Audio

Prabhupada: We have already constructed for our residential quarters. That is already there, very big. Such a big building is not there in that district.

Indian man (1): [Transl. Anyone who visits Vrndavana temple…]

Prabhupada: [Transl. Han.]

Indian man: [Transl. …each one of them glorifies it.]

Prabhupada: [Transl. Really?]

Indian man: [Transl. Everyone. There are so many temples in Vrndavana they say.]

Pusta Krsna: Actually, Prabhupada is doing everything. We are simply like puppets. He tells us what to do.

Indian man: [Transl. Whoever saw it.]

Pusta Krsna: Transcendental management.

Indian man (2): Srila Prabhupada? The temple in Bombay, what you are constructing, the gate only going to be like another Indian temples, only gates. They look like a bigger temple.

Dr. Patel: You mean those pitchers and flag? In south we have got those temples, gates. That is only common in southern India but not in anywhere else. Gopurams: ornamental gateway of a temple.

Prabhupada: Gopurams.

Dr. Patel: Gopurams are not found anywhere else.

Indian man (2): Srila Prabhupada…

Prabhupada: [Transl. No, you have got it in Bombay. Fanaswadi.]

Indian man: Fanaswadi.

Dr. Patel: Gopuram?

Indian man: [Transl. But that is not so big.]

Prabhupada: [Transl. There is one in Vrndavana.] Raṅganatha temple.

Dr. Patel: Raṅganatha temple is in Vrndavana or in south?

Prabhupada: No, original, south. Here in Vrndavana also there is...

Dr. Patel: Raṅganatha was the temple where this, I mean, Ramanujacarya lived there. That is Sri Raṅgapuram. [break]

Prabhupada: Not at all. It is a business.

Dr. Patel: People give them money.

Prabhupada: No, no, that money is utilized for business. They are so businessman that people go and sacrifice their hair, and they are selling.

Dr. Patel: That I know. They are selling hair to foreign countries. Selling hair.

Prabhupada: And they are investing money for so many business, not for preaching Krsna consciousness.

Dr. Patel: No, they're establishing colleges and Sanskrit...

Prabhupada: But college... College is not Krsna consciousness.

Dr. Patel: Sanskrit Vidyalaya and Vedic institutions. They have one or two.

Indian (3): [Transl. They have college. They constructed airport, and spend a lot of money for other things. But to have darsana you have to buy ticket. What is this?]

Dr. Patel: It is very difficult. You have gone for darsana? That side?

Prabhupada: They made special arrangement for me. That is another case.

Dr. Patel: Otherwise for common people, it is very difficult. You would reach, you would reach might be after twelve hours or thirteen hours. The huge crowd in a queue.

Indian man (1): You have to pay money to see the Lord. One man was waiting in a queue for four hours. Did not see. And he came back.

Dr. Patel: They take the fee. They take the fees for going.

Indian man (1): Fee, and then...

Pusta Krsna: In some places, even if you have money, you cannot see, like Jagannatha.

Dr. Patel: They are fools, sir. You can go. I think one day I will have to go with them and fight out the whole case. These boys should be allowed. They follow the sanatana-dharma. And again in... I mean, now the government has put the regulations that all the temples are open to all, anybody and everybody. How can they refuse? Who are at that matha, Jagannatha? Those people, they must be from Calcutta.

Prabhupada: Local men.

Dr. Patel: Local. All the big temples in India have got management committees, practically people from various parts. Now our Jagannatha Puri, I mean, this, our Dvaraka temple is managed by people from Bombay-Bombay, Delhi and many other places. So they must have all [indistinct].

Pusta Krsna: Even one of our Indian men they stopped. Caitya-guru told me that when he went there they thought he was Westerner. They wouldn't let him in the second time he tried to go in.

Dr. Patel: This gentleman is coming before the judge of the Bombay high court.

Gurudasa: We can see the cakra on the top.

Prabhupada: Eh?

Gurudasa: We can see the cakra on the top. It is the same. [break]

Dr. Patel: No, no, no, don't. It should have been taken out, not here but there. That was not for, but that was the government of India wanted to construct an office for customs here, and we objected, that "You can't do it in the sea area where we have to..., on the beach." So they broke it down. You know that small... It will not be. It will be very good practice.

Prabhupada: It can continue. It can continue.

Dr. Patel: Any man can come down there and just stay for pleasure. Because this temple. allow them like that.

Prabhupada: No, no. Nobody can stay without following our rules and regulations. That is not our...

Dr. Patel: Externally they may follow. They may be people, out of difficulty... [Transl. All right. We have come here now. Let us enjoy.]

Pusta Krsna: Everyone is in difficulty.

Prabhupada: It will be an institution for teaching spiritual life. So if he does not take the teaching, then it is not...

Dr. Patel: One thing, you must have a Sanskrit school.

