Room Conversation

September 11, 1976, Vrndavana
Prabhupada: "The Baba personifies heaven." (?) (Him?)
Hari-sauri: Yes. He said, "Baba personifies this philosophy, that God in man and man in God is the basis of religion. As he told me, "God is man and man is God. All of us have something of God, the divine spark, within us. All men are divine like myself, with the spirit embodied in human flesh and bone. The only difference is that they are unaware of this Godhood."
Prabhupada: Unaware. So God, how he's unaware? Just see.
Hari-sauri: They make God so cheap.
Prabhupada: The rascal.
Hari-sauri: This is... And then the next part's even worse. "For the doubting or confused minority, to which section I then belonged, Swamiji has this message. "Those who want to secure pearls from the sea have to dive deep to fetch them. It does not help them to dabble among the shallow waves near the shore and say that the sea has no pearls and that all stories about them are false. Likewise, if a person wants to secure the love and grace of the avatara he must also dive deep and get submerged in Sai Baba. Then only will he become one with me and carry me in his innermost heart."
Prabhupada: Everyone can say like that. What you have done as God? God is an Indian. Making things very complicated.
Hari-sauri: Yes, and this man goes on to describe the aura. He goes on to describe how spiritual his presence is. They chant omkara. They chant omkara.
Prabhupada: So, anything about us? He criticized "God is an Indian," that is a criticism.
Hari-sauri: No, no. This is a glorification. He's a nationalist; so he's saying God is an Indian. 'Cause it's supposed to be very good.
Prabhupada: How God can be Indian? Then how he's God? God must be for everyone. An Indian God.
Hari-sauri: He says here that he is the image of Krsna incarnate.
Prabhupada: He says?
Hari-sauri: He says, "They say that he's Siva and Parvati combined together. He certainly embodies both masculinity and femininity. Krsna, as we read of Him in the scriptures, must have resembled Swamiji. His walk is that of a dancer floating in a graceful movement."
Prabhupada: All right. I will take rest.
Hari-sauri: You want to keep this?
Prabhupada: No, no. (breakmoves to garden)
Hari-sauri: They're all Mayavadis. He was just...
Pradyumna: I was just underlining that thing and...
Prabhupada: So you write. I've already told you. I cannot speak now. You write. I have given you already hints.
Pradyumna: Avyaktam vyaktim apannam. He says, "I come from the formless." But Krsna says anyone who says that is abuddhayah.
Prabhupada: Besides that, He says in another place that as they pass through our existence... [break] ...in future we shall continue, then when he becomes avyakta?
Pradyumna: Yes. Past existence he was, future existence he will be when he becomes...
Prabhupada: Past, present, future, there are three times. So if every time he is person, when he becomes imperson?
Hari-sauri: And this thing about God is an Indian.
Prabhupada: And God is an Indian, that is also rascaldom. He says, sarva-yonisu kaunteya sambhavanti murtayah yah, aham bija-pradah pita [Bg. 14.4]. So how He's Indian? Throughout the whole universe, as many forms of body are there, He is the father. So how he is Indian? If the father is Indian, then the son is also Indian. So father is not Indian, so how the God can be Indian?
Prabhupada: Tanum asritam. This concept of Indian, European is there because you are a mudha. Just directly charge him. Directly. That "You are a mudha, you are a rascal," immediately. Let him speak. And send it to the newspaper that this letter we have sent challenging this rascal, let him reply. If he does not reply, silent, that means he's accepts he's a rascal.
Hari-sauri: Yes, because Blitz has taken up to advertise that he's God, so now they should accept challenge.
Pradyumna: He said self-realization is God-realization.
Prabhupada: But you are not self-realized. You are madman, rascal. How you can be self-realized? A madman cannot be self-realized.
Hari-sauri: Yes. And if he was Krsna before, how is it he's disagreeing with what the Bhagavad-gita says?
Prabhupada: You are not Krsna. Because if you were Krsna, then how you can be a rascal? Krsna is not a rascal. (end)

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