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Morning Walk

May 18, 1975, Perth
Prabhupada: Christ said, "Thou shalt not kill." They killed Christ. This is the position.
Amogha: When Buddha came, did most people follow Him?
Prabhupada: Yes.
Amogha: And they stopped their (indistinct).
Prabhupada: Yes. In their religion animal-killing is strictly forbidden.
Amogha: Did Sankara, did he physically force the Buddhists out of India, by force?
Prabhupada: No.
Amogha: Or just teaching.
Prabhupada: By argument, by teaching. [break] Just see how nice flower is coming from the sand. And they say there is no vegetation. What is the difference between this sand and that sand? Sand is sand. Huh? How they are coming? Wherefrom they are getting nourishment? If there no possibility of living being, who is coming to water it? Nobody is coming. In this place, flower, it is a good as the flower growing on the land. But they are growing in the sand, you see. You see actually in the sand things are coming out, and one rascal will say, "No, there is no life." We have to believe it? Even it is full of sand and dust. Here we see dust and sand produce life, so why shall I believe these rascals about sand? What is the difference between that sand and this sand?
Amogha: Some scientists admit there is life there, there may be life...
Prabhupada: No, no, these scientists are all rascals; first of all take it, don't believe it. "Some scientists say"; then who is real scientist? This scientist says there is no life, another scientist says there may be, then who is right, hm?
Amogha: They have to go and see. (laughs) But they don't see any signs of civilization or buildings, so they say it may be plant life, but they don't see anything...
Prabhupada: First of all whether you have gone there. That is our charge, "You have not gone there."
Amogha: That's what we are trying to do. In a few years we will find out.
Prabhupada: Yes. They might have gone to some hellish planet, where there is only sand, only, and very hot, and the culprit is pushed through that deserted place to the Yamaraja. And before going to Yamaraja he has to suffer so much. There are places, copperlike, you see. (aside:) Hare Krsna. So hot, and the criminal has to go on that copper land. There are mentioned for many millions of miles simply copper, and one has to pass through that to Yamaraja. So, they might have gone to some such place, not to the moon planet, who is the source of vegetation even throughout the whole universe—and in his own planet there is no vegetation. Now I am sure they have not gone to moon planet. How they will go? It is beyond the sun. I was protesting that they have not gone; now I am convinced that they have not gone. The Russian scientists and the American scientists joined on the platform, "Don't expose me, I don't expose you." (laughter) (Bengali) "You have to do your business and same I have to do my business. Let us support one another." In all other case, they are inimical, and the scientific field they are friends. That means that if a scientist, another scientist, opposes me, then my attempt will be futile, so let us don't do it.
Srutakirti: You don't expose me, and I won't expose you.
Prabhupada: Because we are doing business, we are getting money from these rascal government, so if you expose me, then I will not get money, and if I expose you, you will not get money. Let us remain together and let them remain fools. That's all. This is it. If a common man like me can understand the whole policy, how the scientist will not understand? But they have made a compromise that "Don't expose me, I'll not expose you, and let us take money from the government." This is going on.
Amogha: So the big demons are cheating the small demons, but they're all demons.
Prabhupada: The big animal eats the small animal. But the big animal, because he's big, does it mean that he's not animal? He's also animal. The tiger eats a dog. Does that mean the tiger is not animal? The dog is animal, the tiger is also. Animal, he is god who knows how to live without these animals—that is human life. So, why shall I eat animals? I shall eat fruits, I shall eat vegetables, I shall eat nice food grains, I shall drink milk. That is human. Why shall I eat animals' blood and flesh? "No, it is very tasteful." (laughter) So what is the difference between you and dog?
Amogha: They don't know how to cook, the dogs.
Prabhupada: Well, nature has made them like that. The human beings, they can utilize the land, they can produce so many nice foodstuffs. That is human society. What is this society? They are living in big, big skyscraper building, and for their food the slaughterhouse killing, and they are eating. Is that human civilization? All third class, fourth class men.
Amogha: If they would only listen, they will be defenseless, but they don't listen much.
Prabhupada: Yes, they go away, "My time is over." (laughs)
Amogha: Yes. "I am busy. I must go."
Prabhupada: His energy is over. Not time is over, but his energy is over. He see that "We cannot argue with this man."
Srutakirti: He'll not give us a chance. [break] (speaking to another devotee) Wouldn't it be better if you make his breakfast?
Devotee: Certainly.
Prabhupada: I've talked with many psychiatric scientists in Los Angeles.
Devotee: Yes.
Prabhupada: All of them (indistinct). Even our own scientist.
Amogha: (laughs) Yes.
Prabhupada: Therefore he is now writing books. He is afraid of writing these such books, because his brother scientists may not like it.
Devotee: Oh.
Prabhupada: Yes.
Srutakirti: It is like the Russians and the Americans. He doesn't want to offend the other scientists. (laughs)
Prabhupada: If the other scientists condemn him, then he will not get service.
Srutakirti: That's right.
Devotee: All glories to Srila Prabhupada. (devotees offer obeisances)
Prabhupada: You can write one essay, I'll give you some hints. Bring your notebook and Bhagavad-gita also. The defect of human society is that..., present human society is that there is no high-class men. The Bhagavad-gita says, asocyan anvasocas tvam prajna-vadams ca bhasase [Bg. 2.11].
