I do not actually accommodate all this knowledge. Please help me
Audio
Yasodanandana: ...pattern of the Bhagavatam and follow the description. In the Chapter Sixteen, where it is expressed that "Bhu-mandala extends as far as the sun spreads its light and heat and as far as the moon and all the stars can be seen," that was the first verse. Then it describes that "The roving wheels of Maharaja Priyavrata's chariot created seven ditches in which the seven oceans came into existence. Because of these seven oceans, which are described here..."
Tamala Krsna: This was done before we began, by another artist.
Yasodanandana: This is the Jambudvipa planetary system. The complete is the Bhu-mandala. This is Jambudvipa. This is the salt ocean, and these various oceans here, they correspond to the oceans which are described in the Bhagavatam in that Chapter Five, Sixteenth Chapter, second verse: "Because of these seven oceans, Bhu-mandala is divided into seven islands." Then, in the third verse, it describes that this universe is the universal form of the Lord. The fourth verse describes... Sukadeva Gosvami says he will explain the Bhurloka. In the fifth verse he starts to be more precise about the Bhu-mandala planetary system. It says, "It resembles a lotus flower." It has the shape of a lotus flower. "And the seven islands of Jambudvipa resemble the whorl of that flower." Then, "The length and breadth of that island known as Jambudvipa..."
Tamala Krsna: This we did.
Yasodanandana: This one. "...which is situated in middle..." This Jambudvipa corresponds to this one here in this big map. "The length and breadth of this is 100,000 yojanas." That means from its north to the south and from the west to the east it's 800,000 miles, according to this fifth verse.
Tamala Krsna: So our map here, Srila Prabhupada, one centimeter equals 2,000 yojanas. So this is twenty centimeters..., er, this is fifty centimeters, so it equals 100,000 yojanas. It also... For anyone who is counting, four of these boxes equals one centimeter. So simply by counting this, one can understand how many yojanas each thing... This is exactly to scale. It's done very precisely to scale.
Yasodanandana: And it describes, "In Jambudvipa there are nine divisions of land, each with a length of 9,000 yojanas, 72,000 miles: Bharata-varsa, Kimpurusa-varsa, Hari-varsa, Bhadra-varsa, Ilavrta-varsa, Ketumala-varsa, Ramyaka-varsa, Hiranmaya-varsa, and Kuru-varsa. There are eight mountains that mark the boundaries of these divisions and separate them nicely. Starting with the Himalayas"-that's the first mountain-"Hemakuta Parvata"-second mountain-"Nisadha Parvata"-third mountain-it goes... This... "Gandhamadana Parvata, which is the east side of Sumeru, and then Malyavan Mountain on the west side..."
Bhakti-prema: Nila Mountain, north; Sveta mountain, next; and Srṅgavan Mountain, north.
Yasodanandana: Maybe you can explain that Sanskrit purport also? Read.
Bhakti-prema:Dhanurvat samsthite jneye dve varse daksinottare. It is bow-shaped. Bharata-varsa is bow-shaped, and this Bhadra-varsa also is again bow-shaped, Kuru-varsa, again bow-shaped, and this Ketumala-varsa, again. So dve varse samsthite jneye, dve varse daksinottare. Dirghani tatra catvari caturasram ilavrtam iti daksinottare bharatottara-kuru-varse catvari kimpurusa-harivarsa-ramyaka-hiranmayani varsani. That means thirty-four yojanas...
Prabhupada: Thousand yojanas.
Bhakti-prema: ...square. Thirty-four thousand yojanas in [indistinct], in this. Kimpurusa-varsa. This is Kimpurusa-varsa. That is between Himalaya and Hemakuta Mountain. And again Hari-varsa is between Hemakuta Mountain and Nisadha Mountain. And this Ramyaka...
Prabhupada: Where is geographical description of this?
Tamala Krsna: They don't even know they exist.
Prabhupada: Little description of the Himalayas.
Tamala Krsna: That's all.
