Room Conversation

November 2, 1977, Vrndavana
Prabhupada: Tamala Krsna?
Tamala Krsna: Yes, Prabhupada.
Prabhupada: What you are going to say?
Tamala Krsna: What are we going to do? What am I going to say?
Prabhupada: Yes.
Tamala Krsna: Well, the real factor is Your Divine Grace's desire. I mean it seems like... As your disciples, our duty is to help you fulfill your desire. It seems like your desire is to die in Vrndavana. But it's very hard for us to execute that service. It's very hardbecause we love youto assist you in dying. It's a paradox. You want to die in Vrndavana, and we want you to live, and yet we have to do whatever you want. I mean, the kaviraja, he is giving some... He feels a little confident. Probably from medical point of view, there's no doubt, he has far superior knowledge than many of us.
Prabhupada: Visvambhara has not yet...?
Tamala Krsna: No. Visvambhara has not come yet, Srila Prabhupada. I mean for the past few days you've been saying that you want to live. Now suddenly you say that you want to die. Maybe that's simply to discourage us from... Because you feel too weak now. There's so many conflicting...
Prabhupada: (Hindi)
Kaviraja: (Hindi)
Bhakti-caru: Do you understand? He's saying that "As a physician, in this condition, I wouldn't advise you to go. But if you desire to go there, then I have enough confidence in my medicine, and since you have the will, so I can assure you I can take you over there safely. Now it's up to you whether you want to go or whether you want to stay." He's saying that if you stay here for ten more days, then you'll become strong enough and you can travel. And he's willing to come back again after about a week, and then he'll stay here for a day or two and then take him.
Svarupa Damodara: I think that's a good idea. Don't you, Maharaja?
Bhakti-caru: Srila Prabhupada is saying that... Srila Prabhupada wants to stay here, but we want him to take...
Tamala Krsna: He wants to stay here, that's a fact.
Kaviraja: (Hindi)
Tamala Krsna: What is that?
Bhakti-caru: Water intake, liquid.
Tamala Krsna: How much urine has he passed since six o'clock this morning? Six o'clock this morning?
Prabhupada: Brahmananda.
Brahmananda: Yes, Prabhupada?
Bhakti-caru: Two hundred and twenty.
Tamala Krsna: The whole day?
Bhakti-caru: No, since six.
Tamala Krsna: And the whole day?
Bhakti-caru: The whole day it's 320.
Kaviraja: (Hindi)
Bhakti-caru: (Hindi)
Prabhupada: Hm?
Brahmananda: Just translating what the doctor is saying. If there's any risk, Prabhupada, in traveling, then you shouldn't take that risk. The doctor will come back here next week and then we can see.
Kaviraja: (Hindi)
Prabhupada: In the morning the symptom was that.
Kaviraja: (Hindi)
Bhakti-caru: He's saying, from the treatment point of view, it's best if Srila Prabhupada stays here for ten more days.
Tamala Krsna: Tell him that the only reason we had any reservation about that was because if some side effect develops, then he is not here to help, and we have to take the help of this other person, who we do not trust.
Bhakti-caru: (Hindi)
Kaviraja: (Hindi)
Bhakti-caru: He's saying that now his medicine started working. So he'll give one day's medicine, and he's confident that that medicine will work.
Tamala Krsna: One day's?
Bhakti-caru: Seven days. And apart from that, he's saying that that boy, he has got confidence in him that whatever instruction he gives, he will follow. He is going to follow that, not like other physicians. He wouldn't try to administer his own medicine.
Tamala Krsna: Yes, but supposing there's a symptom which he has not predicted at this time?
Bhakti-caru: (Hindi)
Kaviraja: (Hindi)
Bhakti-caru: He says that nothing will happen. He's saying that the main thing... He found out the main defect in the body. He's saying that if anything is wrong, then we can ring him up and he'll come immediately.
Kaviraja: (Hindi)
Indian man (1): Next time, when he comes, make arrangement to stay for a long time.
Bhakti-caru: Say, at least about a week, so that he can stay here for about a week. This time he came absolutely unprepared.
Prabhupada: Turn me this way.
Kaviraja: (Hindi)
Tamala Krsna: Svarupa Damodara is here, Srila Prabhupada.
Kaviraja: (Hindi)
Bhakti-caru: Maharaja, do you have the urine report?
