Room Conversation

April 19, 1977, Bombay
Prabhupada: What you can do when a man dies? Can you save? So similarly, everyone is being handled by the laws of nature. Nobody can do anything, such puffed up, "We can do this plan." All these political leaders, they are simply wasting time. They cannot do anything. Indira promised, daridra hata(?). But now he is, she is daridra. Poverty-stricken. Daivi hy esa gunamayi mama maya duratyaya [Bg. 7.14]. These rascals, they challenging the material laws? Such a rascal? You are scientists, they are challenging. Are they not challenging?
Svarupa Damodara: Yes, we challenge.
Prabhupada: What kind of rascals they are, just imagine. Just like "I shall move the mountain with my head." Such rascal. And they are going on as scientist. You have to challenge them like that, that "You are all rascals, so challenging the laws of nature." But from the very beginning I called them rascals.
Giriraja: You were right.
Prabhupada: Little ABCD, and they are trying to challenge the laws of nature. Little learning dangerous. Alpa-vidya bhayam kare(?). Just like in our society. Some of them have got little Sanskritthey have become scholar, Sanskrit scholar. They're reading only Sanskrit. Rascal cannot read anything, and they are wasting money, four hundred, five hundred, like that, "Sanskrit Department," dozen men. You were speaking. So I have stopped it. Unnecessary. I have talked with so many foreign Sanskrit scholars. They do not know anything. Still, they are passing as Sanskrit scholar.
Giriraja: This also you said many years ago.
Prabhupada: Yes. I talked with one professor, Norman Brown or something like that. He does not know Sanskrit. He is in charge of the Sanskrit...
Svarupa Damodara: Amogha-lila Prabhu has arranged a press conference today.
Prabhupada: Eh? Yes. Talk with them scientifically.
Svarupa Damodara: Yes. That is at three o'clock.
Prabhupada: That's nice. Where it will be?
Giriraja: In the city, at... It's a vegetarian restaurant.
Prabhupada: Never mind. Talk with them.
Giriraja: It's a popular place for press conferences.
Prabhupada: So they know that the scientific...?
Giriraja: Oh, yeah, yeah. It's on the basis of science.
Prabhupada: Yes.
Giriraja: Scientific.
Prabhupada: Now our commonsense reasoning, that there is children, there is motherwhere is the father? We are laymen. Can you say, without father, the children is born?
Giriraja: No.
Prabhupada: Can you say?
Svarupa Damodara: Impossible.
Prabhupada: Eh?
Svarupa Damodara: That's not possible.
Prabhupada: That's not possible. So those who are denying the existence of God, they are rascals, all fools. The grass is growing from the land, and grass is eaten by animals. In this way we are all children. And you say, "mother's land." That is a common saying, "mother's..." So mother is there. We are children. Who is the father? Reply this common sense.
Svarupa Damodara: There must be father.
Prabhupada: There must be father. We are children, and the mother is named, so who is the father? What they will answer? There is no such law, that without father, mother has given birth. Where is that law, physical or anything?
Giriraja: There is none.
Prabhupada: And we may be rascal; we do not know who is father. The father Himself says, aham bija-pradah pita: [Bg. 14.4] "Here." We accept Krsna. This is intelligence. The father is present. He says, aham bija... The rascal is searching out: "There is no father." So immediately who denies the existence of God, he is a rascal. He is to slapped only, with shoes. That is the only remedy. Anyone who denies the existence of God. He's a rascal. He should be properly treated with shoes and beaten.
Giriraja: That's true.
Prabhupada: That's all. Murkhasya lakutausadhi(?). When a person is fool number one, beat him. That's all. Dhol gobara...(?) Tulasi dasa has said, dhol gobara sudra pasu nari, ei saba sasana ke adhikari. Dhol, drum, you have to bring it to the tune by beating, "tung, tung." Gobara. Gobara means fool person. Pasu, animal. Dhol, gobara, pa..., sudra, and nari, woman. They should be punished to bring them into order. Ei saba sasana ke adhikari. Otherwise they will spoil. A barking dog, you cannot pacify him, "My dear dog, don't bark." It will disturb him: "No!" Dhol gobara sudra pasu nari, ei saba sasana ke... So anyone who is denying the existence of God, he is a rascal number one and beat him with shoes. Bas. He is being beaten with shoes by nature.
Giriraja: By the laws of nature.
Prabhupada: Yes. Janma-mrtyu-jara-vyadhi [Bg. 13.9], going on. Mrtyu-samsara-vartmani [Bg. 9.3]. But they are so shameless, neither they do know what is going to happen. Some rascal the other day complained, "There are many orphans." The orphan means no father? Does orphan means he has no father? Orphan means he has father; the father does not take care. That's all. You cannot deny, "There is no father."
Giriraja: Yeah.
Prabhupada: You put this question and answer amongst the scientists. "How can you deny the existence of God?" "I am not seeing." "And you see or not see; there must be father." I think this commonsense argument nobody can refute.