Prabhupada: That is also not sufficient. In Europe, when we go over the mountain, huge mountainous tract, who knows about it? We are passing just like on a roof, aeroplane. You have seen? Huge. They have no information what is there. And Switzerland...
Tamala Krsna: Switzerland.
Prabhupada: ...I have seen mountain goat. Where it has gone, nobody knows. Still.
Bhakti-prema: In Srimad-Bhagavatam it is described more or less. Himalaya Mountain is 80,000 miles high and 16,000 miles wide. So each of these mountains are 16,000 miles wide and 80,000 miles high. And that means it is start from Badrinath up to Siberia. That is 60,000 miles, er, 16,000.
Prabhupada: But height, they have no...
Bhakti-prema: Height, 80,000 miles high.
Prabhupada: Eighty thousand.
Bhakti-prema: We cannot measure. Aeroplane cannot...
Prabhupada: You have measured only 28,000.
Tamala Krsna: Feet.
Prabhupada: Eh?
Yasodanandana: Feet.
Prabhupada: It is feet only. [laughs]
Yasodanandana: That is only three and a half yojanas, and we say it is 80,000 miles high.
Prabhupada: Read, somebody.
Bhakti-prema: And they can travel only 800 miles high, the birds in the sky, but according to Srimad-Bhagavatam, after 800 miles there is air to breath for a human being. But there is no air for ghost and pisacas and other different species. But if we move... There are Siddhas and Caranas. They are also living there. And above that, there is Rahu planet. That means 80,000 miles high.
Prabhupada: That means Rahu planet we have connection.
Bhakti-prema: Yes. Rahu. And above that Rahu there is sun planet, and Sumeru mountain has connection with that because it is hurling again...
Yasodanandana: It says right here.
Bhakti-prema: 80,000 miles high.
Prabhupada: Do it nicely.
Yasodanandana: It is mentioned that this Sumeru Parvata, the mountain's height is the same as the width of Jambudvipa. So this mountain comes up to here, the same distance as this, 100,000 yojanas. So it's perfectly... This is the same length on this side and also like this. It's made like a big..., a big cone on top. It describes, "Of that mountain, Sumeru Parvata, 16,000 yojanas, or 128,000 miles, are within, under." So Sumeru is like this, and it also goes under the Jambudvipa planetary system. And therefore the mountain's head above the earth, above here, there is 84,000 yojanas, 672,000 miles above the level. And the mountain's width, the mountain on top, is considered to be 32,000 yojanas, or 256,000 miles. And in the bottom it's 16,000 yojanas. Scientists cannot conceive of this. Their estimation of a mountain is that it must be bigger in the bottom and end up smaller at the top, but Mount Meru is twice as big in the top than it is in the bottom. They cannot understand. Next verse, it describes the different divisions. "Just north of Ilavrta-varsa and going further northward, one after another, are three mountains, namely Nila Mountain, Sveta Mountain and Srṅgavan Mountain. These mark the borders of the three varsas, namely Ramyaka, Hiranmaya and Kuru, and separate them from one another. The width of these mountains is 2000..."
Prabhupada: And it was not possible for me to digest. [laughs] Somebody else helped me to... I am a layman. I do not know.
Tamala Krsna: So how did you write it?
Prabhupada: That somebody, Krsna, has taken my pen.
Yasodanandana: And these mountains, they extend to the beaches. "It is considered, according to the Bhaga..."
Prabhupada: When I was writing, I was praying Krsna that "I do not actually accommodate all this knowledge. Please help me." Yes. That's all right.
Bhakti-prema: It is mentioned that all other worlds are there only in Treta-yuga all the time. No Kali-yuga, simply Treta and Dvapara. Only Treta-yuga is all the time.
Prabhupada: Oh. Yajato makhaih.
Bhakti-prema: Yes. Yajato makhaih.
Prabhupada: They are always engaged in ritualistic sacrifices. How present life... Tretayam yajato makhaih.
Bhakti-prema: Yes. So they lived for ten thousand years.
