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matir na krsne paratah svato va
mitho 'bhipadyeta grha-vratanam
adanta-gobhir visatam tamisram
punah punas carvita-carvananam
So we are trying to spread this Krsna consciousness movement. It is very difficult task because people are so much addicted to material enjoyment that they do not like this movement, Krsna consciousness, although this is the objective, aim, and ultimate goal of human life: how to revive our Krsna consciousness. Since we have forgotten Krsna... Krsna means God. Krsnas tu bhagavan svayam [SB 1.3.28]. This is the verdict of the Vedic literature, that people are searching after God, making great research work to find out what is God. Most people, they are not interested in God. At the present moment, especially in this Kali-yuga, they are not interested in God consciousness.
Why they are not interested in God consciousness? That is stated in Bhagavad-gita:
Krsna says, "These classes of men, namely..." First is the duskrtina. Duskrtina means always engaged in sinful activities. Krti. Krti means very meritorious, very intelligent, krti, this word. But duskrti: their merit is being utilized in sinful activities. They are called duskrti. They could be utilized for making this life perfect, but instead of doing that, they are engaged in sinful activities. Sinful activities means sense gratification. Sense gratification, they are... When one becomes very much addicted to sense gratification... The symptoms are very prominent in this age. Everyone is working very hard simply for sense gratification. And as soon as you take this life of sense gratification, you are sure to commit sinful activities. For example, throughout the whole world there are so many breweries manufacturing liquor. Especially in the Western countries you will find so many, the advertisement, liquor advertisement, whiskey advertisement, cigarette advertisement. And what to speak of slaughterhouse? There are many, many hundreds and thousands of slaughterhouse. And innocent animals are being killed all over the world unnecessarily. People can live with food grains. That is allowed for the all living entities. In the Bhagavad-gita it is said, annad bhavanti bhutani: [Bg. 3.14] "Simply by growing food grains, both the animals and the man, they can live very happily." And you can grow food grains very easily. I have seen in the Western countries, they are growing food grains for the animals, and the food grains are eaten by the animals, and the animal is eaten by man. They are producing food grains. What is the statistics that the animal eating food grains, the same time, the same amount food grains can be eaten by so many men?
Brahmananda: The acreage... For a cow to eat requires so many acres for that one cow, and then that cow is slaughtered and it only feeds a few men, whereas that same acreage could feed hundreds of men by grains.
Devotee: Seventeen times.
Prabhupada: So these things are to be noted, how they are engaged in sinful activities. And the solution is given in the Bhagavad-gita, that "Produce food grain." Annad bhavanti bhutani.
So I see in your this Mauritius land, you have got enough land to produce food grains. You produce food grain. I understand that instead of growing food grains, you are growing sugar cane for exporting. Why? And you are dependent on food grains, on rice, wheat, dahl. Why? Why this attempt? You first of all grow your own eatables. And if there is time and if your population has got sufficient food grains, then you can try to grow other fruits and vegetables for exporting. The first necessity is that you should be self-sufficient. That is God's arrangement. Everywhere there is sufficient land to produce food grains, not only in your country. I have traveled all over the world—Africa, Australia, and other, in America also. There are so much land vacant that if we produce food grains, then we can feed ten times as much population as at the present moment. There is no question of scarcity. The whole creation is so made by Krsna that everything is purnam, complete. Purnam idam purnam adah purnat purnam udacyate, purnasya purnam adaya purnam evavasisyate [Iso Invocation]. If we don't produce food grain—you require it—and put unnecessarily men into scarcity, that is sinful. That is sinful. Everything, every instruction for our happy life and to advance in Krsna consciousness and make life perfect
Unfortunately, we do not know what is the perfect life. Therefore it is said here, punah punas carvita-carvananam: [SB 7.5.30] "chewing the chewed." If we don't make our life perfect Perfect means stop this business of chewing the chewed. Punah punas carvita-carvananam. Now, suppose we have got this human form of life. Now, by our pious activities we may be elevated to the higher planetary system, Svargaloka, heavenly planet. But what we shall gain there? The same sense gratification, in higher standard, that's all. Just like sense gratification is there in the society of the cats and dogs, sense gratification is there in one country, in another country, but the arrangement is, may be, little different. But the pleasure of sense gratification is the same, either you enjoy it as a dog, as a human being, or as a demigod. The sense gratification pleasure is not different. It is the same. So we are, in this material world, we are changing our body, tatha dehantara-praptih [Bg. 2.13], and enjoying sense gratification. That is called punah punas carvita-carvananam [SB 7.5.30], again chewing the chewed. I have tasted it in this life or that life; again I am trying to that. So this business, when we are disgusted with this business, that is called knowledge. So that knowledge and that renunciation, or detachment, can be achieved only by Krsna consciousness. Only by Krsna consciousness. It is clearly stated in the Bhagavad-gita, janma karma ca me divyam yo janati tattvatah [Bg. 4.9]. If we simply study Krsna in truth, then tyaktva deham punar janma naiti mam eti kaunteya: [Bg. 4.9] then the result will be that after giving up this present body he will not have to accept another material body. To accept another material body, that is called punah punas carvita-carvananam [SB 7.5.30]. Either I get this human form of body, either get as the body of a dog or either I get the body of a demigod, the business is the same, ahara-nidra-bhaya-maithunam ca: eating, sleeping, and sex life, and defense. Don't think that the heavenly planet, they are very safe. We have got information from Bhagavatam. Lord Indra, he is always perplexed. So many demons disturbing, the fighting is going on, although they have got a long duration of life, ten thousands of years, their duration of life. And their one day is equal to our six months.
