Visit to Museum – December 5, 1971, Delhi

Burma also there is Ramayana culture?

Devotee: Hare Krsna. [break]

Prabhupada: …publications?

Dr. Candra: Ah, this one. It's a Tibetan Sanskrit dictionary, for the reconstruction of Sanskrit language, which has been lost in, for example, in your country, but it was found in Tibet.

Prabhupada: It is published in Japan?

Dr. Candra: Yes, this is a photographic edition of the original. This has been published this year. It was out of print for the last eight or nine years. [break]

Prabhupada: …leather?

Dr. Candra: No, it's a synthetic…

Prabhupada: Plastic.

Dr. Candra: Plastic. Leather is very expensive. This is Aditya…

Prabhupada: Ah.

Dr. Candra: …the sun-god from Japan. And that is the letter "r," which was taken from Naranga in ancient times. This script was taken from Naranga to Japan by Subal Narasingha[?]. We have all the gods and goddesses, the rasis, the nakshaktras…

Prabhupada: Oh.

Dr. Candra: …in Japan. [break] …the gods and goddesses found in Japan. Mandara is a yantra. Hmm? This is not yet finished. It is..., it will be finished soon. And here are the different Indian gods and goddesses. This is Skanda, Sarasvati, hmm? Candra and Candra. This is Narayana.

Prabhupada: These are found where?

Dr. Candra: These are found in monasteries.

Prabhupada: Oh.

Dr. Candra: This is Ganesa. Ganapati.

Prabhupada: Monasteries where? In Japan?

Dr. Candra: Yes. There are twelve thousand monasteries of Mantrayana.

Prabhupada: I see.

Dr. Candra: So in these monasteries of Mantrayana you'll find Sanskrit texts and Indian gods and goddesses.

Prabhupada: [to devotee:] That means, I told you several times, this Aryan culture was all over the world.

Dr. Candra: And this is Mahakala.

Prabhupada: Mahakala, yes.

Dr. Candra: Simha, Sukra, Krttika, Kanya, Bharani, Asvini, Uttara-bhadrapada. Revati, Purva-bhadrapada, Satabhisa and Dhanista.

Prabhupada: They're in Japanese language?

Devotee: Yes, they are all Japanese. Satabhisa is Kisupu. And Dhanista is Kirti. They have their own names. Every Sanskrit name was translated into Japanese. Here's Prthvi, in the form of a kumbha.

Prabhupada: Where it is printed?

Dr. Candra: Printed here. It will be published by the end of this month. That is my estimate. We do our printing ourself. Vasistha Rsi. Vasusena. And Vasvi, his wife, Vasusena both.

Prabhupada: That means all the Puranas…

Dr. Candra: Hmm?

Prabhupada: …are there in Japan?

Devotee: The Puranic tradition is there in a minute form.

Prabhupada: [indistinct] I saw, one Buddhist temple, visnu-murti.

Dr. Candra: Yes, Visnu is found. Because Visnu is… [phone rings] Hello? [break] Avalokitesvara: thousand arms, a thousand hands, and a thousand eyes.

Prabhupada: Visvarupa.

Dr. Candra: Avalokitesvara, the Japanese one. The concept of the virata-purusa.

Prabhupada: Virata-purusa in Bhagavad-gita. [break]

Dr. Candra: Shall I…

Prabhupada: The old system.

Dr. Candra: Shall I take you upstairs?

Prabhupada: Yes.

Dr. Candra: There is an exhibition of the Ramayana in Indonesia.

Devotee: Ramayana is [indistinct]

Dr. Candra: Yeah. [break] That's the Bhagavata Purana, and also a word index so that every word can be traced in the Bhagavata Purana. [break] And here is a [indistinct]. There was an international conference on the Ramayana in Indonesia in September. So on that occasion everyone issued something as a souvenir, and this was the postcard issued by the Indonesian Airways, Garuda Indonesian Airways.

