyasadeva. Vyasadeva also fulfilled his desire. His father was present before him, and he worshiped both his father and Vyasadeva with great respect and pomp. Being fully satisfied, he made charities most munificently to the brahmanas present in the sacrifice."

"Maharaja Pariksit, having selected Krpacarya for guidance as his spiritual master, performed three horse sacrifices on the banks of the Ganges. These were executed with sufficient rewards for the attendants, and at these sacrifices, even the common man could see demigods."

Purport: "It appears from this verse that interplanetary travel by the denizens of higher planets is easy. In many statements in Bhagavatam we have observed that the demigods from heaven used to visit this earth to attend sacrifices performed by influential kings and emperors. Herein also we find that during the time of the horse sacrifice ceremony of Maharaja Pariksit, the demigods from other planets were visible even for the common man due to the sacrificial ceremony. The demigods are not generally visible to common men, as the Lord is not visible. But as the Lord also by His causeless mercy descends to be visible to the common man..."

Prabhupada: This is the real answer. They want to see.

Nanda-kumara: Would you like this pillow, Srila Prabhupada, behind your back?

Satsvarūpa: It is very weak argument to say, "Something doesn't exist because I don't see it."

Prabhupada: It is childish.

Satsvarūpa: But they can say, "Neither is it a proof that it does exist."

Prabhupada: How you can prove? You can hear only. There are many things which is beyond your sense perception. The example which I often give, that "Who is your father?" What is proof? The proof is the hearing from mother. That's all. You cannot have any other proof.

Satsvarūpa: "Although celestial beings are not visible to the naked eyes of the inhabitants of this earth, it was due to the influence of Maharaja Pariksit that the demigods also agreed to be visible. The kings used to spend lavishly during such sacrifices, as the cloud distributes rains. A cloud is nothing but another form of water, or, in other words, the waters of the earth transform into clouds. Similarly, the charity made by the kings in such sacrifices are but another form of the taxes collected from the citizens. But as the rains fall down very lavishly and appear to be more than necessary, the charity made by such kings also seems to be more than what the citizen needs. Satisfied citizens will never organize agitation against the king, and thus there was no need of changing the monarchial state. Even for a king like Maharaja Yudhisthira there was needed a spiritual master for guidance. Without such guidance one cannot make progress in spiritual life. The spiritual master must be bona fide, and one who wants to have self-realization must approach and take shelter of a bona fide spiritual master to achieve real success."

"Once, when Maharaja Pariksit was on his way to conquer the world, he saw the master of Kali-yuga, who was lower than a sūdra, disguised as a king and hurting the legs of a cow and bull. The king at once caught hold of him to deal sufficient punishment."

Purport: "The purpose of a king's going out to conquer the world is not for self-aggrandizement. Maharaja Pariksit went out to conquer the world after his ascendance on the throne, but this was not for the purpose of aggression on other states. He was the emperor of the world, and all small states were under his regime. His purpose in going out was to see how things were going on in terms of the godly state. The king, being the representative of the Lord, has to execute the will of the Lord duly. There is no question of self-aggrandizement. Thus as soon as Maharaja Pariksit saw that a lower-class man in the dress of a king was hurting the legs of a cow and bull..." [break]

Prabhupada: ...there the injunction of the sastra, krsi-go-raksya [Bg 18.44]. Go-raksya. Cow should be protected. Krsna said, krsi-go-raksya. Krsna did not say chagala-raksya or hog-raksya. Go-raksya. So it is the duty of the king or the state or the government to give protection to the cows. This is sastric injunction. But nowadays neither the state or government is giving protection to the cow. They are becoming implicated with so many problems.

