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771013rc.vrn
(visit with Prabhupada's Godbrothers, Bengali)
Prabhupada: (Bengali) And Doctor Stillson, what he has called me? Name? Carmons... What is called?
Prabhupada: It is a common word. (Bengali) I begins with c-h. Spiritual master.
Prabhupada: Yes. Thank you very much for your coming.
Prabhupada: Yes. (laughs) What is the meaning, that?
Prabhupada: (Bengali) "Charismatic spiritual master." (Bengali) You have got that book?
Prabhupada: Yes.
Prabhupada: (Bengali) What is that? What is the name of Doctor Stillson's book?
Jayadvaita: J. Stillson Judah.
Prabhupada: No, no. What is name of the book?
Jayadvaita: Oh. Hare Krsna and the Counterculture. He's librarian of the Graduate Theological Union in Berkeley, California. And he's professor of anthropology also.
Prabhupada: Soviet country, why don't you read...? Where is our Harikesa?
Guest (1): In Russia. (laughs)
Prabhupada: Where is Harikesa? (Bengali) Why these books you do not keep with us?
Tamala Krsna: There was a copy here also, and I don't see it now. There was a copy on these shelves.
Prabhupada: Where is Kirtanananda Swami? (Bengali)...New Vrindaban scheme... (Bengali)
Hari-sauri: This is a palace that they're building in our New Vrindaban farm community. This is built by our own men. This is not complete yet, but it's being built, the dome. Kirtanananda Swami is in charge. These are the devotees. Everything is being made by our men. They learned how to cast concrete, how to make these pillars, archways. This marble laying is all done by our men. They came here and learned, and they have a marble shop. This is the kirtana hall inside. This is on the walls. Here's the floor. This is onyx and marble together. This is pressed concrete, sculptured. This is a support piece, little decorative. This is a guesthouse that was built by the devotees. This is another new building they're building now, and this is present installation and silos for storing cow fodder. You want to sit up, Srila Prabhupada?
Prabhupada: I can sit down for some...
Tamala Krsna: Srila Prabhupada? Ramesvara Maharaja wanted to show you some very nice things from the BBT, I think your Godbrothers would also be interested to see.
Prabhupada: Bring him.
Ramesvara: Srila Prabhupada, these are pictures of the new paintings for Tenth Canto, Volume Two.
Prabhupada: Bring some prasadam for these men.
Prabhupada: First of all you...
Hari-sauri: These paintings are done in Los Angeles for Prabhupada's books. This is from Second Volume of Tenth Canto.
Ramesvara: This one is Krsna kicking the cart. Sakatasura. Krsna and the demon coming from the cart.
Kirtanananda: (laughter) They're wonderful, Prabhupada.
Ramesvara: This one is Krsna and Balarama in the cowshed of Nanda Maharaja for the name-giving ceremony. And Gargamuni is there. This one is Narada Muni cursing the two demigods for sporting naked and drinking. This is Krsna killing the giant witch Putana. Krsna is very small on her chest.
Kirtanananda: Wonderful.
Prabhupada: The Shah of Iran (Bengali) some connection (Bengali) Parivrajakacarya (Bengali)...
Ramesvara: This painting is mother Yasoda chasing Krsna with a stick because He is stealing butter. (Godbrothers are laughing, saying "Oh" and "Hm" at each picture) This painting is the fruit vendor, aborigine, giving Krsna all the fruits, and He is turning her basket of fruits into jewels.
Ramesvara: We showed this painting to the princess and told her that if you give something to Krsna, He returns it millions of times. (laughter) She liked this. This is the cowherd boys sporting in the mouth of Aghasura.
Prabhupada: Very nice.
Ramesvara: This is Krsna eating dirt, and the boys are telling mother Yasoda. So she is forcing Him to open His mouth, and she sees the whole universe.
Ramesvara: This painting shows Krsna about to bifurcate the Bakasura demon. This is Krsna's first birthday, Janmastami, and mother Yasoda and Rohini are bathing Krsna, abhiseka. This painting is Krsna eating butter. (laughter) These are fourteen new paintings for one book. These are the first pictures from the Fiji temple opening. Yasoda-nandana is performing the abhiseka for the small Radha-Krsna. They have so many metal bowls with different...