Prabhupada: Ten, they are...
Bhakti-prema: Thousand years.
Prabhupada: Ten thousand years. Our six months equal to their one day.
Bhakti-prema: That is called demigod.
Prabhupada: Yes, they are demigod.
Bhakti-prema: No, they are not demigod.
Prabhupada: No, they are not demigod.
Yasodanandana: Then it describes in verse number nine that "South of Ilavrta-varsa extending from east to west are the great..., three great mountains named Nisadha Parvata, Hemakuta Parvata and Himalaya. Each of them is 10,000 yojanas high, 80,000 miles high." That means... The scientists have understood that the Himalayas are three and a half miles high, but we say... How much the Himalayas? Twenty-eight... Five and a half miles high. We say it's 80,000 miles high. The Bhagavatam says.
Prabhupada: They could not measure the whole thing. That is not possible.
Yasodanandana: Then it describes here that "On the west and east of Ilavrta-varsa," west and east, "are two great mountains named Malyavan and Gandhamadana respectively. These two mountains, which are 2,000 yojanas, 16,000 miles..." [break] "...in the north and Nisadha mountain in the south. They indicate the borders of Ilavrta-varsa and also the varsas named as Ketumala-varsa," here, "and Bhadrasva-varsa." Then it gets into more details regarding Mount Meru. "Text number eleven. On the four sides of the great mountain known as Sumeru are four mountains," these Mandara Parvata. This is the mountain.
Prabhupada: So how you'll show actually?
Bhakti-prema: This is according to Srimad-Bhagavatam.
Prabhupada: No, that's all right. Now, that doll, that you have to make.
Yasodanandana: We are calling one artist from Mayapur. Tamala Krsna Maharaja has arranged to bring one artist, so we're going to draw perspectives. We're going to draw this and all... [break]
Prabhupada: We have some artist. We have... That's all. That is perfect.
Bhakti-prema: Thus I heard. It is also repeated in Upanisads, iti susruma dhiranam.
Prabhupada: This...
Bhakti-prema: From the intelligence [indistinct].
Yasodanandana: This knowledge will actually destroy their misconceptions, 'cause most people think that previously, to five thousand years ago, people used to be barbarians. But if they were barbarians and they knew the whole description of the universe, they must have been very advanced.
Bhakti-prema: This is Lokaloka Mountain. We've been drawing that.
Tamala Krsna: We're simply following your Bhagavatam description, Srila Prabhupada.
Prabhupada: Not that... Iti susruma... [break]
Bhakti-prema: Except this Kimpurusa-varsa and other varsas in the mountain area, these are part of gross world, subtle world. So how we will mention it?
Prabhupada: Mention it by picture.
Bhakti-prema: So how we will expose it before scientists?
Prabhupada: We do not require to satisfy the scientists. We have to describe according to our book. That's all. If they can understand, let them understand. Otherwise... It is not our business to satisfy the so-called scientists. We are giving the real description. [break] That they do not know.
Upendra: Not like that, no. There have been some clouds.
Prabhupada: Something in the sea turns right, and the whole thing becomes exactly opposite. [break]
Tamala Krsna: ...the original Laṅka. Ceylon, of course, is there, but it is not Laṅka.
Prabhupada: Ceylon is different.
Tamala Krsna: Yes. Who knows what else we will discover today. These things... When we are actually...
Prabhupada: The Andaman, Nicobar Islands...
Tamala Krsna: What did you say, Srila Prabhupada?
Prabhupada: There are other islands.
Tamala Krsna: Yes.
Prabhupada: Andaman, Nicobar, like that.
Tamala Krsna: Oh. But we're not... Bhakti-prema Maharaja said that yesterday... He was going to look through the commentaries to try and understand which these referred to in present-day's, you know, geography. He wasn't certain about. He only knew that one was...
Prabhupada: There are nearby islands. I don't know whether it is... Andaman, Nicobar Islands. So those islands similarly from India were sent. Now it is inhabited. [break] ...work is stopped on account of your [indistinct]?
