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Pandal Speech and Question Session

Delhi, November 10, 1973
Prabhupada: Mr. High Commissioner and Ladies and Gentlemen, I thank you very much for your coming here, taking so much trouble, to participate in this Krsna consciousness movement. And I shall simply try to draw your attention about the importance of this movement. Importance of this movement is this, that we do not know what is the aim of life. The modern civilization, all over the world, especially in the Western worldnobody knows what is the actual problem and what is the aim of life. That is explained in the Bhagavad-gita. The Bhagavad-gita says, "The real problem is janma-mrtyu-jara-vyadhi-duhkha-dosanudarsanam [Bg. 13.9], that birth, death, old age and disease, these are the problems." If you take birth, then you will have to die. Anyone who takes birth, he must have to die. And so long, between birth and death, there is old age and disease. Actually, these are the problems. So far we are concerned, living entities, every one of us, that is described in the Bhagavad-gita. Na jayate na mriyate va kadacit: "The living entity is never born, never dies." Nityah sasvato 'yam purano na hanyate hanyamane sarire: [Bg. 2.20] "The living entity is eternal, ever-existing and very old, and," na hanyate hanyamane sarire, "it does not die after the annihilation of this body." But the modern civilization, they are thinking that "This body we have got somehow or other, a lump of matter, and so long we have got this body, let us enjoy life, sense gratification." This is atheistic theory.
In our country there were atheists also. Just like Carvaka Muni. According to his philosophy, he says, rnam krtva ghrtam pibet. Because in our country, India, life is enjoyable when we get to eat too much ghee. You see, pakhika anna (?). That is enjoyment. Just like in Western countries, if they can eat, they can drink more, that is life's enjoyment. In our country, of course. So rnam krtva ghrtam pibet. If somebody says that "I have no money," so Carvaka Muni says that "You take loan from your friend and purchase ghee and enjoy life." Rnam krtva ghrtam pibet yavaj jivet sukham jivet. "So long you will live, live happily. Why... Make beg, borrow, steal and live happily." "No. I shall be responsible. I shall have to pay next life." Carvaka Muni says, "No, no. Don't bother about next life." Bhasmi-bhutasya dehasya kuto punar agamano bhavet: "Your body will be burned in the crematorium. That finished. That's all." This foolishness is there, that this life... We do not know that this human form of life we have got by the evolutionary process, going through so many lives. Just like in our present life we can understand that I have come to this body, old body, through child's body, boy's body, youth's body, in this way. That is explained in the Bhagavad-gita. It is not manufactured.
dehino 'smin yatha dehe
kaumara yauvanam jara
tatha dehantara-praptir
dhiras tatra na muhyati
[Bg. 2.13]
You have to accept this, dehantara-prapti, from one body to another. Where is my childhood body? That is gone. Where is my boyhood body? That is gone. Where is my youthhood body? That is gone. Not only for me, for everyone. There is past, present and future. Similarly, when this body will be gone, I will get another body. Where is the difficulty to understand? Tatha dehantara-praptir dhiras tatra na muhyati [Bg. 2.13]. Dhira. Because we are not sober... There are two classes of men: dhira and adhira. Dhira means sober, thinking, thoughtful, and adhira means restless. So with restless brain, it is difficult, but if you have got sober brain, then there is no difficulty to understand that "I am eternal. I was in the child's body, I was in the baby's body, I was in the boy's body, I was in a young man's body. Now I have got a different body. I am living asmin dehe." Dehino 'smin yatha dehe [Bg. 2.13]. It is very easy to understand, but Krsna says, dhiras tatra na muhyati: "Those who are sober, they can understand."