Prabhupada: Fiji Island. (Bengali)
Guest (1): Fiji Island.
Hari-sauri: This is Gaura-Nitai here, and Krsna-Kaliya is here at the front. This man here is that Bhaskaranya Swami, the local man. He came and chanted during the abhiseka. He stayed up until two in the morning with us, and he began chanting japa after that.
Ramesvara: This was the procession on the opening day. We marched the Radha-Krsna Deities all over the neighborhood, through the center of the town, and hundreds of people followed. There was a shenai band.
Prabhupada: Oh, yes.
Hari-sauri: Yes. They had a question in Fiji. They wanted to know whether He should be dressed simply or opulently.
Ramesvara: This is Krsna's birthday cake for Janmastami in Los Angeles.
Ramesvara: This cake weighs 2,000 pounds.
Ramesvara: It is very tall.
Ramesvara: And each one of these different towers spins on motor for special effects. (laughter)
Ramesvara: After it is finished spinning. It's a cheesecake, very nice cake.
Ramesvara: Yes. This is another picture of this cake.
Tamala Krsna: That is amazing. The guests were eating big handfuls of cake prasadam, Srila Prabhupada. Was there enough for everyone?
Jayadvaita: Oh, yes.
Ramesvara: It lasts for one month, the supply. (laughter) This is another picture of the Janmastami in Los Angeles. The whole street is closed by the city, and we build a stage in front of the temple, and Sudama's men were performing Ramayana and Krsna-lila, and there were rugs in the street for people to sit on and under the pandal on the grass and they were watching. About five thousand people came.
Ramesvara: This is the Deities clothes, on Janmastami.
Ramesvara: These were the nightclothes offered on Janmastami to the Deities.
Prabhupada: See that it does not touch...
Ramesvara: This was a flower outfit offered on Janmastami. They had three outfits.
Tamala Krsna: Three different sets of clothing, all new, were offered to the Deities on Janmastami. And this one is made completely of flowers.
Prabhupada: I have given them the philosophy of "American money and Indian culture." Combined together, the face of the world will...
Prabhupada: Don't keep Indian culture airtight, and don't keep American money for sense gratification. Use it for Krsna. So they are doing that. And Krsna is giving them intelligence. Buddhi-yogam dadami tam.
Ramesvara: These are the new clothes for Radhastami.
Prabhupada: Any respectable Indian who goes to our temple, and they give us as they want. There is no such temple in India.
Ramesvara: These were the new clothes for Balarama's Appearance Day.
Guest (2): (Bengali)
Prabhupada: (Bengali)
Ramesvara: This is a picture of some of your books, Srila Prabhupada. It shows what all the Bhagavatams, First, Second, Third, Fourth, Fifth, Sixth, Seventh, Eighth, and Ninth Cantos look like on the shelf. Not all of them are there, but it shows the colors.
Ramesvara: There is not one bookshelf big enough. And here these are different Bhagavad-gitas: English, Japanese, Portuguese, German, Spanish, French, Swedish, and Italian.
Ramesvara: There are more.
Tamala Krsna: He wants you to show the pictures. Where are they? Show him. Srila Prabhupada? Gopala Krsna Prabhu brought some new offerings for you.
Prabhupada: Hm! Please come.
Prabhupada: (Bengali)
Gopala Krsna: Yes, we have a big box here. It will be sold to everyone for one rupee, which is very cheap.
Prabhupada: (Bengali) Little attempt, less success. (Bengali)
Prabhupada: (Bengali)
Ramesvara: Srila Prabhupada? The trustees have met, and there is one question to ask you. There are many articles in BTG which are written by you or your lectures and your famous conversations, like Professor Kotovsky, Dr. Stahl. So there is a proposal to take all of these different writings that have been published in BTG and put them together in one hardbound book, so that they will be preserved.
Prabhupada: Good idea.
Ramesvara: And in the future there are so many other lectures that may be preserved in this way too, if you desire. Other books can be printed in the future.
Prabhupada: Very good idea.
Jayapataka: Then there is unlimited material.
Tamala Krsna: You've not only written more than anybody, but you've spoken more about Krsna than anyone, Srila Prabhupada.