Tamala Krsna: Can you go in my file under "M"? There's a folder, an envelope, a big envelope.
Kaviraja: (Hindi)
Svarupa Damodara: He said that...
Indian man (1): Prabhupada should not speak to anybody.
Tamala Krsna: Should not speak to anybody. Well that's all right with me, but whether Srila Prabhupada...
Kaviraja: (Hindi)
Svarupa Damodara: Don't allow guests.
Kaviraja: (Hindi)
Tamala Krsna: What about this parikrama? Prabhupada feels that that must go on.
Kaviraja: (Hindi)
Indian man (1): If he insists on going on parikrama, he can give a special medicine.
Tamala Krsna: He's pretty insistent.
Kaviraja: (Hindi)
Tamala Krsna: So is this all right, Srila Prabhupada?
Prabhupada: What is that?
Tamala Krsna: That we'll wait here for another week to ten days, and Shastriji will give us medicine. The kaviraja will give us medicine, and you can take it for another week or so. After a week's time he'll come back, and then, after a few days, he'll take you to Mayapura.
Prabhupada: At least at present this decision will be good.
Tamala Krsna: This decision is good. He says that you should not do so much talking, Srila Prabhupada.
Prabhupada: I'll not talk.
Svarupa Damodara: For about ten days.
Tamala Krsna: I've never seen this possible, though. (laughter) You always speak of Krsna. That is your life and soul, sravanam kirtanam. He says if you insist on going on parikrama, then he will give you a little medicine which will help you.
Prabhupada: Parikrama must be there.
Tamala Krsna: All right.
Kaviraja: (Hindi)
Tamala Krsna: Four times? That's all right. Three times around, into the temple, and one more time. That will be nice. Four times. Is that all right? Will that be all right, Srila Prabhupada?
Prabhupada: We have given four times.
Tamala Krsna: We're doing a lot more than four now. We do about ten. Smara-hari knows because he carries you. (laughs) So then we'll make this program, Srila Prabhupada? And you should keep making the effort, Srila Prabhupada, to get better. Krsna may desire for you to get better, Srila Prabhupada. At least it is our duty to pray like that.
Kaviraja: (Hindi) Telephone... (Hindi) ...any time.
Prabhupada: Tamala Krsna?
Tamala Krsna: Yes, Srila Prabhupada?
Prabhupada: So... In Bengali there is such thing, "When you hesitate, don't do it."
Tamala Krsna: Yes, we also sometimes feel that when there's a hesitation, it seems like the Supersoul is giving indication.
Prabhupada: But he has not also come? Hm?
Tamala Krsna: Bhagatji?
Prabhupada: Yes.
Tamala Krsna: He has not come yet.
Prabhupada: So when he will come?
Tamala Krsna: Yes, I am also beginning to wonder. He was supposed to come by at least four or five o'clock. I'm sure he'll have a good reason, but until he comes I cannot speculate on why he's late.
Prabhupada: It will be late. The other person, whether they will come at night?
Tamala Krsna: Well, that's probably why he is late, because they would only come at night. That's my... Last time this was also done at about this time, Srila Prabhupada. These men work all day in the court, and they can't come until the evening.
Prabhupada: And suppose he does not come?
Tamala Krsna: Well, if he does not come, then I'll have to find out why he didn't come.
Prabhupada: And then you will have to postpone. They'll have to postpone.
Tamala Krsna: Well, if they don't come, then certainly we'll have to postpone this signing, because they won't be here. Are you feeling up to signing anything tonight? I don't think so. You feel a little too much... You can do? Let us see if they come. I think they're going to come. Of course, it is getting pretty late. Anyway, we'll see.
Svarupa Damodara: Quarter to nine.
Tamala Krsna: In any case, you're not at any loss. You're laying here. Just I think now I'll turn off the light. Do you like some little kirtana? Singing? You haven't been having kirtana lately in your room very much, Srila Prabhupada. Anyway, if you like, we'll just keep it quiet here and turn off the light. Would you prefer that?
Prabhupada: Light you can keep. Hm?
Tamala Krsna: I have to give the key to the door. I keep the door locked when I'm not in the room.
Svarupa Damodara: (whispering) I made two members today for the Institute.