Tamala Krsna: No. [break] No, I mean in terms of our drawings and things, will we be... Will you be staying here for a little while still, in Vrndavana?
Prabhupada: Why not?
Tamala Krsna: I mean, you have no... I'm just trying to think in terms of pacing ourselves, what the schedule...
Prabhupada: No, we can stay here unless business is finished. There is no other engagement.
Tamala Krsna: No. The only other engagement is the opening of Bombay temple coming up. But that's not until the end of October.
Prabhupada: So time is up? Not yet.
Tamala Krsna: Well, any time... [break] Did you get a little rest? The sun wasn't disturbing? [break] Always you came out victorious. Always. I have never seen you ever defeated. In Bombay it was absolutely impossible. It seemed to be impossible.
Prabhupada: Nobody encouraged.
Tamala Krsna: No.
Prabhupada: Nobody, not a single man. Who could see such a big project would come out?
Tamala Krsna: Only you could see that, you and Radha-Rasa-vihari. I was...
Prabhupada: Nobody... Still, I was determined: "No, this place is very nice."
Tamala Krsna: They should write a book about that.
Prabhupada: Yes, it is worth writing, history. Mayapur also. Madhava Maharaja will not allow, allow.
Tamala Krsna: So many tricks he played through that...
Prabhupada: Similarly, Tirtha Maharaja was no wanted me to... Here also there was one ring.
Tamala Krsna: Right.
Prabhupada: This girl had to introduce behind.
Tamala Krsna: And she didn't give the front piece. At first, she didn't give...
Prabhupada: Didn't give.
Tamala Krsna: Now she has given, but at first... But still, you said, "Build a wall." Hyderabad also there was a little dispute. Everything was a struggle. [break] Our temple is the best-in Mayapur, Vrndavana, Hyderabad, Bombay.
Satadhanya: All the people think that our Deities are made of gold. They've never seen so shiny and such srṅgara before.
Tamala Krsna: Here?
Prabhupada: In Mayapur.
Satadhanya: In Mayapur especially.
Tamala Krsna: Yeah. [break]
Prabhupada: ...wanted to see our asrama. Is it not?
Satadhanya: Yes.
Prabhupada: All inhabitants of Navadvipa.
Tamala Krsna: Prabhupada said we should get two..., some launch. Just like in Rishikesh there's some launches and they take people free of charge back and forth, Prabhupada said we should do that, take people back and forth from Navadvipa Ghata.
Prabhupada: Not Navadvipa Ghata. Others, from...
Tamala Krsna: Oh, Swarupganj?
Satadhanya: Navadvipa.
Prabhupada: Navadvipa side.
Tamala Krsna: From Navadvipa side?
Prabhupada: Where you take bath, just opposite.
Tamala Krsna: Oh. Right now there's nothing over there on that side.
Prabhupada: So you have to arrange for that.
Tamala Krsna: Oh, I see. We could buy... Actually, there was some land being offered to us. It went right from the road all the way to the river. There was a strip of land belonging to that Gaura Maharaja. Remember Gaura Maharaja?
Prabhupada: Ha, ha, ha.
Tamala Krsna: So there was one piece of land that he had. There's a little temple there. And it goes all the way from the road right up to the Gaṅga. So we could have a little ghata there, and the boat would dock. Yeah, that's a very good idea, because if it goes from where the other boats go, then the boat wallas will cause trouble. But now they... They could not protest if we make our own place.
Prabhupada: Arrange like that. You have understood?
Satadhanya: Yes, Prabhupada.
Tamala Krsna: [whispering to Satadhanya] Get a donation. It's only about ten thousand. Motorboat.
Prabhupada: Next get the two boats like that.
Tamala Krsna: Two boats. At Rishikesh they have boats. The boat is about the length of this...
Prabhupada: Now it is half past nine.
Tamala Krsna: Yes, Srila Prabhupada. [break]
Prabhupada: See how they are satisfied. [break] [end]