Satsvarūpa: I heard that India again is not slaughtering cows. [break]

Prabhupada: ...perception. That is experience. Why do you give on seeing only? By seeing one mango you cannot understand what quality it is, but you have to touch with your tongue. Therefore in chemical laboratory the characteristics are there: "This is the color. This is the taste. This is the reaction." So you have to gather experience like that, not by simply seeing. That I gave the example. Now you take one egg. What is there? Some white and some yellow substance. So you make one egg with white and yellow and bring life. So what is the power of your seeing? A small egg. Take a small egg. The covering, some celluloid; within, some white substance, some yellow substance. Or make further analysis and give some chemicals of the same taste, same color, same characteristic. Now bring life. But the same thing, you put under the feather of the chicken, within five days it will bring life. So what is the credit of these rascal doctors, D.H.C., that a small chicken is better than these D.H.C.? Why don't you see it practically?

Gargamuni: The chicken is simply sitting, and he is...

Prabhupada: He is bringing life. What is the answer of these rascal scientists?

Satsvarūpa: No good answer. Bluff.

Prabhupada: Challenge them like this, that "First of all do it. You are less than the chicken. Why you are claiming so much honor? We treat you, you are fig. You are less important than the chicken. Prove that you have got some power; then claim that you are scientist." Hmm? Is that argument all right? What will be the counterargument?

Gurukrpa: A sane man would accept.

Prabhupada: They're all rascals.

Gurukrpa: They're not sane; they're saying anything.

Prabhupada: They do not know anything; still, they are claiming very high position.

Gurukrpa: I heard one scientist on the airplane. There were three scientists sitting behind me, and they were speaking that they hope they are living in the year 2000. One man said, "I become so excited when I think how advanced we will be in the year 2000 that I just hope I do not die before then, 'cause I want to see how everything will be then."

Satsvarūpa: By then they think they will be doing this, creating life.

Prabhupada: That any insane man can say. Any crazy man can say. "Trust no future, however pleasant." "You are rascal. You are believing in the future. We are not so rascal. Because in the past you could not do-there is no history-in the present you cannot do. So how shall I believe that in future you'll do?" So any rascal promises like that, so we take him as a rascal. That's all.

Satsvarūpa: What about our promise, in the future also, that you go to Krsna in the future?

Prabhupada: We have got proof. Krsna says; we believe in Krsna. You believe in some rascal; we believe in Krsna. That is the difference. Krsna says, tyaktva deham punar janma naiti mam eti [Bg 4.9]. So we believe that. That's all. We have got evidence. You have no evidence. You are simply suggesting in future you'll do. But we have got evidence.

Gargamuni: Sometimes they ask, "Show us somebody who's come."

Prabhupada: Hmm?

Gargamuni: "Show us someone who has come from there."

Prabhupada: Many.

Gargamuni: "But we don't find any."

Prabhupada: Many. Many. It is in the sastra. "He was formerly like this, and now he has become this." There are many.

Gargamuni: Well, that's in the sastra. They say now we want...

Prabhupada: But sastra is the proof. Our proof is sastra. Your proof is your sastra. Did you go to the moon planet, or you believe the newspapers? Have you gone?

Gargamuni: No.

Prabhupada: Then if you can believe newspaper, why shall I not believe in the Veda, Vedanta?

Gargamuni: No, but one man has come. They showed.

Prabhupada: So one man... You have not gone. You have no experience. So one man, you believe authority.

Gurukrpa: But we saw the television. They showed on the television.

Prabhupada: No. Television could not show that. You can arrange in the laboratory such television, cheat others. And you have done it. But anyway, television or man or newspaper-you believe on others. You have not personally gone. So you believe some authority; we believe some authority. What is the difference? You take newspaper as authority; we take Vedic literature as authority. Where is the difference? You have personally not gone. How do you believe? The difference is that you believe somebody, we believe somebody. I asked this question to Professor Kotovsky, that "You believe Lenin; we believe Krsna. Then where is the difference between philosophy?" Now it is to be judged whether Lenin is all right or Krsna is all right. That is another thing. But the principle is there. "You believe in Lenin; we believe in Krsna." The process is the same. So where is your improvement?

Satsvarūpa: They say that theirs can be shown not just to a disciple but to the whole world in general, not just...

Prabhupada: Nobody believes in Lenin. Then there would have been everyone Communist. You believe, a section. Then why there are two parties? You are not all in all. That is going on everywhere. How you can say that you are correct, I am not correct? The process is the same. Therefore Vivekananda has compromised, "Everyone is correct." Yata mata tata patha. [as many opinions as many ways.] There is no quarrel.