So people cannot understand. That means the modern civilization is not sober. It is just like cats and dogs. You cannot make a cat and dog sober to understand the philosophy of life. They have degraded so much. That is described in the sastra. Yasyatma-buddhih kunape tri-dhatuke [SB 10.84.13]. Atma-buddhih, thinking "I am this body." "I am American," "I am Indian," "I am brahmana," "I am black," "I am white," "I am fat," "I am thin," "I am this." No, no. You are not this body at all. That is knowledge. That is knowledge. Knowledge begins when you understand that you are not this body. That is the beginning of knowledge. Otherwise, "I am this body," this knowledge is there in the cats and dogs also. The dog also jumping, because he is thinking, "I am very nice dog," or "Nice cat." So sastra therefore says, yasyatma-buddhih kunape tri-dhatuke [SB 10.84.13]. This body is a bag of three elementskapha, pitta, vayuaccording to Ayurveda system. This physiological condition, anatomical condition of this body, is made of kapha, pitta, vayu. So it is a bag of kapha, pitta, vayu, or flesh, bones, blood, urine, stool, and mucus. If you dissect this body, you will find. Do you mean to say combination of these things can make a life, so nice brain? If you are so competent, then take these ingredients, bones, flesh. They are easily available in the slaughterhouse. Make a good brain. But that is not possible. They simply speak, but it is not possible. Therefore this body is not the... Moving spirit soul, that is different. Therefore sastra says, yasyatma-buddhih kunape tri-dhatuke sva-dhih kalatradisu bhauma ijya-dhih. And as soon as you take this body, that "I am this body," then, in bodily relation... Because a woman has got bodily relation, "She is my wife," and the children born out of the womb of that woman, "That is my children..." Sva-dhih kalatradisu. Yasyatma-buddhih kunape tri-dhatuke sva-dhih kalatradisu bhauma ijya-dhih [SB 10.84.13]. Bhauma means the land where we live or where this body is produced. That is worshipable. That is called nationalism. Bhauma ijya-dhih. Yasyatma-buddhih kunape tri-dhatuke sva-dhih kalatradisu bhauma ijya-dhih, yat-tirtha-buddhih salile na karhicit. And tirtha, holy place... Just like people go to Vrndavana, Hardwar. Salile. They take birth in the Ganges and the Yamuna, and they think that "Now we have finished our tirtha." No. Tirtha is not that. Tirtha means we have to find out sober person to take instruction from him. So people who are not interested to the sober man and lives like this, that "I am this body, and the bodily production or relation, they are my own men, and if I go to holy place, take bath and then come back..." No. Sastra says, "No." Yat-tirtha-buddhih salile na karhicij janesu abhijnesu. You must approach abhijnah person. That is the meaning of pilgrimage. As the Vedas says, tad-vijnanartham sa gurum eva abhigacchet, srotriyam brahma-nistham [MU 1.2.12]. You must find out a sober man or guru so that he can instruct you, he can deliver you from ignorance of life.
So you'll find in this Bhagavad-gita, when there was talks going on between Arjuna and Krsna, friendly talks... Arjuna was speaking, "Let them enjoy this kingdom. I don't want to fight with my own men." That was his decision. Krsna said, "No, no. This is not your duty. You are a ksatriya. Now you are in the battlefield. You must fight." In this way, ordinary topics were going on. But when Arjuna saw it very difficult to understand, "Whether I shall fight or not fight?" he accepted Krsna as guru. Because he thought that "Friendly talks will not make solution. Let me accept Krsna as my..." Sisyas te 'ham sadhi mam prapannam [Bg. 2.7]. Prapannam: "I surrender unto You. You are my guru. Now You are not my friend; You are my guru." Because a disciple cannot disobey the guru. A friend can disobey. Krsna is asking to fight. As a friend, he was disobeying. But if a guru says that "You must fight," then you cannot disobey. Therefore he accepted, sisyas te 'ham sadhi mam prapannam.