Kirtanananda: Drink. This is to be drunk, not spit out. Drink it, whole thing. Please, Prabhupada! How will you ever get well? Come on! (laughs) Get a cloth.
Upendra: He rinses his mouth.
Kirtanananda: He can take a little more. Your body needs more, Prabhupada. Srila Prabhupada, you know, mother Yasoda, she was very fortunate because she could completely forget that Krsna was God, and she would simply tell Krsna, "You have to do it." Unfortunately, my love is not that great, 'cause I can still remember you're my spiritual master.
Prabhupada: I am doing your order. (laughter)
Kirtanananda: Thank you very much. One more? Half water. Thank you. I think he probably wants to go down.
Kirtanananda: Srila Prabhupada, you're not really going to try and eat that khicuri are you?
Prabhupada: Really? Why not?
Kirtanananda: Let's just stay on this for a few days to get your body a little accustomed, and then if you want something other, we can try. I think... You're doing well, Prabhupada. And if we introduce so many different things, and if you have a reaction, then we won't know what it was that caused it.
Brahmananda: Then Prabhupada will want to stop everything.
Kirtanananda: So if we just go a little bit slowly, it will get us there faster in the end.
Prabhupada: I'm very thin and hungry.(?) I'll take a little. And now, in the evening, they'll come about ten to twelve. Arrange for that.
Jayapataka: Fifteen.
Dr. Kapoor: They will come in afternoon.
Tamala Krsna: Twelve to fifteen. Okay. We'll arrange for their taking prasadam. So you'll bathe now, Srila Prabhupada?
Devotees: Jaya Srila Prabhupada.
Prabhupada: Who can read Hindi?
Prabhupada: From medical point of view, you cannot give life. The life is finished. Where is medical point? Hm? According to duration of life, that is finished. You cannot give a dead body life.
Kirtanananda: But your body is not dead, Prabhupada. Your body is not dead. Your life is very strong.
Prabhupada: Then again you go to miracle.
Kirtanananda: Eh?
Prabhupada: Then again you go to miracle. As soon as you say, "Your body is not dead."
Trivikrama: Then you go to miracle.
Prabhupada: That is not medical point.
Kirtanananda: I don't... It doesn't appear that...
Prabhupada: No. You said "medical point."
Kirtanananda: Yes.
Prabhupada: So medical point does not mean that you can give life to a dead body.
Kirtanananda: That is fact.
Prabhupada: So my body is now dead according to medical point. You cannot give life. So let it be doomed. It is not possible from medical point of view to give life to a dead body. What is this? It is dead body.
Prabhupada: So you can for the time being, disperse. Let me... Whatever possible, I'll take. Then you come and chant.
Devotees: Jaya Srila Prabhupada. [break]
Prabhupada: ...taking poison. The body is already finished.
Upendra: What is that?
Prabhupada: So dead body, you take poison or ambrosia, it is the same. Blind man, night or daythe same thing. Rather, if you depend on miracle, pray to Krsna that "He may survive."
Prabhupada: Medical science finished.
Jagadisa: What did he say?
Brahmananda: Sit up? [break]
Tamala Krsna: ...and make you lift, that wasn't by medical science. That was by your love for Krsna and our love for you.
Hari-sauri: When all these doctors come, they can't understand how it is that you're still here. [break]
Prabhupada: On the telephone or where?(?)
Tamala Krsna: We just had a little bit of your maha-prasadam, and it is the sweetest nectar, Srila Prabhupada. It has given us life. [break]
Kirtanananda: ...urine tested this morning, and there was some blood and pus in the urine. So the doctor there, he's prescribed some tablets and things. Do you want?
Prabhupada: Who is the doctor?
Kirtanananda: Bhagatji? Where's Bhagatji?
Bhagatji: Dr. Gopal in Rama-Krishna Seva Ashram. Physician. He's an M.D. He is the best doctor in Mathura district.
Kirtanananda: He said it is not... It's just one or two times you'd have to take.
Bhagatji: To check the blood. And I can call him to see you, Prabhupada.
Prabhupada: Let me taste this.
Bhagatji: One is syrup, and one tablet to be grinded in honey.
Kirtanananda: What is this for?
Bhagatji: This is blood urea to be tested. The other doctor, one of the best doctors, he said that blood urea should be tested because there is pus, and this blood will be defect. And the aluminium also, Prabhupada... Charvery(?) is also passing.