Tamala Krsna: If you stay longer on this planet, Srila Prabhupada, that will make this movement stronger. That is the real reason for living longer. 'Cause you are a pure devotee of Lord Krsna, you have no personal desire. This is Krsna's movement. If you stay longer, then this movement will become stronger and stronger. Simply by your presence the devotees become inspired and they work much better. We can understand that there's nothing to lament if you were to depart, because you're always going to be with Krsna. But we would have to lament from our own point of view that we would lose you, at least in the way that we have you now. And the whole world would lament because this movement might not be as strong if you were not present.
Prabhupada: Then make this arrangement, one week or ten days.
Tamala Krsna: We are doing that. We have already agreed to that. Actually I could see from the very beginning that that's what we're going to do, but sometimes I feel it is my duty to give good arguments for some opposite opinion just to see both sides. Ultimately we are prepared to be with you wherever you want to be. To us that is home. That is our great pleasure, to be with you. So we're making that arrangement, Srila Prabhupada. [break] (offers obeisances) Jaya Srila Prabhupada.
Prabhupada: Do you think that without finishing this business we shall go?
Tamala Krsna: Without finishing the business of these, this legal business? Oh, yes, this legal business is not what would keep us here.
Prabhupada: Then how it will... How it will be done?
Tamala Krsna: I mean it can be executed in Mayapura as well.
Prabhupada: How?
Tamala Krsna: Mr. Das, our friend from Calcutta, can come. It's pretty much now... It's already drafted, and... It would just have to be redrafted again on new stamp paper or the words would have to be changed. It would have to be retyped on stamp paper from Bengal side. The basic writing is...
Prabhupada: That means unfinished despite unfinished.
Tamala Krsna: (laughs) Srila Prabhupada...
Prabhupada: Hm? It is past nine.
Tamala Krsna: So maybe this is the reason we're not going.
Prabhupada: No. Even if we decide to go, that means despite unfinishing...
Tamala Krsna: Yes, I really don't feel that this would be enough of a reason to stay here. The whole consideration of whatever we do is your health. That is the major consideration. Our going was on account of your health; our staying now is on account of your health. These other things may be done or not. That doesn't matter. I work all day doing all of your other businesses only because I know your health is well looked after. Otherwise, if I thought it wasn't, I would drop whatever else I'm doing and simply do this, take care of you here. There's so many qualified men doing that, so I don't... I'm engaging myself in your other businesses. Otherwise the main thing is that first of all you should be..., we should try to help you to get better. And if I say, "If you want to take rest, you take rest and don't be worried that this business may not get done tonight." That is not the issue at all.
Prabhupada: But how is that they did not come?
Tamala Krsna: This is very strange. I must admit I'm very surprised, very, very surprised. I think the only possible answer to it can be that the work itself is difficult work, plus there must have been some other works that either the lawyer had to do or the notary had to do, and so it just could not... I mean after all, this was very, very quickly done. When we decided that we were going to go, it was only on Monday. That means yesterday morning that we decided that we were going to leave. So I mean from yesterday morning until tonight is practically not even... It's hardly enough time to do the legal work that we wanted to do. It was a real strain. Actually it would have been very surprising if we do get it done by tonight. That would be very surprising.
Prabhupada: I don't think. It is past nine.
Tamala Krsna: You don't think they'll come now. No, I also don't think. I mean it's not good etiquette to come at this hour for business. It's nearly nine-thirty, Srila Prabhupada. I mean I don't think that... If you'll permit me to request them, even if they do come now, that we do it on another day, then I would prefer to do that. Oh, I hear Bhagatji. (goes and returns) So they're all here, Srila Prabhupada. So we can go to Mayapura now. (laughs) So I better... First I'll have to go through all the documents and see that they're in order. Then I'll bring them in here and we'll finish this business.
Prabhupada: Then let us go.
Tamala Krsna: (laughs) You want to go to Mayapura?
Prabhupada: As you are saying, I'll go.
Tamala Krsna: No, Srila Prabhupada, I mean you guide us. As you say, we will do. There's no... The doctor advises, "Better to remain." His medical opinion is that you should wait here for another ten days.
Prabhupada: So do that.
Tamala Krsna: Yes. He said the only reason... He said, "However, if you really feel that you want to go," he says, "I guarantee you that there will be no risk." That he promises. If you want to go, there will not be risk. But from a medical point of view he says, "I advise you to get stronger before making the trip, because it will be easier."
Prabhupada: So do that.