So actually we are all in the ignorance. The same formula:
yasyatma-buddhih kunape tri-dhatuke
sva-dhih kalatradisu bhauma idya-dhih
yat-tirtha-buddhih salile na karhicij
janesu abhijnesu sa eva go-kharah
[SB 10.84.13]
Go-kharah. Go means cow and khara means ass. This is the verdict of the sastra, that "If anyone is in the bodily concept of life, he is not better than the animals go and khara, ass and cow." So this ignorance, when this ignorance prevails, that is called dharmasya glanir bhavati bharata. Krsna said, yada yada hi dharmasya glanir bhavati bharata [Bg. 4.7]. When people are become like cats and dogs, the bodily concept of life, and working whole day and night without any spiritual understanding, without the aim of life... So this human life is not meant for that purpose. This is the mistake. It is not that the dogs and cats are eating in a different way. Now we eat in a nice table, in nice plate, and very nicely dressed, and you are eating... But eating process is there. Either you nicely eat or wrongly eat, but you have to fulfill your bell(y) and satisfy your hunger. That is not advancement of civilization. To eat nicely, to sleep nicely, to defend nicely and to have sexual life nicely, that is not advancement of civilization. Ahara-nidra-bhaya-maithunam ca samanyam etat pasubhih naranam. Sexual intercourse with beautiful woman and sexual intercourse with the female dog, the pleasure is the same. That is not advancement of civilization. Advancement of civilization is atma-tattvam. Atma-tattva. That is explained in the Srimad-Bhagavatam. Apasyatam atma-tattvam grhesu grha-medhinam. Srotavyadini rajendra [SB 2.1.2]. Maharaja Pariksit asked Sukadeva Gosvami, "Now I am going to die. What is my duty? What I shall hear from?" So at that time Sukadeva Gosvami said, "My dear King," srotavyadini, nrnam santi sahasrasah, apasyatam atma-tattvam grhesu grha-medhinam [SB 2.1.2], that "Those who are grhamedhi..." Grhamedhi means has made the home, country, society, family as the only means of advancement. They are called grhamedhi. But there is another word, what is called grhastha asrama. Asrama. Brahmacari asrama, grhastha asrama, vanaprastha asrama, sannyasa asrama. Asrama. As soon as... Any common man can understand. As soon as we say asrama, there is some spiritual idea. Asrama. Here is a asrama. So grhastha asrama is different, and grhamedhi is different. Grha-medhi means one who does not know what is the ultimate goal of life and living like... Cats and dogs also, they live with their children, wife. They also find out food. They also try to defend, protect. Simply with these ideas, if we live, that is called grhamedhi. Apasyatam atma-tattvam [SB 2.1.2].
Therefore our Vedanta-sutra is there to give enlightenment. As our student Sriman Pradyumna dasa Adhikari said, athato brahma jijnasa, this life is not meant for wasting time like cats and dog. Because after all, we have to give up this life. But before giving up this life, we must gain something. That is described in the Upanisad. Etad viditva yah prayati sa brahmanah. We'll have to die like cats and dogs, but we have got the chance to understand what is the value of life. The cats and dogs have no chance. So simply if we waste our time like cats and dogs and do not know what is the aim of lifesa krpana. Etad viditva yah prayati, aviditva yah prayati sa krpanah. There are two things: brahmana and krpana. Krpana means miser. A person who got this valuable body... Just like if you get millions of dollars, if you do not utilize it, if you simply see in the treasury that you have got so much money, then you are krpana. It is practical. But if you utilize that money and instead of one crore you make ten crores, then you are called intelligent. Similarly, if we think that "I have got this human form of life, better standard of eating, sleeping and mating," then you remain krpana. You could not utilize it. But if you know in this life, which is possible, "What is the value of this life? What is Brahman? What I am? What is my connection with Brahman? Why I have come here? Where I shall go again? Why I am put into the miserable condition of life? I do not wish to die. Why death is enforced upon me?" this is called brahma-jijnasa, inquiry, "Why?" Therefore there is a Kena Upanisad, "Why?" Unless this "why" inquiry comes in the human body, then he is failure. Parabhavas tavad abodha-jatah yavan na jijnasata atma-tattvam. Whatever we are doing, we are being defeated, because we are doing everything in ignorance. "I am this body." "This is my country." "This is my kinsmen." And in this way I die like cats and dogs.
So Krsna says,
Adharmasya. What is that dharma? Krsna says,
So what is that dharma? Dharma, it is said, dharmam tu saksad bhagavat-pranitam [SB 6.3.19]. Dharma, the simple description of dharma is "the codes which are given by God." It doesn't matter whether you are Hindu, Muslim or Christian or any. Everyone, any civilized man has got some religion. Because dharmena hina pasubhih samanah. If you haven't got no religion... It doesn't matter whether Hindu religion, Muslim religion. You must have some religion. Religion means to understand God. That is religion. Religion does not mean I manufacture something. No. You cannot manufacture religion. Religion means... Just like you cannot manufacture laws. Law is given by the state, by the government. Similarly, religion means the codes, the orders given by God. Therefore you must know what is God, what is His order and how to carry out it. Then you will be success..., your life is successful. Otherwise, just like the cats and dogs, they do not know how to carry out the laws of the state... Of course, they are excused. The "Keep to the right," "Keep to the left," the cats and dogs, they can violate. Law is not meant for the cats and dogs. Law is meant for the human being. Therefore the cats and dogs, if they violate the codes of God, the law of God, they can be excused because they are animals. But a human being, he has got the developed consciousness. If he does not utilize this body for understanding "What is God? What I am? What is my relationship with God? How to act? Wherefrom I have come? Where to go..." There are so many questions. That is called brahma-jijnasa. Athato brahma jijnasa. This life is meant for brahma-jijnasa.