So this way our life is being spoiled, and it can be stopped only by Krsna consciousness. But this Krsna consciousness... Prahlada Maharaja saying that "This Krsna consciousness cannot be achieved by grha-vratanam." Grha-vratanam means those who are interested in this family life or sense gratification life. For them it is very difficult. The talking was going on between the father and the son. The son is Prahlada. He is a devotee. And the father, Hiranyakasipu, he is materialistic person. He is interested in money and women. So this is the difference between devotee and nondevotee. So father was challenging his son, "Where you got this Krsna consciousness?" So the son replied flatly that matir na krsne paratah svato va: "My dear father, this Krsna consciousness cannot be achieved by speculation or by hearing from others." Matir na... Parata means hearing from others, and svatah, svata means personally by mental speculation or philosophical speculation. Mitho. Mitho means by congregational meeting, by conferences. Why? Now, grha-vratanam. If one is addicted to this material way of life, he cannot understand, or cannot be convinced, about Krsna consciousness. In the Bhagavad-gita also, it is said that,
Those who are too much attached for materialistic way of life—means sense gratification... Materialistic way of life means sense gratification. What is the difference between spiritual life and material life? These boys, these boys from Europe and America, they have adopted this spiritual life means they have stopped the process of sense gratification—no illicit sex, no meat-eating, no gambling, no intoxication. This is materialistic way of life. Otherwise where is the difference between this life and that life?
So if we stick to the materialistic way of life, it will be very, very difficult to understand this Krsna consciousness movement. Matir na krsne paratah svato va mitho 'bhipadyeta grha-vratanam. Why? Now, adanta-gobhih. Adanta means uncontrolled. Uncontrolled. Our senses are uncontrolled. This morning, while I was walking on the beach, we found so many things, the capsule of the Coca-cola, cigarette butts and so many other things. So what is the necessity of this Coca-cola? You don't find all these things in our society. We don't drink Coca-cola. We don't drink Pepsi-cola. We don't smoke. So many things which are selling in the market in huge quantity by advertisement, by victimizing the poor customer... But they are called unnecessary things. There is no need of such things. But adanta-gobhih, because the senses cannot be controlled, they are making business. They are making business, unnecessary thing. So we have to control the senses. If we really want spiritual life, if we really want to be free from these material clutches, then we have to learn how to control the senses. That is wanted. That is the purpose of human life. Now... That is the purpose of human life. Human life is not meant for imitating the life of cats and dogs and hogs. That is not human life.
