Madhavananda: (reading:) "Chapter Four. Devotional Service Surpasses All Liberation. How much a devotee is seriously attached to the devotional service of the Supreme Personality of Godhead can be understood from the statement of Maharaja Prthu (Adi-raja), which is described in Srimad-Bhagavatam, Fourth Canto, Twentieth Chapter, 21st verse. He prays to the Supreme Personality of Godhead thusly: 'My dear Lord, if, after taking liberation, I have no chance of hearing the glories of Your Lordship, glories chanted by pure devotees from the core of their hearts in praise of Your lotus feet, and if I have no chance for this honey of transcendental bliss, then I shall never ask for liberation of this so-called spiritual emancipation. I shall simply always pray unto Your Lordship that You may give me millions of tongues and millions of ears so that I can constantly chant and hear of Your transcendental glories.' "

Prabhupada: Surpasses all kind of liberation. There are five kinds of liberation: sayujya, sarupya, salokya, samipya. But a pure devotee does not want any of such liberations. Dhiyamanam na ghrnanti (?). Even liberation is offered. Krsna offers liberation very easily. But Krsna's personal touch is so sublime that Krsna is carrying order of Maharaja Yudhisthira. Maharaja Yudhisthira is sending letter, handed over to Krsna, and He's carrying to Duryodhana. So Narada was very much surprised that this stage of dependent on devotee is very, very difficult to achieve. To achieve liberation is not very difficult, but when Krsna becomes dependent on the order of a devotee, that is very difficult to achieve. So therefore pure devotional service surpasses all kinds of liberation. Caitanya Mahaprabhu also teaches, mama janmani janmanisvare bhavatad bhaktir ahaituki tvayi. Liberation means no more birth. But Caitanya Mahaprabhu says, mama janmani janmani. Birth after birth. But the, a devotee does not want anything of the material things. Na dhanam na janam na sundarim kavitam va jagadisa kamaye [Cc. Antya 20.29, Siksastaka 4]. So this pure devotional service is a different subject matter. Dharmah projjhita-kaitavo atra [SB 1.1.2]. Therefore Vyasadeva says that all kinds of motivated religious system is rejected from devotional service. Projjhita-kaitavah. Kaitava means motivated. In devotional service, there is no motivesimply to serve Krsna. Anukulyena krsnanu-silanam [Cc. Madhya 19.167]. That is pure devotional service. Go on.

Madhavananda: "The impersonalists desire to merge into the existence of the Supreme, but without keeping their individuality, they have no chance of hearing and chanting the glories of the Supreme Lord. Because they have no idea of the transcendental form of the Supreme Lord, there is no chance of their chanting and hearing of His transcendental activities."

Prabhupada: The impersonalists take it, this chanting, as means to attain liberation. They do not know that the chanting is the, real chanting begins after liberation. Not that by chanting one reaches liberation. No. That's not a fact. Satatam kirtayanto mam yatantas ca drdha-vratah [Bg. 9.14]. Satatam. Satatam means after liberation also. This chanting will continue after liberation also. Not that after liberation chanting will finish. In the Bhagavad-gita it is said, satatam. Satatam means after liberation also. Before liberation and after liberation. Therefore it is nitya. Nitya means it does not stop, never stops. Satatam kirtayananto mam yatantas ca, tusyanti ca ramanti ca. Drdha-vratah. So the, when you actually go to Goloka Vrndavana, the same chanting will go on before Krsna. Chanting will never stop. Go on.

Madhavananda: "In other words, unless one is already beyond liberation, one cannot relish the transcendental glories of the Lord, nor can one understand the transcendental form of the Lord.

Prabhupada: This Maharaja Bharata was the son of Rsabhadeva and under whose name, after whose name this planet is called Bharata-varsa. This, the same Bharata Maharaja, he left this world at very young age, twenty-four years. Young wife, children, kingdom, everything he left. Then he developed some attachment for a young deer. So he had to take the birth in the shape of a deer. The next birth he remained silent, Jada Bharata. So (the) Jada Bharata story is there in the Srimad-Bhagavatam. Very enlightening. Go on.

Madhavananda: "In the Bhagavatam, Sixth Canto, Eleventh Chapter, 23rd verse, there is a similar statement by Vrtrasura, who addresses the Lord as follows: 'My dear Lord, by leaving Your transcendental service I...' "

Prabhupada: Just see. Bhakti-rasamrta-sindhu, Rupa Gosvami, he's presenting this Bhakti-rasamrta-sindhu, quoting from so many scriptures. Nana-sastra-vicaranaika-nipunau. They were very, very expert in studying sastra very scrutinizingly. Nana-sastra-vicaranaika-nipunau sad-dharma-samsthapakau. Why they studied so much? Because they wanted to establish sad-dharma, real type of religion, bhakti. They are quoting, therefore, from so many, nana-sastra. Nana-sastra-vicaranaika-nipunau sad-dharma-samsthapakau lokanam hita-karinau. That is welfare activity. Lokanam hita-karinau. These people are trying to give some service to the daridra-narayana, but they do not know actually what is jive daya (?). This is jive daya. Lokanam hita-karinau. They should know things with reference to the authorized scripture. Not that I manufacture some words, according to my whims. That is not service to the hu... That is misleading, disservice. Because, if they are kept in ignorance, what is the value of such service. Here is (service). He does not manufacture anything. He's giving immediately evidence, reference to the authorized scripture. That is the way of presenting things. Not that "I think," "In my opinion." What you are? But in, in Vaisnava philosophy, even Caitanya Mahaprabhu, although He was Krsna Himself, whenever He spoke something, immediately He gave evidence from the sastra. Even Krsna. While He was speaking Bhagavad-gita, He also gave reference to the Vedanta-sutra: brahma-sutra-padais caiva hetumadbhir viniscitaih [Bg. 13.5]. He was giving reference to the Brahma-sutra. That is the way of authorized presentation. Krsna is Supreme Personality of Godhead, but He was also giving reference. He also said, yah sastra-vidhim utsrjya vartate kama-karatah [Bg. 16.23]. We cannot give up sastras. If we give up sastra, then Krsna says, sa siddhim savapnoti na sukham na param gatim. If we give up sastra, if we manufacture our own words, own sastras, these are all rascaldom. That should not be accepted. So here you see Rupa Gosvami's writing. The sloka, number, Canto, everything is given. Nana-sastra-vicaranaika-nipunau. Go on.