Bhagatji: Two, three.
Kirtanananda: What does he need to do this test? More urine?
Bhagatji: He will take some blood.
Prabhupada: But that is the difficulty.
Prabhupada: Let me taste the tablet. [break] (Bengali) [break] Go on, kirtana. [break] What news?
Svarupa Damodara: The guests will start coming tomorrow. Mr. Prem Kripal, who is the ex-president of the executive board, UNESCO, he's going to be our chief guest tomorrow. He's going to inaugurate the conference. He'll be arriving about five o'clock this evening. He told me he's coming with one of his friends who's also a retired architect. There's also a very well known architect who's coming with him this evening. He's going to speak on what is life and its purpose about twenty minutes. Then the other scholars will start arriving tomorrow, and Sunday everybody's coming. On Sunday there will be many medical doctors... Khorana is one of our life members, Dr. Khorana from Delhi. He's bringing several of his friends. Also I'm expecting some doctors from Agra. One... I don't recall his name, but he's also our life member. Everybody says that we have chosen the right place to have a conference. There's one Dr. Misra, he wanted to come tomorrow. Also I actually requested him to become the chief guest, but he cannot come tomorrow, but he's coming on Sunday. And also he's speaking. So there are about five or six people from outside that are speaking on different aspects of the conference regarding life. There's one Dr. Bhud.(?) He's one of the philosophers from Delhi University. He's speaking on..., called philosophical foundations of life. He told me he studied a great deal about Ramanuja. Also, he said, previously he studied in Bon Maharaja's institute about ten years ago something about Vaisnava philosophy. And now he's a reader in philosophy department in Delhi. He's going to speak something on the philosophical aspects of life. So we expect some good crowd from the scholars, mostly scientists from physics, from chemistry, mathematics and biology. And I found that most of them are very interested, and almost everybody wanted to come unless they had some engagement before. Everybody was very positive on our approach. In fact they encouraged us a lot, and they told us that's unique-trying to understand the concept of life from religious point of view connected with modern science. And many Bengalis are also coming.
Prabhupada: Scholar?
Svarupa Damodara: Yes. Viswas is the head of the physics department, Delhi University. He's very religious, also he's very appreciative. They already know about Srila Prabhupada's activities. So there is one professor called Katak. He's the head of the department of physics at also Indian Institute of Technology in Delhi. He's coming with his father. His father is a chemist, retired. They're also... So like that, many scholars are coming. Also from Jawaharlal University, there's Dr. Mukerjee. He's head of the department of life sciences, coming.
Prabhupada: Where is Kirtanananda?
Prabhupada: He is busy?
Aksayananda: He's not too busy to come.
Svarupa Damodara: So we have decided that the function will be started with the Brahma-samhita prayers with our Gurukula boys to open the conference, followed by the short speech by the chief guest. Then we'll start our main talk. Our main talk is going to last at least two hours. Each of us will speak. And then I've decided to open about half an hour for questions and answers and general discussion. On Sunday I'm leaving more than an hour for discussion. We'll summarize the whole conference and also make some conclusive remarks about the previous two days' talk that we are making.
Prabhupada: So the place is cleansed or not?
Svarupa Damodara: Yes. Place is... They are still putting the electrical wires. But otherwise, we have decorated the inside with curtains, so everything will be nice also. We're cleaning the other hall for serving the prasadam.
Tamala Krsna: And all of the guesthouse rooms, Srila Prabhupada, have been vacated for the scientists. The whole guesthouse is ready to receive them, and all the rooms have been cleansed freshly. It's ready for them. Kirtanananda Maharaja is here, Srila Prabhupada.
Prabhupada: Kirtanananda Maharaja?
Kirtanananda: Yes.
Prabhupada: Do you know about the conference?
Kirtanananda: About what?
Kirtanananda: Yes.
Prabhupada: So cooperate. You have heard what the arrangement?
Kirtanananda: Yes.
Svarupa Damodara: I'm inviting, requesting all the GBCs, and also the sannyasis, maharajas, to kindly attend the conference unless they're engaged at that time.
Prabhupada: According to horoscope, life is finished. Still, I am living. What should be the interpretation?