This morning there was press representative. So they came to take some information. Our first information is that we are trying to bring human being to the standard of human being from the standard of cats' and dogs' life. This is Krsna consciousness... Cats' and dogs' life means these adanta-go, uncontrolled senses. That is cats' and dogs' life. Just like one dog, one female dog, is surrounded by one dozen male dogs. Why? Adanta-gobhih: they cannot control their senses. On the street they are having sex. They cannot control the senses. Adanta-gobhih. So human life means control the senses. That is human life. If you remain like cats and dogs, adanta-gobhih, without controlling the senses, then where is the difference between dog and you? There is no difference. Actually that is being accepted at the present moment. The so-called civilization means to allow the senses to enjoy as far as possible. This is advancement of civilization. The same example: Just we can be very happy by eating the food grains which must we have to produce either for me or for the animal. Without producing food grain you cannot even eat the meat. Because they want food grains, they want vegetables, so you have to produce. But because we have uncontrolled senses, instead of eating the grains, we are eating the animals. So this is called adanta-gobhih. We do not consider that "The life which I am killing for my subsistence, it is eating grain, and I can also eat grain. So why shall I commit this sinful life by killing another living being?" So you cannot do that. You are not allowed to kill even an ant. Just like in any state suppose one man is useless; he is not doing anything. So you cannot kill. The state will take step. You will have to be hanged. You cannot say that "This man was useless; it has no utility for the society. Therefore I have killed him." No. That is consideration of the human being. That is man-made law. But God-made laws, any living being, if you kill, the same punishment. But that we do not know on account of our uncontrolled senses. Adanta-gobhir visatam tamisram. We do not know that by killing innocent animals we are going to the darkest region of hellish life. Actually that is happening now, hellish life. The child is in the womb of the mother; it is hellish condition, with stool, urine, it is floating. And there also the life is not safe because at the modern advanced civilization the child is being killed even by the mother. This is going on.
So we do not know subtle laws of nature, subtle laws of God, how things are happening, how things are going on. And without knowing these facts, our human life is spoiled. So the Krsna consciousness movement is trying to convince, educate people the value of life, how the process of living conditions are going on. Not we have manufactured all this. It is received from the Vedas. Vedas means the book of knowledge. Veda means knowledge. Vetti veda vido jnane. Jnana means knowledge. So human life is meant for taking knowledge, jnana. Jnana-vairagya. So vasudeve bhagavatir bhakti-yoga-prayojitah, janayaty azu vairagyam. When we understand... We are now implicated in so many sinful life, and we have to reap the result. We have to suffer for it in dehantara-praptih [Bg. 2.13]. We are not going to die. Na hanyate hanyamane sarire [Bg. 2.20]. It is not that everything... The atheists thinks like that—"When this body is finished, everything is finished." That is not the fact. There were atheists in India also. They say, bhasmi-bhutasya dehasya kutah punar agamano bhavet, yavaj jivet sukham jivet. That is the atheistic theory, actually, that we are not, I mean to say, this, subjected to death. Na jayate na mriyate va. We are not subjected. This... We are simply changing the dress, this body. But as soul, I am eternal, you are eternal, and on account of our uncontrolled senses, unbridled senses, we are changing different types of body. Suppose I am now human being, I am enjoying life very nicely, but if, next life, I become a dog, street dog, we can see how miserable life it is. Or even I become a very powerful, strong animal, a tiger or a lion, there is still... It is miserable life. Miserable life. So long we shall be in the material world, changing different bodies, it is miserable. Klesada asa dehah. Any body, it is klesada, painful, miserable. The sastra says,
nunam pramattah kurute vikarma
yad indriya-pritaya aprnoti
na sadhu manye yata atmano 'yam
asann api klesada asa dehah
People have become mad, pramattah, and doing all sinful activities. Nunam pramattah kurute vikarma. Vikarma means sinful activities. And why they are doing so? Yad indriya-pritaya aprnoti: "Simply for sense gratification." There is no higher aim, only sense gratification. The sastra says, na sadhu ayam: "This is not good." Why? Because on account of our sinful activities we have already got this painful, miserable, conditioned life, this body, and if we still go on like that, then again we shall get such body and suffering. This is sense. This is jnana. Every one of us, we are trying to be happy without any suffering. That is the aim of life. Anandamayo 'bhyasat (Vedanta-sutra 1.1.12). We are living beings, part and parcel of Krsna. Our nature is to become happy, pleased, joyful. But this is not the way of becoming happy, joyful, and enjoy pleasure. This is not the way. The way is different. That is Krsna consciousness.