Tamala Krsna: So that's our program. We're going to wait here ten days. After seven days, doctor is coming back. Kaviraja is coming back. He'll also by that time have arranged so that when he comes he can stay even up to a week if necessary.
Prabhupada: And I'll get some strength.
Tamala Krsna: That's his point, yes. He feels confident that you'll get strength. Is that all right? I'll go now and... [break]
Prabhupada: So somebody else come near me. Tamala?
Tamala Krsna: Yes, Srila Prabhupada.
Prabhupada: If somebody has come from Delhi, in that car could not come?
Tamala Krsna: Someone has come from Delhi. The cars came.
Prabhupada: But... No, no. It could not come in time.
Bhakti-caru: They couldn't come in time.
Tamala Krsna: Yes. The cars only came here by four o'clock.
Prabhupada: Then?
Tamala Krsna: Well, it seems like it was Krsna's desire that we didn't go. I was pretty shocked when I saw that the cars only arrived by four o'clock in the morning. There was no way that we would have been able to go on time.
Prabhupada: So what is to be done now?
Tamala Krsna: What is to be done now? Well, we're going to stay here for ten days or so, and you'll get better. When you get stronger, then we can attempt this trip. We have to hope that you'll get stronger now. Did you take all the medicine, Bhakti-caru, from the kaviraja?
Bhakti-caru: Yes. He made all the medicines till eleven o'clock.
Prabhupada: So we shall wait. We shall wait.
Tamala Krsna: Oh, yes. No, that was the best program, to wait some time. We were feeling a little bit happy to get this good kaviraja, so naturally we were thinking to stay where he could give you more close attention. But he also felt that to wait for some time was best. Did you pass a comfortable night?
Prabhupada: As usual. Bhavananda was reading Caitanya-caritamrta. Now Jayadvaita, you read.
Jayadvaita: I can read, or Aksayananda Maharaja is here with the report about the program last night.
Prabhupada: Oh. Where is Aksayananda?
Jayadvaita: Here, Srila Prabhupada.
Aksayananda: They enjoyed... We showed them the New Vrindaban film, Hindi. They enjoyed it very much. Also they asked us to speak. They said, "But don't speak anything about the Gita."
Tamala Krsna: Really?
Aksayananda: Yes. They said, "You can speak what you like about ISKCON, but we know all about Gita. Don't speak anything about Gita. Tell us about the progress of ISKCON." So I read out how many books have been printed and distributed since Your Divine Grace started ISKCON, how many farms you've established, how many centers, how many devotees all over the world and like that. They're very dry. But nonetheless, the film was so nice that they were very much impressed by it. They took prasadam. They enjoyed it very much.
Prabhupada: "Don't speak of Gita"?
Aksayananda: Yes. "Gita-pratisthana," but "Don't speak of Gita." It's foolishness.
Prabhupada: Now the danger is mayavadi-bhasya sunile haya sarva-nasa [Cc. Madhya 6.169]. So Vrndavana is full of Mayavadis. Do you accept it? And I am afraid our men may be influenced. Caitanya Mahaprabhu's clear saying-mayavadi-bhasya sunile haya sarva-nasa. Hm? What is to be done? [break] They are coming to our Vrndavana temple, Bombay temple. What is their purpose? They may occupy it? Hm?
Tamala Krsna: No, they can't occupy it.
Prabhupada: So we have to be very careful. Hm?
Aksayananda: Yes, Prabhupada.
Prabhupada: Aksayananda? And Tamala?
Tamala Krsna: Yes, they're not going to get in. From now on we're going to have a sign on all of our temples, "No Mayavadi Meetings Allowed."
Prabhupada: It is clearly written, mayavadi-bhasya su... Sixth Chapter. Hm? The Sarvabhauma...
Bhavananda: One sixty-nine.
That's Sixth Chapter, Madhya-lila, verse 169. "Srila Vyasadeva presented the Vedanta philosophy for the deliverance of conditioned souls, but if one hears the commentary of Sankaracarya, everything is spoiled." Shall I read the purport, Srila Prabhupada?
Prabhupada: Yes.