Now, where to jijnasa? That is called Vedic injunction. Tad-vijnanartham sa gurum eva abhigacchet [MU 1.2.12]. Tad-vijnanartham. In order to understand that transcendental science, one must have to go to the bona fide guru. And who is guru? Guru is the Supreme Personality of Godhead, Krsna. And anyone who represents that Supreme Personality of Godhead, he is guru. Guru means representative of God. Therefore according to Vedic sastra, guru is worshiped like God. This is... Just like my disciples, they have given this seat and..., almost equally with God's seat. That is the injunction. Yasya prasadad bhagavat-prasadah **. Guru should be worshiped as God, but guru will never claim that he is God. That is not guru. Guru will always claim that he is servant of God. Because the sisyas worship him as... Sisya... Guru does not say that "You simply worship me." He directs that "You worship God." But because one gets God's connection through guru, therefore guru is worshiped as God. Just like in our country there was viceroy. He was given the same respect as the king because he is representative of..., the royal representative. Similarly, sastra says,
saksad dharitvena samasta-sastrair
uktas tatha bhavyata eva sadbhih
kintu prabhor yah priya eva tasya
vande guroh sri-caranaravindam **
This is the offering obeisance to guru. Guru is described as respectable as the Supreme Personality of God. Acaryam mam vijaniyat [SB 11.17.27]. The Supreme Personality of Godhead says that "Acarya should be accepted as I am. And in the Bhagavad-gita it is said, acaryopasanam. Acaryopasanam. So therefore we have to receive the knowledge in the disciplic succession of acarya. That is also described in the Bhagavad-gita: evam parampara-praptam imam rajarsayo viduh [Bg. 4.2]. Rajarsayah. This knowledge, they were understood by the rajarsi. Rajarsi means king; at the same time, saintly person. Not the king and robber, dasyu-dharma, imply exacting taxes, "Come on, give me tax, and you go to hell." That is not king. That is not government. It is government's duty to make... The government should be Krsna conscious, and it is government's duty to see that everyone is Krsna conscious or God consciousyou say "Krsna" or "God"; it doesn't matter. If you think that "Let the people go to hell. It doesn't matter. Bring taxes and let us enjoy, and you go to hell..." It is very horrible condition.
So everywhere this is going on; therefore there is necessity of awakening this God consciousness of the people. It is not a childish thing or sentimental fanaticism. It is real science. Because this human life is meant for understanding "What I am," aham brahmasmi. "I am not this body; I am spirit soul." Brahma-bhutah prasannatma na socati na kanksati [Bg. 18.54]. If you can educate people to become brahma-bhuta [SB 4.30.20], then prasannatma, he becomes happy, jolly. Just like these American boys, American girls, they were many, many times in better condition of life. Now they are wandering with me. What can I give them? I cannot give them nice food. I cannot give them nice shelter. Neither I have money. They are coming. They are all rich men's sons, but they are after me. Why? Brahma-bhutah prasannatma. They have got something. They are feeling obliged that "Bhaktivedanta Swami has given us something." That is... Therefore they are after me. So this is the Brahma cond..., brahma-bhuta atma. Brahma-bhutah prasannatma. That is the sign. "I have become Brahman. I have become Narayana." No. If you are prasanna, if you are always joyful, then it is to be understood that you have realized Brahman. Brahma-bhutah prasannatma na socati na kanksati. There is no socana. Here in the material world I have got something. If I lose it, I cry, "I have lost, I have lost, I have lost." And if I do not possess, then kanksati, "I must get it. I must." These two businesses are going on. But when you become brahma-bhutah prasannatma, these two things will go away. Na kanksati na socati.