Prabhupada: That we can have. Sanskrit is already there in the books.

Dr. Patel: And then let them have a factual teaching of Bhagavad-gita and Srimad-Bhagavatam, Sanskrit.

Prabhupada: Now every gentleman knows English, so we have explained everything in English. There is no difficulty.

Dr. Patel: That is right, sir. But when you see, I mean, study a thing in English and study in original language, you...

Prabhupada: Original language? Nobody can read Sanskrit nowadays. Even the Sanskrit panditas, they also cannot read. I have tried it.

[break] It does not depend on understanding language.

Dr. Patel: That's right.

Prabhupada: Hearing. One who has heard, given aural reception nicely, he is perfect knowledge. Therefore our Vedas are known as sruti. You have to learn it by hearing, not by studying.

Dr. Patel: In bhakti also, sravanam is first.

Prabhupada: Yes. Sravanam kirtanam visnoh smaranam pada-sevanam [SB 7.5.23]. Janiya suniya visa khainu. Anyone who is not taking seriously to Krsna consciousness, he is purposefully committing suicide. It is not a sentiment; it is a scientific movement. But they do not care to understand. Therefore, purposefully they are committing suicide. Janiya suniya visa khainu, very appropriate word: "I have drunk poison knowingly."

[aside:] We shall return now?

Pusta Krsna: Yes.

Prabhupada: Hari hari biphale, janama goṅainu. Jaya. "I am free. What can I...? Whatever I like, I can do," without knowing, prakrteh kriyamanani gunaih karmani sarvasah [Bg 3.27].

Dr. Patel: Ahaṅkara-vimudhatma kartaham iti manyate.

Prabhupada: Ahaṅkara. "Ah, what is Krsna consciousness? I can do without."

Dr. Patel: Once a man is free of ahaṅkara, then he is soul. It is ahaṅkara which creates all disturbances.

Prabhupada: No, ahaṅkara there will be, but ahaṅkara-vimudhatma, thinking falsely something, that "I am this body." Therefore he's vimudha. He is animal. Ahaṅkara is there, "I am Brahman, spirit soul." But he is thinking, "I am Indian," "I am American," "I am dog," "I am cat." Vimudhatma. And this first principle of knowledge they cannot understand. Mudha. Mudho 'yam nabhijanati mam eka param avyayam [Bg 7.25].

Dr. Patel: That is one vaisnava-acarya has written Hrdatmanam brahma rupam: [meditate on Brahma within one's heart.] [break]

Prabhupada: Man-mana. That is the only way.

Dr. Patel: That is ananya-bhakti.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Dr. Patel: Para-bhakti.

Prabhupada: Man-mana bhava mad-bhaktah [Bg 9.34]: "To become My devotee means you shall think of Me twenty-four hours," man-mana. Then you become a bhakta. Not that meditation-I meditate fifteen minutes, and twenty-four hours thinking of something else.

Dr. Patel: Then you never, I mean, that even for, it is just like you, even for a moment you slip down, just like a [indistinct]. It should be perpetual conscious within yourself. It is so very difficult.

Prabhupada: I have seen Gandhi's prayer meeting, and I attended. Utmost, five minutes reading Bhagavad-gita, then again politics immediately. Immediately politics. I was in Delhi. I attended the meeting when Noakhali affairs. So this was his prayer. I have seen. And as a result of this, in that prayer meeting he was killed. [Transl. Not even this that sit down and do some kirtan. Doesn't do that even. Then why shouldn't that happened to him? So nature must give him punishment that this fellow does not listen to anybody. He must be shot dead. This is what happens.] The last stage of Kali-yuga means you die.

Dr. Patel: But the way that modern civilized nations are exploiting the resources of the world, another fifty years there will be no resources left, and civilization automatically will die out.

Prabhupada: Wars. The occasional war, pestilence, famine, that's all.

Dr. Patel: Even there is no war, sir, or no pestilence, the population... And the inundation of the resources...

Prabhupada: There will be war. Because you are dissatisfied, I am dissatisfied, on some little provocation we fight. Nobody is happy. I have seen in Allahabad, little provocation, two brothers fought so much, one brother was killed immediately.

Dr. Patel: These people have got not much intelligence.

Prabhupada: Then, when he was ordered to be hanged, his father appealed that "I am the father. One son I have already lost. If he is hanged, then my... You hang me, my lord." Then he excused him hanging, but twelve years... Upon the father's appeal. I have seen it.

Dr. Patel: They are very hot-headed people.

Prabhupada: No, no, they were Bengalis.

Dr. Patel: Bengalis are very... May I tell you sir, one thing? Bengalis are highly, what do we call...

Prabhupada: Sentimental.

Dr. Patel: Abhimani. [Transl. "I am something." The Bengalis have so much pride.] Even

Prabhupada: No, no. Everyone is abhimani, more or less.