Bhavananda: Purport: "Factually the devotional service of the Lord is described in Vedanta-sutra, but the Mayavadi philosophers, the Sankarites, prepared a commentary known as Sariraka-bhasya, in which the transcendental form of the Lord is denied. The Mayavadi philosophers think that the living entity is identical with the Supreme Soul, Brahman. Their commentaries on Vedanta-sutra are completely opposed to the principle of devotional service. Caitanya Mahaprabhu therefore warns us to avoid these commentaries. If one indulges in hearing the Sankarite Sariraka-bhasya, he will certainly be bereft of all real knowledge. The ambitious Mayavadi philosophers desire to merge into the existence of the Lord, and this may be accepted as sayujya-mukti. However, this form of mukti means denying one's individual existence. In other words, it is a kind of spiritual suicide. This is absolutely opposed to the philosophy of bhakti-yoga. Bhakti-yoga offers immortality to the individual conditioned soul. If one follows the Mayavadi philosophy, he misses his opportunity to become immortal after giving up the material body. The immortality of the individual person is the highest perfectional stage a living entity can attain."
Prabhupada: Who were..., was present all through in the meeting?
Aksayananda: Rama-Krsna Bajaj was there. Sriman Narayana.
Prabhupada: No, you were there?
Aksayananda: I was there.
Prabhupada: So what the gosvamis said?
Aksayananda: Well, last night they didn't speak anything. They just heard our film and lecture. That's all. They didn't speak anything last night. Actually they are very impressed.
Prabhupada: Who was impressed?
Aksayananda: All the people. They all...
Tamala Krsna: Prabhupada's asking about the Vrndavana gosvamis, Purusottama Gosvami, Visvambhara Gosvami...
Aksayananda: Oh, I see. No, they were not there.
Tamala Krsna: No, but they were there in the afternoon. You didn't see them, but they were there.
Aksayananda: Oh, I see. We didn't stay all through in the afternoon.
Tamala Krsna: Prabhupada's point is that all of the gosvamis of Vrndavana were attending.
Aksayananda: What did they say to Prabhupada.
Tamala Krsna: No, they're attending, Bon Maharaja, so that means the whole of Vrndavana has become Mayavadi, because they're all attending this meeting. Our men should not attend this meeting any more, Srila Prabhupada.
Prabhupada: No, just see the, how they have functioned. It is our place. We should guard. So, and all the men were accommodated in their room?
Aksayananda: Yes.
Tamala Krsna: They could all fit in the meeting room?
Aksayananda: Yes.
Prabhupada: And who was presiding?
Aksayananda: The Aurobindo.
Tamala Krsna: That guy's a pakka Mayavadi. That Aurobindo man?
Prabhupada: Aurobind.
Tamala Krsna: Yes. He had a big argument with Brahmananda. Not a big argument, but he was challenging Brahmananda that "Krsna means the divine consciousness. Krsna is not a person. He is the... It is divine consciousness."
Prabhupada: Mayavada.
Aksayananda: I have a plan, Prabhupada. Myself and Bhakti-prema Swami can go there and sit, and if we hear any discrepancies, if we are given a chance afterwards, which we can arrange, to speak something, then we can rectifyin a gentlemanly way, of course. We can rectify. If we sit there, at least we know that they'll be careful what they say. And he can catch any finer points that I would miss, 'cause it's all in Hindi.
Prabhupada: They are speaking in Hindi.
Aksayananda: Everything's in Hindi, the whole thing. No English whatsoever.
Tamala Krsna: Then there's no chance of our men becoming...
Aksayananda: Our men can't understand anything.
Tamala Krsna: That's a good advantage.
Aksayananda: But for the purpose of maintaining our proper position, we can sit there and hear what they're saying, and when an opportunity is there we can rectify.
Tamala Krsna: I think Bhakti-prema may agree with them.
Aksayananda: No, no, he's... No. No, no
Tamala Krsna: He used to be a Mayavadi.
Aksayananda: Yes. But he understands fully this philosophy and accepts it.
Prabhupada: So this is the position. The whole Vrndavana is full of Mayavadis. We have to be very, very cautious and careful. I was there. That Brahmananda protested against that Aurobindo. And then "Don't speak of Gita."
Tamala Krsna: Yes, that's what they told him.
Jayadvaita: They shouldn't speak of Gita. They should speak of whatever other thing they want.
Tamala Krsna: Then why call it Gita-pratisthana?
Jayadvaita: That's Prabhupada's premise. He's establishing Bhagavad-gita.
Prabhupada: Eh?