Gurukrpa: Then they accuse us of being fanatical.

Prabhupada: You are also fanatical. Why do you believe Lenin? You are fanatical in our eyes. You are worse than fanatical, because we have got great other authorities, they believe Krsna is God. You have created a section recently, but we have got evidences from thousands and thousands of years ago, authorities believing Krsna. Our literatures are very old. Your literature recently made.

Gargamuni: Sometimes, though, they try..., they may agree philosophically about Krsna, but then they will bring in Krsna's controversial personal life. They always do this.

Prabhupada: Personal life?

Gargamuni: They bring in about, always about the gopis and Krsna.

Gurukrpa: They just did that recently in Honolulu.

Gargamuni: Philosophically they may agree. But then they will go and attack Krsna's...

Gurukrpa: Character.

Gargamuni: His character.

Prabhupada: But that... Because...

Gargamuni: Even in India they do. They say, "Rama, He was better."

Prabhupada: But what do you know about Rama and Krsna? You do not know anything. You are not a devotee. You have to learn the science. Manusyanam sahasresu kascid yatati [Bg 7.3]. You are ordinary man. You cannot understand. Then one can criticize his father and mother also, that "My fa..." They do. Some rascal do like that. Kim anyat kama-haitukam [Bg 16.8]. "My father has done harm to me. By lusty desire he gave me birth, and I am suffering." They say like that. So you can in that way, you criticize your father and mother. But that is not law. Law is father and mother should be respected. But you rascal, you can criticize your father. You are such a rascal.

Gargamuni: 'Cause in India that happens a lot. Especially...

Prabhupada: No, then father, mother should not be respected, because they indulged in sexual life and brought me into existence and I am suffering. Then there should be no respect for father and mother. And then this sex life should be stopped, and there is no need of big, big scientist, philosopher. Because this indulgence will bring so many big men, so it should be stopped. But Krsna is the father. Why He should not have sex? Any father has got sex. So if you criticize Krsna, then you must criticize your father first. But that is not the law of nature nor the law of the society. Law is different. Who will criticize his father? Any sane man? Will any sane man do that? So you are insane. So who is caring for your remark? You are insane.

Hari-sauri: They're just envious of Krsna, anyway. They're envious because they want to enjoy.

Prabhupada: That is the cause, that they're criticizing. They're envious.

Gargamuni: Oh, yes.

Prabhupada: That's all. The envious man can say anything.

Gargamuni: That I notice when they say that. I can notice their envy.

Prabhupada: But still Krsna is being worshiped. Here is Jagannatha, Krsna. Millions of people have come to worship. You are rascal. You may criticize. It doesn't affect Krsna's respectful position.

Gargamuni: Caitanya Mahaprabhu, although Krsna's life may have been controversial, still, He was very strict sannyasi.

Prabhupada: He never criticized Krsna. Rather, He was enjoying Krsna's love with gopis.

Gurukrpa: Ramya kascid upasana vraja-vadhu-varga-virya kalpita .

Prabhupada: So we have to follow Caitanya Mahaprabhu, not you.

Satsvarūpa: And Sukadeva Gosvami.

Prabhupada: Yes. You do not know what is Krsna. That is the... Krsna must have everything; otherwise how He is God? God's definition is that everything is emanating from Krsna. Janmady asya yataḥ [SB 11.1.1]. He's God, the original source of anything-anything and everything. Then He's God. So if sex life is not in Krsna, then wherefrom it comes? Does it drop from the sky? You rascal, you do not know the science.

Hari-sauri: And with Krsna's sex there's no inebrieties.

Prabhupada: Hmm?

Hari-sauri: When Krsna has sex life there's no inebrieties. There's no abortion and contraception. With his sex life there's so many bad things.

Prabhupada: No, first of all, wherefrom the sex life comes if it is not in God? You make God impotent. But we do not make. Why He should be impotent? Then He's imperfect. If He's not potent, then He's imperfect. And God is all-perfect.