Svarupa Damodara: No. (laughs) It is little... Common sense, a little intelligence, and everything can be solved. They are obstinate.
Prabhupada: That means rascal. Obstinate means rascal. Obstinate is not a sane person.
Giriraja: Actually they're animals.
Prabhupada: Yes. So these animals, they are passing on as big scientists, philosophers, theologician, and so on, so on. We have to stop them. Na mam duskrtino mudhah prapadyante naradhamah [Bg. 7.15]. This is the qualification of a person who does not accept God: duskrtina, naradhama, mudha, mayayapahrta-jnana-although highly educated, no knowledge-asuram bhavam asritah, simply atheist. So as Krsna conscious leaders, we have to punish them, chastise these rascals. They are demons.
Giriraja: Actually, it's... It's actually relishable to chastise them.
Prabhupada: Yes. (laughs) It is a pleasure sport. So you come here. What is the news? What the, all these rascals saying? Newspaper means all the statement of rascals.
Bhakti-caru: "Earnest Plea to Nine Congress Chief Ministers."
Prabhupada: Eh?
Bhakti-caru: "Earnest Plea to Nine Congress Chief Ministers. Charan calls for all the assembly elections. New Delhi, April 18th. The Union Home Minister, Mr. Charan Singh..."
Prabhupada: Again election, as if election will change their quality. They remain... Let them remain as rascal, and simply by election, in place of one rascal, another rascal will improve it. This is the... Let them remain rascal, but get vote. So that is... That is described in Bhagavatam, sva-vid-varahostra-kharaih samstutah purusah pasuh [SB 2.3.19]. The population is sva-vid-varahostra, and they are giving voteanother big pasu. That's all. This is going on. This is democracy. The voters are pasu, and he is selecting another big pasu. This is going on. The rascals, they do not know, "If instead of a tiger, we select one lion, then what is the difference? Simply name. The tiger was president. Now the lion is the president." And both of themanimals. Where is the man, human being? This is going on. And because they are pasu, sva-vid-varaha, they are happy: "Now there is lion. Now the tiger is driven away. Now there is lion." This is going on. Hm? Am I right?
Svarupa Damodara: Oh, yes.
Prabhupada: This is the... That's all. Bhagavata is siddhanta-karana(?), so correct, so accurate, and so nicely composed. Kim anyaih sastraih. In the beginning there is, kim anyaih sastraih: "There is no more use of any other sastra." Srimad-bhagavate maha-muni-krte kim anyaih sastraih, nigama-kalpa-taror galitam phalam idam [SB 1.1.3], kim anyaih sastraih. Nigama-kalpa-taror galitam phalam idam, srimad-bhagavatam. It is meant for the highly qualified, thoughtful philosopher. They are not flowery language. It's fact. Nigama-kalpa-taror galitam phalam idam. So we are trying to give to the world this nigama-kalpa-taror galitam phalam [SB 1.1.3]. Let them take it and take full advantage. Essence of all the Vedic knowledge. If they are intelligent... So how many men required to form a comm...? Is there any rule, Doctor?
Svarupa Damodara: Five men is good.
Prabhupada: So you can give his name. He is Indian. Five name.
Svarupa Damodara: I have already have five, but... Sadaputa, Madhava, myself, and Ravindra-svarupa, Amarendra, I think can also give.
Prabhupada: But they are foreigners.
Prabhupada: But for Manipur business...
Svarupa Damodara: Oh, for Manipur? Oh, yes.
Prabhupada: For Manipur business don't mistake. Don't use them. We form this five-man subcommittee and take the donation. Then you develop. (looking at newspaper) Whose photo is there?
Bhakti-caru: Mr. J. C. Shah, an agent... "Former Chief Justice, Mr. J. C. Shah, who is going to assist (indistinct) during the emergency. The former Supreme Court Judge is an agent into the affairs of..."
Prabhupada: Accha?
Bhakti-caru: Enquiry...
Prabhupada: Now...
Bhakti-caru: But it depends on... Everything depends on how much honest they will be.
Prabhupada: Hm?
Bhakti-caru: How honest they will be.
Prabhupada: Kana-mama (?). If there is no mama, blind mama is all right. And who is that, this photograph?
Bhakti-caru: This one is Mr. Charan Singh addressing a press conference in Delhi on Monday, Charan Singh, Indian Prime Minister. (Hindi) "The passport of Mr. Sanjay Gandhi, Mr. Motilal, and Mr. Dhirendra Brahmacari, who runs a yoga center here, have been impounded. Official sources also said here today the necessary instructions have been issued in this regard to the concerned authorities."
Prabhupada: Impound? Impound? What is the impounding?
Bhakti-caru: Cancelled today.
Prabhupada: Where there is?