Jayadvaita: The actual establishment of Bhagavad-gita is being done by Your Divine Grace. They should admit that "We have our philosophy, but as far as Bhagavad-gita goes, Srila Prabhupada is establishing it all over the world. We have something else, our own idea." They can say that.
Prabhupada: Now find out the way how to stop this class of men speaking in our halls.
Aksayananda: That's not difficult. We simply... We conduct our own meetings, that's all, Bhaktivedanta Institute.
Prabhupada: Tamala Krsna?
Tamala Krsna: Well, one thing is that in Bombay... I mean we really don't have a very attractive hall here, but in Bombay we have the most attractive air-conditioned hall of any place that has a religious temple. All of these people will want to speak in our hall. Not only these people will want to speak in our hall, but all of the nonsense theater people will want to perform there.
Prabhupada: So we must charge.
Tamala Krsna: Even if we charge, they're going to speak nonsense. If we don't mind speaking nonsense, then it's all right. Otherwise, just like Shubhalakshmi, she may want to give some concert in our hall as a benefit. But she's going to simply sing nonsense.
Prabhupada: Yes. Bhavananda? Where is Bhavananda?
Bhavananda: Yes, Srila Prabhupada.
Prabhupada: So, if they pay, we shall allow?
Bhavananda: I don't think so, Srila Prabhupada. Just like yesterday, I was noticing in their afternoon meeting, they had microphone, and you could hear the speakers outside. I was thinking that this Mayavadi... Someone is speaking Mayavadi philosophy, it's polluting the boys. Even you don't understand Hindi, the sound vibration itself is polluting. You once told me, Srila Prabhupada, that to even hear Sanskrit Srimad-Bhagavatam from the mouth of a Mayavadi, it will poison you. Even you don't understand, just the sound vibration coming from that source is polluting. So what is the necessity for us to rent out our facility to them?
Prabhupada: Tamala Krsna?
Tamala Krsna: Yes. Well, the point is that we have not built these temples for profit-making basis. We have built these temples to demonstrate to the world an ideal, perfect Krsna consciousness. So if we are going to allow these people to come here, that means we're compromising. Then we should have gone into business...
Prabhupada: Just like to take advertisement in the magazine. Eh?
Tamala Krsna: Yes. It's the same thing. We're trying to make something ideal. We don't care if anybody does join or doesn't join, but our business is to show the perfect ideal.
Prabhupada: Jayadvaita?
Jayadvaita: I agree. This...
Tamala Krsna: Just like our Back to Godhead magazine. For a while it was becoming very compromised. Actually it was becoming a little compromised. And just because we wanted... The editors were thinking that they should make it more popular, more acceptable. But our conclusion of all the GBC men was: "Popular or not, we are trying to present the ideal for the topmost men. There must be some ideal institution in the world." So we should keep it pure. And those who want the pure product, they will come and take. And others, at least they will know this is pure.
Jayadvaita: Everybody else is already a hodgepodge, so they'll allow anyone to speak because they don't have any scruples. But if we are very strict, if we don't allow anyone who's not strictly following...
Prabhupada: Where is Brahmananda?
Jayadvaita: Brahmananda? Brahmananda is resting.
Prabhupada: So, I am on the deathbed. I may go away at any moment. Then... Now it is up to you to give protection to the sanctity of our institution. Who else is there from the GBC?
Prabhupada: Svarupa Damodara?
Tamala Krsna: He's not here right now, but they are here in Vrndavana.
Prabhupada: He has gone to Delhi?
Tamala Krsna: He came back last night.
Prabhupada: Oh. So think over. I am unable to do now. I can simply give you warning. It is very dangerous. Hm?
Jayadvaita: We have so many experiences that someone associates with these people and he loses his status.
Prabhupada: They can warn us that "Don't speak of Gita," and why shall I allow them to speak? Eh?
Bhavananda: That is such an insult, especially it's our facility. And as soon as you rent out to people, then you are compromised that they can tell you not to speak of Gita at their Gita conference in your hall. And you have to listen because they're giving you money.
Aksayananda: Because they're paying.
Bhavananda: It's outrageous.
Prabhupada: Tamala Krsna? Hm?
Tamala Krsna: Yeah. I mean I'm more concerned about Bombay, because there in Bombay I feel that... I don't think that there's a proper understanding on the part of some of the leaders there about the danger of this. I think that the leaders there are not very clear on this point. I'm a little worried about Bombay. I think that they're... They're going to compromise. There's a danger for compromisation there.