Satsvarūpa: They take it that this is an example of anthropomorphic, that we are saying...

Prabhupada: Whatever it may be.

Satsvarūpa: "God has sex."

Prabhupada: They are lascivious. It must...

[break]

Gargamuni: As soon as they get some knowledge...

Prabhupada: Just like a tuberculosis patient. To him doctor says that "You don't have sex life. That will bring your death." Does it mean sex life is bad? The tuberculosis person, for him it is bad, not for the sane man, not for the healthy man. So when sex life is advised to..., forbidden, that is for the diseased condition. But who is never diseased-he is perfect-for him there is no forbidding of sex life. So you do not understand that in this material condition you are suffering only. You have no brain. Therefore morality, immorality, good, bad-there are so many things. But when one is perfect, healthy, for him all the activities of life is perfect. Just like a physician advised me, "You don't take salt." Does it mean salt is bad? I am in a particular condition of this kidney trouble or liver trouble. For me salt is bad. But does it mean salt bad?

Gurukrpa: No. It's very good.

Prabhupada: Similarly, sex life for you is bad, not for Krsna. You are thinking Krsna like you, mūḍha.

Gargamuni: Yes. They try to equate themselves.

Gurukrpa: Sex-monger.

Prabhupada: Yes. You are taking Krsna on your level. You are such a rascal. You do not know Krsna. Therefore Krsna says, manusyanam sahasresu kascid yatati siddh..., yatatam api siddhanam kascin [Bg 7.3]. You do not know what is Krsna. You are taking Him on your level; therefore you are trying to criticize Him. You do not know what is Krsna. That is your ignorance. What is food for one is poison for others. So for you it is poison, not for Krsna. Krsna is God. He has everything. He can use everything. That is God. He is not restricted by anyone. Mattaḥ parataram nanyat [Bg 7.7]. Who can restrict Him? Then He's not God. If by a third-class man like you He's restricted of His sex life, then He's not God. He becomes under your control. But Krsna is isvaraḥ paramaḥ krsnaḥ [Bs 5.1]. He's the supreme controller. How He can be controlled by your so-called goodness and badness? So the conclusion is you do not know Krsna. You want to bring Krsna in your level of understanding, and that is your foolishness. So we don't care for the fools like you. This is our conclusion. Avajananti... That is replied, avajananti mam mūḍhaḥ [Bg 9.11]: "Those who are rascals, fools, they criticize Me, thinks Me that I am as good as human being." Manusim janma. Param bhavam ajanantaḥ [Bg 7.24]: "The rascals do not know what is My actual position." So you have to preach in that way.

Gargamuni: I have found sometimes when going to the offices that these people, these businessmen in India, they have become so offensive, because they always try to attack Krsna's activities more than anybody in any other place.

Prabhupada: Yes. Otherwise where is the need of preaching?

Gargamuni: More than any other place.

Prabhupada: If you expect everyone is in favor of Krsna, then where is the need of pushing on Krsna consciousness?

Gargamuni: In the West we can discuss philosophy with people. They never try to attack Krsna's...

Gurukrpa: Now they are attacking, because they have gotten your books. [Prabhupada laughs] Even the Christians, they have read your books. And they are saying, "Well, Krsna did this. Krsna did that."

Prabhupada: He must do it, because He's God. You do not... You have no conception. You explain that if there is no such things, then wherefrom it has come? God is the origin. In the Bible also it is said, "God said 'Let there be creation.' " So in the creation there are so many things. So therefore everything comes from God. That is Vedanta philosophy. Janmady asya yataḥ [SB 1.1.1]. So why do you say, "Your God is like this"? God has everything. Otherwise how He's God? There is no meaning of God if He is deficient in something. But you do not know.

Satsvarūpa: They say He should be exemplary. God should be exemplary.

Prabhupada: No. God is not bound to prove His example character to you. You are a rascal.

Satsvarūpa: Then how will I know what to follow?