Bhakti-caru: New Delhi. (Bengali) "The instructions have been issued in this regard to Assam authorities. Mr Brahmacari is known to be close to Mr. Sanjay Gandhi." "Morarji Wants Prices. The Prime Minister, Mr. Morarji Desai, today promised in a radio broadcast to check the recent rise in prices on certain goods. 'If necessary by comparing quotas in the current stocks and even by imports, where feasible.' Mr. Desai observed that prices had declined since between February 25 and the end of March but have again increased in the last few weeks in the case of essential goods like oil seeds, cotton, edible oil, til, pulses and food grains. This has raised apprehensions in the minds of (indistinct). Some traders and some stockists have taken advantage of the shortage of certain commodities to increase prices. The form of exploitation would not be tolerated. The Prime Minister said that 'Lifting of the emergency does not mean that traders should try and make extra profits. That will hinder them in the eyes of the law, the people and government. I should like to emphasize that the ordinary law of the land is sufficient to deal with any antisocial conduct.' "
Prabhupada: They should severe punishment. Then... We shall see.
Bhakti-caru: (Bengali?) "Ninety murders in one district."
Prabhupada: Hm?
Bhakti-caru: Charan Singh (Hindi) "Ninety murders in one district. 'There was a constitutional breakdown in the states,' he said. The chief minister of Maratha states had admitted to him that his government's reach was no longer running the way it had done earlier. He was receiving many complaints from the U.P., Rajasthan, and Haryana. Fifty murders have been committed in one district in Bihar in one week. Mr. Charan Singh's statement, which was preceded by the (indistinct) meeting earlier in the morning, led to a spate of questions. He was asked whether he was going counter to the spirit of the federal structure which permitted different ruling parties and centers and states, whether the ruling party M.P. would be asked to resign if a state..., if the states they came from turned down his party government and whether the central government would not invoke the power of an article which stated by the Constitution despite capitalism in the Janata party election manifesto."
Prabhupada: So what is this yoga? (laughs) Sanjay Gandhi's yoga, just see. A rogue, devil, he is practicing yoga. His mother was practicing also yoga, the same.
Bhakti-caru: They want to pull their youth back.
Prabhupada: Hm?
Bhakti-caru: They are practicing yoga. They want to pull their youth back. (Bengali)
Prabhupada: No Indira Gandhi's news?
Bhakti-caru: (continues to read news articles) No... Indira Gandhi... "Infighting with Civic Congress Party leads to more powers for laborers." "Civil judge regrets motives against magistrates." (reads more headings and newspaper articles) " 'The revolutionary work of eliminating poverty and unemployment in the rural areas can be accomplished by a considerable extent through the khadi and village industries. To achieve these objectives modern technology must be used to rise to the extent possible.' He hopes the new commission would take steps in this direction." (continues reading news articles; Prabhupada is silent)
Prabhupada: Hm. Hm. That's all. [break]
Giriraja: ...lal to meet you. So far, he hasn't shown himself to be too...
Prabhupada: Hm?
Giriraja: So far, he seems to be more preoccupied with his own ideas, so we don't know whether there will be any benefit to this meeting.
Prabhupada: But if he wants to meet, I have no objection. [break] ...and the host was very rich man in anywhere. And he has no son. He expressed his desire to father to take me. This is the position.
Tamala Krsna: Your father would not give you up. He was a sannyasi?
Prabhupada: Another gentleman in Hasi(?)... We were going in the same car. So he requested me, "Please come here." An old man, nice, very well-to-do man. And after giving the nice seat and some refreshment, so he said that "I like you very much. I have no son. Why don't you become my son?"
Tamala Krsna: Seems like everyone is very affectionate to you, Srila Prabhupada.
Prabhupada: Yes, it is Krsna's grace. He picked up on the street like this.
Tamala Krsna: That man?
Prabhupada: Yes. Ne, adopted son, that is a practice.
Tamala Krsna: In America also, they have the foster home. The children are there, and parents may go and adopt some child.
Prabhupada: That is everywhere. So that village gentleman, that place I liked.
Tamala Krsna: Would you have agreed to stay with him?
Prabhupada: I would have been glad. Very nice foodstuff, very nice, clean, and he has got his fresh vegetables, like that.
Tamala Krsna: How old were you?
Prabhupada: At that time I was ten years old. Or twelve years. Not more than twelve years. But I liked that place very much. They still presented the foodstuff, fresh. I have been many... Not many. In the village so tasteful, fresh fruit, fresh vegetables, and they cooked so nicely. Nice milk. Everything very nutritious. That life is gone. What is this nonsense life, hanging in the daily buses, outside. Krsna advises to live village life, agriculture, and utilize time for understanding your spiritual life. That is... So we are trying to introduce this, this farm life. [break] Out of so many other living entities, he tried to give me trouble. How you can check?
Prabhupada: So therefore a Krsna conscious person, they know the body is the cause of... "Because I have got this body, I am suffering. Therefore partial service to the body, what benefit?" That is... That requires very good brain. Today I have got eye trouble. Tomorrow I have got leg trouble. The other day I have got hand trouble. But the... (end)

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