Kirtanananda: The interpretation?
Prabhupada: No, about... About me.
Kirtanananda: Srila Prabhupada, even the astrologers all say that you are transcendental, that if you want, you can change your horoscope. And that's what you told us, that Krsna said the choice is up to you.
Prabhupada: So what do you think?
Tamala Krsna: I think, Srila Prabhupada, that you should continue to try, and that Krsna will help you, because we all want you. The whole world wants you very much, and there's no reason why Krsna cannot do this. If we remain determined, then Krsna will surely fulfill our desires. We're not desiring it for any selfish reason that you should live. We're desiring for the benefit of the whole world. There's every reason to continue to try and make the effort to remain.
Prabhupada: So something to eat. What shall I eat?
Kirtanananda: (aside:) Three hours later. (whispering among disciples)
Prabhupada: They cannot come for three days. Eh?
Svarupa Damodara: Many are coming for three days, except a few. From Agra I expect about fifty, and from Mathura there will be about fifteen to twenty, and from Delhi I expect about thirty for tomorrow. Then, on Saturday, Sunday... Sunday is going to be... Everybody's coming on Sunday, whomever I invited. Because in Delhi, schools and colleges are still going on.
Prabhupada: Fifty, fifty.
Svarupa Damodara: Yes. So it will be about a hundred. These are all mostly professors, very few students. There's about four or five. All are professors. Some of them wanted to help me start a center in Delhi of our Bhaktivedanta Institute. They told me they can help me in setting up one center in Delhi. There's one Professor Malsanda, he's the head of the physiology department.
Prabhupada: Why not take the chance?
Svarupa Damodara: Yes. Also, while I was typing in the Connaught Place, some business man came and he saw the letterhead saying "Bhaktivedanta Institute." Then he asked me later on, "What is this institute?" Then I told him Prabhupada's projects and plans. And he was very sincere and serious. He was a big businessman. And he wanted to help me in setting up one center in Delhi.
Prabhupada: So take this opportunity. And we will supply the place, suitable place? It will be very prestigious in Delhi.
Prabhupada: Yes.
Svarupa Damodara: They have many offices. Similarly in Washington, D.C., they have many headquarters for these scientific and governmental organizations.
Prabhupada: All embassies.
Svarupa Damodara: And also I have set up one round-table debating conference in the Indian Academy of Sciences. That will be right after the conference in Delhi.
Prabhupada: Rama?
Svarupa Damodara: Round-table conference. There will be other scientists from Delhi, like D. S. Kotari. D. S. Kotari is the ex-chairman of University Grants Commission. He's a very well known physicist. He's a very interested... I think he's the most interested in India in our field. He's retired and very respected. All Indian scientific community... Actually, this was his idea, that we set up a round-table conference in Indian National Science Academy. So we agreed to that. We'll have some sort of a debating form. So I'll bring all our members, and we'll have conference in Delhi. Also Krishnamurti... He's the director of television in Delhi. He's going to make some arrangement for us after the conference for the television appearance in New Delhi. Also most of the schools, they want us come and speak on the same topics that we are organizing here.
Prabhupada: We want that they should be interested.
Svarupa Damodara: Oh, yes. They are very interested. All the universities, wherever I went, everybody thought that this was a very genuine idea, and they wanted to know more about it. Also the chief guest who is coming this evening... I discussed briefly yesterday. He was... Actually he's a very well known figure in the United Nations. He represented several times in the United Nations program, and he spoke also many times in the U.N., and he was... We were discussing briefly about the limitations of science and the scientists are sometimes trying to speak so many big words without any scientific background, especially in the case of life. So actually he's going to speak in favor of our Krsna consciousness. He suggested that this Krsna consciousness is a movement like United Nations.
Prabhupada: Yes.
Svarupa Damodara: He himself is a man from the United Nations, experienced, and he thought Krsna consciousness, if we can push forward, it will be best in the world. That was his opinion.
Prabhupada: Yes.
Svarupa Damodara: He had a great respect for our movement. I didn't know him before. He's a very well known educationist also.
Prabhupada: So, Kirtanananda Maharaja, how do you like?
Kirtanananda: The conference? I think it's wonderful.