Prabhupada: You learn! You come to me. I'll teach you and beat you with shoes and teach you. [laughter] Come to me. Why I am here? You come. I shall beat you with shoes and teach you. Then you'll learn. You require some beating with shoes. You are a bad student. So I'll do that. "Come on."

Gurukrpa: Beat with shoes. [laughs]

Prabhupada: [laughs] Yes. I keep always my shoes for my bad students.

Gurukrpa: Can you bring them, you can beat me, Srila Prabhupada. I'd like that. I am always being beaten by maya.

Prabhupada: [laughs] Yes. A student who is more chastised is advanced. Guru more mūrkha dekhi' karila sasana . Caitanya Mahaprabhu said, "My spiritual master saw Me a grand fool. Therefore he has chastised." That is the position. The more we remain a grand fool, then more we may advance in spiritual consciousness. Caitanya Mahaprabhu says. Guru more mūrkha dekhi' karila sasana. He was mūrkha?

Satsvarūpa: Srila Prabhupada, one thing they're doing against us more and more in the West is taking the testimony of an ex-disciple of yours, and he will say, "I was a Hare Krsna..."

Prabhupada: "Because he is rascal, therefore he's 'ex,' excommunicated. My Guru Maharaja has kicked him out, so what is the value of his word?"

Gargamuni: We can say these men were excommunicated.

Prabhupada: Ex means he's executed. That's all. He's finished.

Satsvarūpa: Why listen to his testimony? We can say, "Why listen to his testimony?"

Prabhupada: Yes. Why not take our testimony? We are... Now take.

Gargamuni: Even in the church they do that. If some priest is not following or introduces something new, they are excommunicated. So we have excommunicated him. Why he should be listened to?

Prabhupada: He's no more in this.

Gargamuni: That's legal. In the church they do that. Why we cannot do?

Prabhupada: That is natural-somebody will go out and speak against us.

Satsvarūpa: The demons are very eager to hear. "Oh, tell us what they did to you."

Prabhupada: [laughs] "That is not your business. You better ask because you have taken him as authority. You have already taken him as authority, the excommunicated member. So you ask him." These things will happen. In preaching, you cannot expect very smooth path going. Otherwise what is the use of preaching?

Hari-sauri: That's been going on for a long time.

Prabhupada: Yes, yes.

Hari-sauri: Even their own religion started like that. Jesus's..., one of his best disciples turned him in.

Gurukrpa: Actually they are helping us to become Krsna conscious by giving us an opportunity to preach about Krsna.

Gargamuni: It makes us serve with great..., more enthusiasm. Even the demons help us out.

Prabhupada: That is the way of electricity. Hmm? Electricity. Some thunder may come. That is electricity. The word is used, apratihata. Pratihata means checking. When your devotional service will make progress in spite of checking, that is pure devotion. Ahaituky apratihata yenatma samprasidati [SB 1.2.6]. And that is pure devotion. I was attacked by heart attack thrice. While on the ship, twice.

Gargamuni: On the ship twice? Oh.

Prabhupada: Consecutively two days, attack. Actually I would have died on the ship before reaching your country. I could not understand that was heart attack. The pain was so severe, I thought, "I am now dying." And it was done two nights. And I was very much afraid whether on the third night, that "If this night also again some pain like that comes, then I'll die." But third night did not pain. It was suspended. It came in New York. And you know it, that left side was paralyzed.

Gargamuni: Yes. Left side. We had to massage constantly.

Prabhupada: No, they were arranging for some operation.

Gargamuni: Yes. Those doctors.

Prabhupada: I told Kirtanananda, "Give me massage."

Gargamuni: I can remember. I wheeled you down for test.

Prabhupada: The heart was also very painful still.

Gargamuni: They wanted to take some blood, and I had to stop them.

Prabhupada: They were examining my brain. Then I thought, "I must go away." I told, "Doctor, I am all right. I can go."

Gargamuni: They wanted to do so many tests. They wanted to take also from spine.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Satsvarūpa: They did that. They did give you that spine needle.

Prabhupada: Oh. Never call doctor. Never give me hospital. Let me die peacefully if I am in trouble.