Amogha: Asocam?
Prabhupada: Asocyan
Amogha: Asocyan. Is that Chapter Sixteen?
Prabhupada: No, second.
Amogha: A-s-a-o? A-s-a-u?
Prabhupada: A-s-o.
Amogha: Asocyan anvasocas tvam [Bg. 2.11]. Hm. Two, eleven.
Prabhupada: What is it?
Amogha: (reads Sanskrit and translation to Bg. 2.11)
Prabhupada: So, these classes of men are now predominant.
Amogha: They are what?
Srutakirti: Predominant.
Amogha: Predominant.
Prabhupada: Yes. They are taking care only of this body which is—dead or alive—it is not subject matter of seriousness. I shall tell you later on.
Amogha: Excuse me.
Prabhupada: I'll tell you later on.
Amogha: Okay.
Prabhupada: (taking prasadam) (indistinct) But it has got some arrangement, it does not fall down.
Amogha: Yeah, well they accept that also. They say only if there is no such arrangement, then it will fall down.
Prabhupada: That means conditional. And who makes that condition? That means ultimately you have to accept the existence of God.
Srutakirti: Just like they say the moon does not go away because the earth is attracting it.
Prabhupada: Oh. What is earth? (laughs) All bogus.
Amogha: But if we tell that that there is no law of gravity, they will say that why is it that if you throw up a ball then it comes down?
Prabhupada: It comes down, heavy, then it comes down, that's all. (laughs)
Amogha: But that heaviness they say is gravity.
Prabhupada: You can call anything. (laughs) But if Krsna desires, a football may not fall. Just like so many planets, they are carried up by the air. All these planets are moving only by the air. So the heavy land, heavy cloud is carried by the air. It is a question of adjustment of air, not the law of gravity. Now the whole universal planetary system are floating and rotating round the polestar. Is it law of gravity, they are rotating? It is the arrangement of the air, by the air it is up. Just like there is dust storm, so many are floating in the air. There is no question of law of gravity; it is the air. And the who is controlling the air? That is Supreme Personality. Just like in Darwin, the motor buses were floating by the air. It was a great storm there?
Amogha: Yes, hurricane.
Prabhupada: Huh? Hurricane?
Amogha: On Christmas day.
Prabhupada: Motor buses were floating. Is that law of gravity? Air, different adjustment of air. If Krsna desires, simply by air this whole city will be devastated. The other day we saw so many trees fell from (New?) Kuruksetra. All trees and houses will be smashed within half an hour if some hurricane is sent. Poking nose in the affairs of God. They'll simply try to prove that there is no God. This is their attempt. And they say "nature." What is this nature? Nature is an instrument, machine. The authority is God, Krsna. So I have given the right name, fourth-class men, not even third class. All fourth class. Sudra. Sudra and less than sudra. This is the whole pack of population at the present moment. First-class man, his definition is there: sama, dama, tapa, saucam, titiksa, arjavam, jnana, vijnana, astikyam. That is first-class. They are snatching a motorcar mechanic as first class. Because he knows some mechanical arrangement how to do it, he is first class. Such things are being done by the demons. Machine or wonderful building, these are done by the demons. Now to begin? Time will come(?)?
Srutakirti: You wanted to shave your head? Yeah?
Prabhupada: Ah, there is time?
Srutakirti: Yeah, we are leaving at twelve-thirty. So we have two hours. That is sufficient.
Prabhupada: Hm. The world is full of rascals and fourth-class men. That is our verdict, Krsna's verdict. A human being does not know God, he's no better than dog. He is dog. Who knows God? There are so many scientists, philosophers, now everywhere. And they are discussing on sex philosophy, homosex philosophy, Darwin's theory. All third class, fourth class, they are controlling. Now they are gradually coming to chaotic condition, and their problems, engage so many big, big officials how to solve. Oh, why you created problem, first of all? You third-class, fourth-class men, you have created problem, and now we are trying to make solution—another problem. And because you are the same fourth-class men, how you can make a solution? You have created the problems. The man who creates problems, can he make solution? So you are the same fourth-class man, how you can make a solution? Bring first-class man. But there are no first-class men. All rogues and rascals. Things are becoming bad to worse, and still they'll claim, "We are first class."
Amogha: They are all rascals, so the best rascal they say he is first-class. First-class rascal.
Prabhupada: That I was explaining, big animal and small animal. Cats and dogs praising one lion.
Amogha: Hm.
Prabhupada: A lion is also an animal. But they are thinking, "Oh, one lion." But we are thinking that it is also animal. The cats and dogs, they are thinking, "Oh, lion is so big, so powerful." But human being is thinking this is also an animal, big animal. Is it not? (laughs) Tell them. Cats and dogs may praise some another animal, tiger and... But are the tigers other than animal? He is also animal.
Devotee: Hare Krsna. [break]
Prabhupada: When I was saying that we are creating first-class men. So are you, are you claiming that you are first-class?
Amogha: Yes, he was asking us. Yes, he said, "Have you become?" (laughter)
Prabhupada: What did you say?
Amogha: I said we are becoming. Yes, we can see. (offers obeisances) (end)

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