Prabhupada: This is the beginning. And arrange for such conference one after another, many... Do something for that before my departure. I can see something. Oh (indistinct), make like that. Or smite. Where is Bhavananda?
Prabhupada: Yes.
Prabhupada: Our only ambition is to stop this. God is one, He is a person, and He's Krsna.
Devotees: Jaya.
Prabhupada: And we are following what Krsna says. Then our life, success. Hm? Where is that? Kotari has now retired?
Svarupa Damodara: Yes, Srila Prabhupada. He retired a few years ago. But he's still very active in the science academy, and he writes articles. And he sent me an article just a few days ago called "The Mind and the Body Relationship in Modern Science." Sometimes in the West they think that mind is the soul. So he sent me an article and he asked me what do I think about his article.
Prabhupada: According to our sastra, mind is meant for speculation. It does not give us any definite knowledge. My mind is working in one way; your mind is working another way. There is no conclu... Manorathenasati dhavato bahih [SB 5.18.12]. This is the result of mental speculation. And Gita also says that manah sasthanindriyani prakrti-sthani karsati [Bg. 15.7]. This spiritual spark, being bound up by the mind and the senses, is struggling hard on the material nature. And he's simply struggling. No fixed up condition. Everyone will say, "I think this is right." What is right, he does not know. That is struggle. Is it not?
Svarupa Damodara: Yes, Srila Prabhupada. There are a group of physicists in the world today that... They think that the phenomena and the relationship between life and matter is some sort of a complementary. Just like they took this idea from a physicist called Niels Bohr. He tried to explain the quality of a particle called electron that has two properties. Sometimes is behaves like a wave, and sometimes it behaves like a particle. So he proposed an idea called "complementarity." Taking from that idea, some of the present-day physicists think that life and matter are some sort of a complementary. But we are saying that that is wrong, saying that life is completely different from matter, inanimate matter. We're going to make that stand strong and also make it quite clear in the conference.
Bhavananda: :Yes, Srila Prabhupada.
Prabhupada: So, things are being arranged very nice?
Bhavananda: :Yes, Srila Prabhupada. Everything is being arranged now. The district magistrate and local officials have all been invited personally this morning, and the guesthouse is being completely cleaned up and made nice. Prasadam is being arranged. Conference room is being decorated. The dining hall for their prasadam is all being arranged also.
Prabhupada: At the present moment our ordinary prasadam is very much liked by...
Prabhupada: No, he approved. He was saying, "It is very nice." And our members also say. Tamala Krsna?
Prabhupada: You also said.
Tamala Krsna: Yes. I personally feel that the prasadam here at lunchtime is some of the nicest prasadam I have eaten ever. Every day it's consistently very nice, served very nicely, and sufficient quantity.
Prabhupada: So kindly maintain this standard. That is very important item. I am not eating, but I am hearing (laughter) and getting the appetite.
Devotees: Jaya.
Prabhupada: Catur-vidha-sri-bhagavat-prasada-svadv-anna-trptan hari-bhakta-sanghan, krtvaiva trptim bhajatah sadaiva **. This is also bhajana, to be satisfied that others are taking first-class prasadam.
Svarupa Damodara: Yes. We want to treat them very nicely outside the conference, like giving nice prasadam. [break] ...yes. So we have specifically arranged for this nice prasadam.
Svarupa Damodara: Inside we are going to say very strongly about our philosophy and science. So anybody who's going to oppose that, we're going to duel them. Also we'll show some films, our Hare Krsna films, just after the conference. The evening, I have some entertainment program. That program is for showing our films and our activities, ISKCON activities throughout the world. So I have brought all the slides from Los Angeles that we have from our BBT department, and also I have all the films ready. Also they can attend mangala-arati, and in the evening they can also attend the sandhya-arati. And also some of them want just to see our temple, Krsna-Balarama. They have heard that the architect is very nice, and it's very nicely decorated. So some of them already heard about it, so they just want to see how the temple is here. Overall, our idea is also to make them devotees.
Prabhupada: Yes. That is wanted. So go and arrange. That's all.
Link to this page: https://prabhupadabooks.com/conversations/1977/oct/vrndavana/october/13/1977-1 Previous: Room Conversation -- October 13, 1977, Vrndavana Next: Room Conversation -- October 14, 1977, Vrndavana
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