Gargamuni: Tirtha Maharaja had many doctors.

Prabhupada: He has suffered too much.

Gargamuni: Oh, yes. [pause]

Prabhupada: When I was in Los Angeles after coming back from India, in that black quarter, do you remember? No.

Gargamuni: Black order?

Prabhupada: Black quarter.

Gargamuni: Oh. That was on West Pico Boulevard? That storefront?

Prabhupada: Our temple was...

Gargamuni: West Pico Boulevard, right. I know that place. Yes. I was there. Yes, right. When you came back.

Prabhupada: Before our La Cienega...

Gargamuni: Yes. It was in the black quarter. I can remember.

Prabhupada: I was continuing my disease up to there.

Gargamuni: And you had one house near?

Prabhupada: Many houses. I was not sleeping at night, and there was some sound, "goh-goh-goh-goh," in my ear. So long the body will be there, there will be so many troubles. And Krsna has advised that "They will come and go. Don't care for them. That's all." Agamapayino 'nityas tams titiksasva bharata.

So bodily, mental, by enemies-so many impediments will come. What can be done? We have to tolerate. That is material world. We cannot expect smooth, very happy. That is not possible. Krsna advising Arjuna, what to speak of us. What we are in comparison to Arjuna? He's His personal friend, talking with Him. He said, tams titiksasva. Krsna never said, "I have made some magic. You'll have no failure," like that. Tams titiksasva: "You just try to tolerate. That's all." He never gave him any tablet. [chuckling] He taught that... So we have to do that. As the modern gurus says that "I'll give you some ash. There will be no trouble," Krsna did it so? He said, "No, tolerate." That's all. He could have said, "I'll give you some ash." "You are ass; I'll give you some ash." [laughter] Neither Arjuna asked also, that "Why You are asking me to fight? Give me some ash. I'll throw." He was not such a fool that he asked some magic from Krsna and kill his enemies. Actually he fought. This is Bhagavad-gita. So face things as they are and depend on Krsna. That is our duty. We must go on with our duty. Don't expect any ash, miracle, magic.

[pause] So what is...? You have got sleeping place?

Gargamuni: Well, we have the beach. No, we have two rooms. Until seven o'clock in the morning we can use these two rooms. So our men can stay. Some will sleep in the van. I will sleep in the van.

Prabhupada: In some car? In the car?

Gargamuni: Huh?

Prabhupada: In the car? In my car?

Gargamuni: No, no. No one is sleeping there.

Prabhupada: No, no. Then why not sleep, someone, some two?

Gargamuni: No, it's not very... It's not long enough. We are big.

Gurukrpa: We have enough place without.

Gargamuni: In the summer here we park... You know where I took you on the other side? We brought our vans there, and we slept right on the sand. Very nice.

Prabhupada: Beach. Very nice. Summer it is nice.

Gargamuni: Nice breeze all night.

Prabhupada: Very nice sleep.

Gargamuni: Yes. Fresh. Right? You were there.

Gurukrpa: Yes. I was there.

Devotee: We slept outside, under the stars. We cooked out there. We cooked outside.

Prabhupada: In villages eighty percent, ninety percent people, they sleep outside during summer.

Gargamuni: But here there's no... There was no mosquitoes.

Prabhupada: Because the wind is strong.

Gargamuni: Yes. Very strong. And just a light cadar. A light cadar and that's all.

Prabhupada: Yes. In village also. In summer, night is rather pleasant.

Gargamuni: Yes. Because there is breeze. Chandigarh, we were there, and Saharanpur. We were sleeping...

Prabhupada: You can sleep very comfortably in summer. And in the morning you'll feel fresh, refreshed, complete.

Gurukrpa: I am sleeping comfortable any place.

Prabhupada: Yes, that depends on practice.

Gurukrpa: An expert in sleep.

Prabhupada: Anything. Sarirera nama mahasaya, ya sahabe tai saya. There is a Bengali proverb that the body is very nice. If you practice something, it will tolerate. Jaya.

[devotees offer obeisances] [break] [end]