Dr. Patel: No, but they are more than others. [laughs] I think I am not wrong.

Prabhupada: No, no. Yasyatma-buddhih kunape tri-dhatu... [SB 10.84.13] [Transl. All those who accept the body as self, they are all proud. They only say like "I am the honourable judge, I am minister, I am something and so on." And others say "I am God."]

Dr. Patel: You are pleading their case, the Bengalis. [laughs]

Prabhupada: No, no, I mean to say they are little abhimani, but what kind of abhimana this is, that "I am God"? Just see how foolish it is. [Transl. It is within everyone.] [greets someone] Hare Krsna. How are you? [break]

Indian man: Hare Krsna. Okay. You are all right? Very glad to meet you. Thank you. Namaskara.

Dr. Patel: This man is seventy-one years old. He is very wise man.

Indian man: [indistinct]

Dr. Patel: Seventy-one years.

Prabhupada: [indistinct] Jaya.

Dr. Patel: Seventy-one years. [break] I am a little pious man about, you know. The pleasure which I get in reading something...

Prabhupada: No, no, you can get, but other, mostly ninety-nine per cent, they do not know Sanskrit, and if you ask them to learn Sanskrit and then read Bhagavad-gita...

Dr. Patel: No, no, no. I said teach Sanskrit through Bhagavad-gita.

Prabhupada: Oh, that we are doing.

Dr. Patel: That is what I said.

Prabhupada: That we are doing. We give each word's meaning. Each word of any Sanskrit sloka, we give the meaning. That is right.

Dr. Patel: Along with that you give them Sanskrit grammar and derivates. Then that knowledge increases itself. That is the way I learned my Sanskrit. I mean, a student of science, we don't have any...

Prabhupada: If one is serious to learn, he can learn. There is no difficulty.

Dr. Patel: I can now directly read Bhagavad-gita.

Prabhupada: No. Dharma-ksetre kuru-ksetre [Bg 1.1]. Now, if he inquires, "The word is dharma-ksetra. Why it is written ksetre?" then it is grammar.

Dr. Patel: That is what I say. That is the way I learned.

Prabhupada: So that, if he likes, he can learn it. Saptami, adhikarana saptami, sthana, ksetra, ksetre, dharma-ksetre. If he simply tries to learn the nominative case, the objective case, or like that, then he'll learn.

Dr. Patel: Visnave mayi atmani, like that. All three things in different way.

Prabhupada: Sanjaya uvaca. It is nominative case. Dharma-ksetre kuru-ksetre samavetah [Bg 1.1], this is plural number; yuyutsavah, plural number. Mamakah pandavas caiva. Pandavah is plural number, and when it is added with ca it becomes sca. The visarga... In this way he can learn. Eva, again sandhi. Mamakah pandavas ca eva.

Dr. Patel: My meaning was that. Simply my idea was that he can learn in that way.

Prabhupada: Yes. So any serious student, he can learn at home. It is not very difficult. And after studying one or two or a dozen sentences like that, automatically, yes, he learns sandhi, he learns verb, he learns subject, object, everything.

Dr. Patel: And he must make the fundamental source. Phoenetic. [break]

Prabhupada: ...no time. Otherwise I would have made Bhagavad-gita grammar. Yes.

Dr. Patel: That is what I really meant when I say that...

Prabhupada: You can do that. You can do that. People will read it, Bhagavad-gita grammar. On the Bhagavad-gita teach them grammar. Just like Jiva Gosvami compiled Hari-namamrta-vyakarana. Similarly, you write. You have got both the knowledge, Sanskrit, and through English, Bhagavad-gita grammar. People will take it. I have no time; otherwise I have done it. Simply nominative case, objective case, sabda-rupa. Jayapataka's plan is prepared or not?

Saurabha: We are going to do that today, Srila Prabhupada. [break]

Dr. Patel: Acarah paramo dharma. [Auspicious sayings]

Prabhupada: [Transl. The chanting of the holy name is topmost. To rise in the morning and chant the holy name of the Lord-this much can be taught.]

Indian man: [Transl. Nobody teaches.]

Prabhupada: [Transl. They don't know even.]

Dr. Patel: That is taught by the mother. Sanatana-dharma is prepared by the mothers. But the modern mothers are lipsticks mothers. So you don't require.

Prabhupada: They are killing their children. In the Western countries the mothers are killing children, advising girls, daughters, "Oh, you are pregnant? Kill."

Dr. Patel: [Transl. There is no sense in it. Rama, the only protector.]

Indian man: [Transl. So many houses.]

Prabhupada: [Transl. Many houses.]

Indian man: [Transl. Many more buildings will come up. This place will be very pleasant.]

Dr. Patel: Are you tempting me? You are living there?

Indian man: There is lots of space around. [end]