Here is Sita and Ravana. He's carrying her away, and on the way Jatayu comes to rescue her, and he is fatally wounded. So this is the depiction of that. And in the background, if you can follow, is Prambanan of the ninth century. This temple is 150 feet high, and around it there are 259 temples, about 40 feet high..., 45 feet high.

Prabhupada: This is Hindu culture.

Dr. Candra: It is a Saivite culture. That is Rama, depicted by a Japanese artist, Buddhist artist. Rama is shooting the golden deer. And the background again is this temple of Prambanan.

Prabhupada: Hah.

Dr. Candra: Prambanan has inspired a lot of poetry in Indonesia. And here is the ceiling panel on the Yogyakarta Airport. They have made a new panel about four or five years ago about...

[break] …from the eighth century, they are called the Dieng Temples. It's a small plateau on the hills where you find these temples. And they have a very beautiful Ganesa, which is now in the Netherlands, in Holland. The original one.

[break] And this here… [break]

Prabhupada: Varuna dipika prakta rajendra mula varna[?].

Dr. Candra: Just a moment… [break]

Prabhupada: …by the devotion this was found. [break]

Dr. Candra: Here. [break] Krsna and Arjuna. The Krsna and Arjuna samvada. In Indonesia they project these wayang puppets onto a screen, and the light..., or the light gives all these colors also on the screen.

Devotee: Very nice art.

Dr. Candra: Hmm. These are very ordinary ones; there are very beautiful puppets. [break] And these are the pictures… [break] …of the Ramayana from Burma.

Prabhupada: Burma also there is Ramayana culture?

Dr. Candra: Yes. There is Kunti and the five Pandavas. Here they have shown the light effect. When light is projected through these leather puppets, then they look something like this.

Devotee: There's fifteen countries that took part?

Dr. Candra: No, seven or eight. Here is Visnu on Garuda, modern work, Balinese work. Hmm? And this is Rama. [break] Look at this yantra, it is yatra upannam visvam yatra didhatam bibinam adi yatra tasmai namo bhagavate sivaya siva kalinam.[?] And so on.

Indonesia had Sanskrit inscriptions up to the ninth century. And after that they got their own language. Here is the ayanor nidya nidyarksa[?] of Sita, so beautifully done. [indistinct Sanskrit] This is in Japanese style. Arjuna, and here is Gatokesa [?], and this is Gatokesa doing [indistinct]. [break]

Prabhupada: …son of Bhima?

Dr. Candra: Yes, Hidimbi-putra, that is how they know him. This is Ganesa, replica of a fourteenth-century image. This is the head of Rama from Prambanan, ninth century. It's also a replica.

Prabhupada: This is maintained by government?

Dr. Candra: By me, by your blessings.

Prabhupada: Government is not helping?

Dr. Candra: No. The government wants to help, but I do not want their help-no interference.

Prabhupada: Oh.

Dr. Candra: The Prime Minister would very much like to help me, [laughs] for political reasons. My father was president of the Jana Sangh.

Prabhupada: I see.

Dr. Candra: So I came over to her side in December last, and she was very insistent, so I had to come. So she wants to help me, but I have told her I want a political position and not money. This is Sikhandi, and that is Krsna with a bow and arrow. They have been to Mrs. Gandhi with me, [laughs] once [laughs]. And they could stay in India only on the intervention of Madam Gandhi, not otherwise. Because the Maharashtra government had recommended that they should be turned out.

Devotee: Bombay.

Dr. Candra: So the Home Secretary, once he met me at a dinner and related the whole story. So he went to the Prime Minister and asked her what to do. She said, "All right, tell them that they should observe time and allow them to stay." So they have met her twice before.

This is the temple of Prambanan, three hundred and fifty feet high. It's one of the most gorgeous temple complexes. Ninth century. And this is Visnu. There are three temples. You see central temple is dedicated to Visnu, the two side temples are dedicated to Brahma and Visnu…

No, the center is Siva, side temples are Brahma and Visnu. So this is the image in the Visnu temple. Here you see the Garuda, because the emblem of the Indonesian state. Hmm? And this is Ganesa, smiling Ganesa.