And samah sarvesu bhutesu. Samah sarvesu bhutesu: equally seeing all living entities. Panditah sama-darsinah [Bg. 5.18]. Brahma-bhuta means he is learned scholar, aham brahmasmi, self-realized; therefore he has no such distinction that "Give protection to the human being and send the poor animals to the slaughterhouse. Equality." What equality? What the poor animals have done that you are sending them to the slaughterhouse? Is that civilization, this rubbish civilization, maintaining hundreds and thousands of slaughterhouse? So simply speaking "love," "fraternity..." Where is your fraternity? Where is your love? This cannot be possible. This may be big talks onlybut to be understood by the nonsense. Unless you become brahma-bhuta [SB 4.30.20], self-realized, Krsna conscious, God conscious, these things are only stories. It is not possible. This is the description in the Bhagavad-gita.
Then he becomes a devotee. To become devotee is not so easy thing. Not so easy thing. People think that devotion is a sentiment. No. It is not sentiment. It is a great science. It is a great science to become fully satisfied. Fully satisfied. And Krsna says,
This is the process of santi. Bhoktaram. Krsna is the enjoyer. We are after worshiping Krsna. That is our business. Wherever we go, we install this Krsna Deity and we work for Krsna, we print books for Krsna, we distribute books for Krsna, we beg everyone to become Krsna's bhakta. Therefore it is Krsna consciousness. We have no other business than Krsna. As Krsna says, sarva-dharman parityajya mam ekam saranam vraja [Bg. 18.66]. We are doing that. We have no other business. Simply Krsna. Why? Krsnas tu bhagavan svayam [SB 1.3.28]. He is the Supreme Personality of Godhead. Krsna says in the Bhagavata, mattah parataram nanyat kincid asti dhananjaya: [Bg. 7.7] "I am the Supreme."
Only the learned scholars can worship Krsna. Only the learned scholar, self-realized soul, can understand Bhagavad-gita. Not by the politicians and the so-called scholar. No. It is not possible.
Therefore Krsna consciousness movement is very important movement. We appeal to the sober class, dhira, not the adhira. We also accepting dhira and adhira by the mercy of Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu, by the mercy of the Gosvamis. Dhiradhira. Dhira and adhira. Just like these boys and girls, they were adhira. Now they are dhira. Adhira. Adhira means without any responsibility, doing all nonsense. Actually they are rich nation's sons and daughters. They are doing ev..., but now they have become dhira. "No illicit sex, no meat-eating, no intoxication, no gambling. Yes, sir." This is dhira. You are already intoxicated. You are already illusioned in this material world. If you still go on drinking, where is the possibility of knowledge? You must have sober brain to understand. So this is going on. Therefore my appeal to all the sober men: to understand this Krsna consciousness movement and join it for the benefit of his personal self, for the benefit of his country, for the benefit of the whole human society.
Thank you very much. Hare Krsna. [break]
Prabhupada: Lord Caitanya is Krsna. Krsna said, sarva-dharman parityajya mam ekam saranam vraja [Bg. 18.66]. But people did not take it very seriously. Therefore Krsna came as a devotee in the form of Caitanya Mahaprabhu to teach people how to surrender to Krsna. This is the... Krsna, Lord Caitanya is also Krsna. Krsna as the Supreme Person, He demanded that sarva-dharman parityajya mam ekam saranam vraja, but people did not take it very seriously. Therefore He again came, how to surrender to Krsna. Just like some servant is massaging your legs, but you do not like it. You sometimes take his leg, "You do like this, do like this, do like this." So that master has not become servant, but he's teaching how to massage. Similarly, Caitanya Mahaprabhu is Krsna Himself, but He is teaching rascals like us how to surrender to Krsna. This is the difference.
British man: No. What I'm trying to ask is that if the Vedic scriptures were written about five thousand years ago...
Prabhupada: Yes.
British man: ...then how is it just only five hundred years ago somebody came to impart what was written five thousand years ago?
Prabhupada: Yes. Yada yada hi dharmasya glanir bhavati [Bg. 4.7]. As soon as it becomes too much deteriorated, then Krsna comes Himself or sends His representative to revive Krsna consciousness. It may be five thousand years or five lakhs of years or five days. That doesn't matter. Yada yada hi dharmasya. Whenever there is discrepancy. It doesn't matter. It does not depend on the historical dates. When there is necessity. When there is necessity. Yada yada hi dharmasya glanir bhavati bharata. At that time. So although Krsna consciousness was introduced five thousand years ago by Krsna Himself, but it deteriorated. (end)

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