So everyone should be very serious to accept this process of Krsna consciousness not only personally, but teach others, statewise, familywise, communitywise, so that we may not be envious to our dependent. We should be liberal. So give them the proper chance to understand Krsna consciousness so that they make their life happy and attain the stage of eternity. We are eternal. Na hanyate hanyamane sarire [Bg. 2.20]. Simply we are changing body. It is a great science. But unfortunately there is no teaching in the school, college and university. Simply we are in darkness. If we keep people in darkness and advertise that we are advancing, it is another type of cheating. So people should understand the value of life, the science of life, that tatha dehantara-praptih: [Bg. 2.13] we are changing this body. And the samples of body, 8,400,000 forms of life... Just like the trees are standing in our compound. They cannot move an inch. Is that very good life? So if I am asked to stand at a place for five minutes, it becomes troublesome. And they are standing for five thousand years. Just see the punishment. So there are so many forms of life. There is no science to understand why there are varieties of life, why this tree standing in front of me in miserable condition and I am sitting in this room very comfortably. It is also a life; I am also a life. Why? Who is arranging for this different status of life? These are to be understood. And everything is there, clear, in the Bhagavad-gita. If you take to Krsna consciousness, study Bhagavad-gita, and then after studying we study Srimad-Bhagavatam, then our life is successful. So every father, every state, every guardian, every guru, every, everyone, relative, should educate his dependent in Krsna consciousness to give them chance to be liberated from this bondage of miserable condition of material life.
Guest (1): (indistinct)
Pusta-krsna: (translating) Is it true that when you die, when you're going to die, you get another life?
Guest (1): Reincarnate.
Prabhupada: Yes. You do not believe in this?
Guest (1): No. For the moment I don't believe it, because when you die, you are not... When you have been damned...
Prabhupada: You are dying every moment. You are dying every moment. Do you know that?
Guest (1): Yes. I know it.
Prabhupada: You know it?
Guest (1): Yes, but when we die...
Prabhupada: No, no, why...? You are dying every moment, not "When we die." You are dying every... Just like what is your age?
Guest (1): I am twenty-two.
Prabhupada: Twenty-two. Since your birth you have died already twenty-two years. Do you know that? Suppose if you'll live for eighty years, out of that twenty-two years minus, that means you have already died twenty-two years. Is it not?
Guest (1): (French)
Prabhupada: Now, first of all, you have to admit this, that since your birth you have already died twenty-two years. Do you admit or not?
Guest (1): Yes.
Prabhupada: Then why do you say "when I die"? You have already died. It is less intelligence only that you cannot understand that you have died twenty-two years. Yes. That is the ignorance. So it is just like bank balance. You have got 100,000 rupees, and you are withdrawing. That means the bank balance is decreasing. So you are destined to live, say, for hundred years. Out of that, twenty-two years you have already died. So why don't you understand that you are dying every moment? So now, if you have understood...
Guest (2): No, you see, I think... (French) You see, these gentlemen want to know whether reincarnation..., reincarnation, whether after death we come back.
Prabhupada: It is a common sense. You were a child, so that body is dead, and now you are young man. So is it not incarnation?
Guest (2): (French) The same body, different stage in life...
Prabhupada: Not the same body. Not the same body. (laughter)
Guest (2): No, not the same body. It is the same soul, and the body alters, you see, because the different stages, the structure... (French)
Prabhupada: Brahmananda, you come this side. Come this side. It is not the same body. When... When...
Guest (1): (French)
Guest (2): What he want to know, whether the end of the world...
Prabhupada: No, first of all his question is incarnation. (laughter) You don't talk big, big words. First of all let him understand what is his question. The question is that after death how he is incarnated. That he can understand from the present life. His childhood body is dead, and he still has got a body. This is incarnation.
Guest (2): How do you understand that the end of the world?
Prabhupada: No, first of all, your first question should be answered.
Guest (2): So he's saying that he has got the message about reincarnation. He understand now.
Prabhupada: Now, it is clear. It is clear that your childhood body is dead, your boyhood body is dead, and you are still, have a body. This is incarnation.
Guest (2): He understand now.
Guest (3): What he wants to know is, when the soul leaves the body completely, what happens after that?
Prabhupada: This soul is eternal. It is... The soul is covered by two kinds of body. One is subtle body. Just like you have got your mind; I have got my mind. Do you see your mind? Do I see your mind? (second guest translates into French) So the soul is carried by two kinds of body. One body is this gross, made of earth, water, air, sky, like that. And the other... They are like shirt and coat. This is the coating, and there is another body, shirt, which is made of mind, intelligence, and ego. So when this gross body is finished, the subtle body is there. So at the time of your death the mental condition will carry you to a similar body. (Pusta-krsna translates) [break] This mental body you do not see. Therefore you say that this man is dead. It is not dead. The gross body is changed, and the mental body carries him to another gross body. (second guest translates) Any other question? That's all right. (end)
Link to this page: https://prabhupadabooks.com/classes/sb/7/5/30/mauritius/october/02/1975
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