Prabhupada: Hah. [break]

Dr. Candra: Bali. And here are... [break] …are correlated to the mountains and rivers of India, Mount Kailasa and so on. And this is the panca-mahabhuta.

Prabhupada: [indistinct]

Dr. Candra: Prthvi-apa-tejas-vayu and akasa. And these are some of the mudras used in their worship.

[break] …important village, city, they…, and a small town they have the constitution written. And the constitution, the Indonesian constitution is just five principles, which they call panca-sila, and the first principle is to have belief in Maha-isa. That is the word they have used here. And besides these five principles of the Indonesian constitution, there is the image of Sridevi, the goddess of plenty, the goddess of rice fields.

Prabhupada: Laksmi.

Dr. Candra: Laksmi also they use.

Prabhupada: Sri means…

Dr. Candra: Yes, but their Sridevi is more an agricultural goddess. Hmm? And this is a replica of an apsara in the Prambanan temple.

Prabhupada: Apsara?

Dr. Candra: Apsara. [break]

Prabhupada: They are old photos.

Dr. Candra: These are old photos [indistinct]. This Ramayana was written in the ninth century by Yogesvara. And this is the Mahabharata, an adaptation of the Mahabharata in eleventh century.

Prabhupada: Sanskrit language?

Dr. Candra: No, in their own language.

Devotee: This is original?

Dr. Candra: Original.

Devotee: Kept very well.

Dr. Candra: Oh, yes.

Devotee: What is this material?

Dr. Candra: Palm leaf.

Prabhupada: Palm leaf with an iron pen. [break] …ordinary book?

Dr. Candra: Ordinary book. But done from a single piece. This is the agni-pariksa of Sita. [break] Agni, who is the lord of fire, came out and reprimanded Rama and Laksmana, that "Sita is so pure that fire cannot test her purity. And the purity of fire can be tested by Sita alone." This is Rama staying in the vana. This is Krsna-Arjuna samvada according to the Balinese way of painting.

Prabhupada: So they are Vaisnava?

Dr. Candra: Ah, they are Vaisnava, they are Saivite, they are all sorts of things combined. Synthetic. This is again from the temple at Prambanan. Ah, Sita in the Asoka-vana. And you see in this great temple of Prambanan, opposite the main temples you have the vahanas, and the Siva temple is faced by Nandi. [break]

Prabhupada: …I have to go now.

Dr. Candra: Really?

Prabhupada: Yes. Because somebody is expected by half-past four.

Dr. Candra: Oh. [Hindi: "I want to show a little bit more.] And no books?

Prabhupada: [Hindi] [break]

Dr. Candra: … and we have a small printing press with which we have written our... [break] International Academy of Indian Culture.

Prabhupada: [Hindi: chai layai] [He brought tea"] [laughter]

Dr. Candra: Dalmiyaji is helping us. This is the [indistinct].

Prabhupada: I see.

Dr. Candra: I got this [indistinct].

Prabhupada: Accha.

Dr. Candra: Prepare such things… [break] If you are interested, you can take with you.

Prabhupada: No.

Dr. Candra: Hah?

Prabhupada: No. I am simply asking. I am simply asking.

Dr. Candra: It is a hundred and fifty rupees. It is published by Vivekananda Memorial Committee.

Prabhupada: I see. [indistinct] So let us go…

[break] The perfection of Indian culture is Krsna.

Dr. Candra: Hmm. Yes.

Prabhupada: So try to help us as far as possible.

Dr. Candra: I will try to, I know. But I am a small man. Hmm? I have not gone to so many places, but I am try to do something… When you are in London we must try to do something [indistinct]. Even the [indistinct] we can talk to some of the ex- [indistinct] or speak to the queen. That's not very difficult, and then if some..., something should be done also… [break] [end]