Madhavananda: " 'My dear Lord, by leaving Your transcendental service I may be promoted to the planet called Dhruva-loka (the polestar), or I may gain lordship over all the planetary systems of the universe. But I do not aspire to this. Nor do I wish the mystic perfections of yoga practice, nor do I aspire for spiritual emancipation. All I wish for, my Lord, is Your association and transcendental service eternally.'

Madhavananda: "There is a similar statement by Indra, the King of heaven, in Srimad-Bhagavatam, Sixth Canto, Eighteenth Chapter, 52nd verse. There Indra addresses his mother in this manner: 'My dear Mother (Aditi), persons who have given up all kinds of desire and are simply engaged in devotional service to the Lord know what is actually their self-interest. Such persons are actually serving their self-interests and are considered first-class experts in the matter of advancing to the perfectional stage of life.' "

Prabhupada: That is... Everyone is after his self-interest, but real self-interest is to approach Visnu. Om tad visnoh paramam padam sada pasyanti surayah. And in the Bhagavata it is said: na te viduh svartha-gatim hi visnum [SB 7.5.31]. Svartha-gati. Our real self-interest is in Visnu. They do not know. Bahir-artha-maninah. Durasaya. Bahir-artha-maninah. So one who has fixed up to render service to Visnu, Krsna... Visnur aradhyate pumsam nanyat tat-tosa-karanam. So this is the ultimate goal of life, to approach Visnu. And the origin of Visnu is Krsna. Aham sarvasya prabhavah [Bg. 10.8], Krsna says. Therefore He's origin of Visnu, Lord Visnu, Lord Brahma, Lord Siva. Sarvasya. Aham adir hi devanam [Bg 10.2]. Devanam begins... The devas, demigods, begins from Brahma, Visnu, Mahesvara, then other demigods. So Krsna says, aham adir hi devanam. Go on.

Madhavananda: "In the Seventh Canto of the Bhagavatam, Sixth Chapter, 23rd verse, Maharaja Prahlada says, 'My dear friends who are born into atheistic families, if you can please the Supreme Personality of Godhead, Krsna, then there is nothing more rare in this world. In other words, if the Supreme Lord Krsna is pleased with you, then any desire that you may have within the core of your heart can be fulfilled without any doubt. As such, what is the use of elevating yourself by the results of fruitive activities, which are automatically achieved in all events by the modes of material nature?' "

Prabhupada: Yes. In the sastra it is said:

Madhavananda: " 'And what is the use for you of spiritual emancipation or liberation from material bondage? If you are always engaged in chanting the glories of the Supreme Lord and always relishing the nectar of the lotus feet of the Lord, then there is no necessity for any of these.' By this statement of Prahlada Maharaja it is clearly understood that one who takes pleasure in chanting and hearing the transcendental glories of the Lord has already surpassed all kinds of material benediction, including the results of pious activities, pious fruitive activities, sacrifices and even liberation from material bondage.

Prabhupada: Go on.

Madhavananda: "The purport of this statement by Indra is that, beginning from Brahma down to the insignificant ant, no living entities are meant for enjoying the material opulences. They are simply meant for offering everything to the supreme proprietor, the Personality of Godhead. By doing so, they automatically enjoy the benefit. The example can be cited again of the different parts of the body collecting foodstuffs and cooking them so that ultimately a meal may be offered to the stomach. After it has gone to the stomach, all the parts of the bodies..., body equally enjoy the benefit of the meal. So similarly everyone's duty is to satisfy the Supreme Lord and then automatically everyone will become satisfied."

Prabhupada: That is called yajna. Yajnarthe karma. Go on.

Madhavananda: "A similar verse is found in the Eighth Canto, Third Chapter, of Srimad-Bhagavatam, verse 20. Gajendra says there, 'My dear Lord, I have no experience in the transcendental bliss derived from Your devotional service, so therefore I have asked from You some favor. But I know that persons who are pure devotees and have, by serving the lotus feet of great souls, become freed from all material desires, are always merged in the ocean of transcendental bliss and, as such, are always satisfied simply by glorifying Your auspicious characteristics. For them there is nothing else to aspire to or pray for.'

Prabhupada: This was spoken by the naga-patni when Kaliya was being punished by Lord Krsna, kicking over his head. So this prayer was offered, that "For Your dust of Your lotus feet, so many great sages are hankering after, and they do not care for even liberation, simply to get Your, that dust of the lotus feet. We do not know how much this fortunate snake is, that he's automatically getting the dust. You are kicking on his head. We do not know what did he do in his previous life that he's so fortunate."