Jayadvaita: To be popular.
Tamala Krsna: Yes. To be popular and profitable, they're approaching it on a very businesslike basis. And also the other point is that they're afraid that... In Bombay they've made this hall, such a beautiful hall. So they don't want it to lie vacant or empty, and they just can't think of what can be done inside that hall every single day of the year. It's a fact that hall should be used every day of the year.
Bhavananda: By us.
Tamala Krsna: By us. But since they feel that there's not going to be any constant use from our side, they're thinking that it doesn't make sense to have built and spent so much money on such a good hall and not utilize it daily, which from the business point of view is a fact. But that means that you're going to have to invite all kinds of semi... It's not even Krsna conscious. I wanted to say semi-Krsna conscious, but they're going to have to invite different theater people, entertaining people.
Bhavananda: So the Krsna conscious solution is to utilize the hall every night for our own purposes. Krsna consciousness is unlimited. There's so many dramas, so many lectures, so many symposiums.
Prabhupada: No, suppose you construct some house and rent out. Then they can do as they like. So similarly, if that hall is made, constructed for making some money, then the money will not come if we don't rent out to the cinema actors, actresses. It is just like... What is called? Village house. Hm? The hall is called? When one pays, marriage ceremony... For making some money you have made.
Tamala Krsna: Is that why we made that hall, for making money?
Prabhupada: Otherwise what you will do?
Tamala Krsna: Well, originally you had intended that that hall would be used for Svarupa Damodara's scientists and for our theater group and things like that.
Prabhupada: That's all right, but are you going to have every day?
Tamala Krsna: No, I know that they won't. They cannot do that. I mean practically they won't.
Bhavananda: It's possible, but...
Tamala Krsna: Well, it would have to take a tremendous endeavor on the part of our movement, and our movement is not... We're not geared to do that.
Prabhupada: It is like tenant house. So whoever pays to your satisfaction, you give him for one day.
Tamala Krsna: Is that all right with you, Srila Prabhupada?
Prabhupada: I don't think it is wrong.
Tamala Krsna: Okay. Well, then that makes it very easy.
Prabhupada: Because it will be a source of income.
Tamala Krsna: Oh, it will be a big source of income. They'll pay a lot of money to use that hall. Not only that, once you let them use the hall, they'll book all the rooms in the hotel at the same time.
Prabhupada: If you are going to do some business, earn some money, you'll have to allow.
Bhavananda: But how that will affect the atmosphere and Krsna consciousness of the temple? It's not that the theater...
Prabhupada: Well, atmosphere... Suppose there is temple, and there is the park and other houses, and they are already polluting the atmosphere. You cannot stop it. Is it not?
Jayadvaita: All over our movement we have temples, and then next door there's some nonsense place.
Prabhupada: Yes. You cannot check the atmosphere all around. That is not possible. (pause) So when you described the number of books, what did they say? Hm?
Aksayananda: They said it was very nice. They said they were very impressed with that, and that you are doing the greatest work. They... Superficially they say all these things. They must.
Tamala Krsna: They haven't even published one book.
Aksayananda: They must say these things.
Bhavananda: Of course, Srila Prabhupada, another view is that we've constructed such attractive facilities here, and the purpose is to attract people to Krsna consciousness. So if we let out this auditorium in Bombay and here in Vrndavana, so those people will come. They may be Mayavadi... Actually everyone is Mayavadi today. So it's a good opportunity for preaching if we're strong.
Prabhupada: Preaching means to convert Mayavadis to Vaisnava. Otherwise where is the need of preaching?
Bhavananda: Preaching also means risk.
Prabhupada: Yes. No risk. We take money from them. So we get some money. That is our gain. So anything, do very carefully.
Tamala Krsna: So you said we should have a sign, "No Mayavadi Meetings Allowed."
Prabhupada: No. If this is allowed free.
Tamala Krsna: Oh. Well, this wasn't free. They're paying for being here. They're paying to be here.
Prabhupada: Oh.
Tamala Krsna: They're paying to hold their program.
Prabhupada: No gratis lecture allowed. If they pay for, they will talk all nonsense, (laughter) and we don't care for it. These are the considerations. That's all right. Turn me this side.
Tamala Krsna: Okay. Prabhupada, you should take some rest now, I think. You've been talking a long time. (end)

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