Room Conversation – October 15, 1977, Vṛndāvana

Do everything very carefully

[Yasodanandana Swami leading Govindam prayers]

Prabhupada: Visvambhara.

Upendra: No, Srila Prabhupada.

Prabhupada: Who is...?

Bhagavan: Bhagavan, Srila Prabhupada.

Prabhupada: Huh?

Bhagavan: Bhagavan.

Prabhupada: Bhagavata?

Bhagavan: Bhagavan. Bhagavan dasa.

Prabhupada: I wanted to see Visvambhara. Eh?

Bhagavan: We can go send someone to get him right away.

Upendra: He's coming, Srila Prabhupada.

Prabhupada: [Transl. Where did you go?]

Visvambhara: [Transl. Yes, Srila Prabhupada?]

Prabhupada: [Transl. Where did you go?]

Visvambhara: [Transl. Me? I went home.]

Prabhupada: Huh?

Visvambhara: [Transl. I went to my house. He is also here. He is taking prasada.]

Prabhupada: [Transl. Where?]

Visvambhara: [Transl. There at the gurukula. He is coming after taking prasada. Prabhupada, at night he will go to his house in my cycle and in the morning he will come. As you order he will be coming three, four times a day. Now he will only give you hot fomentation in the stomach.]

Prabhupada: [Transl. As you feel right.]

Visvambhara: [Transl. As you feel comfortable we will do that. As you order, as you feel comfortable.]

Prabhupada: [Transl. It is not a question of comfort…]

Visvambhara: [Transl. Comfort means if you feel better by massage then I can tell him to give you more massage. He is totally under your instruction. He can stay here twenty-four hours a day]

Prabhupada: [Transl. What does he think?]

Visvambhara: [Transl. His massage is perfect. He says that for some reason either because of food or some other reason there is a tangle in the stomach. Because of this Prabhupada is feeling uncomfortable. If somehow or other this tangle is removed then Prabhupada should feel relief.]

Prabhupada: [Transl. Will that be cured?]

Visvambhara: [Transl. He was saying my inner heart says Prabhupada will be cured. This he was telling me just now. I asked him, will he be cured by your massage and treatment? I cannot promise that, but by Radharani's mercy he will be cured. He told me just now.]

Prabhupada: [Transl. As you feel right.]

Visvambhara: [Transl. Prabhupada, do you feel better than yesterday? You must be feeling something. Even slightly.]

Prabhupada: [Transl. Not significantly. That is the place.]

Visvambhara: [Transl. Here it is. The knot is here. The knot will be untied]

Prabhupada: Han?

Visvambhara: [Transl. The knot will be removed. The knot has been sitting there, due to indigestion of food. By massage and by hot fomentation it will go away. I will make sure that it is completely cured. I will try my best. He has gone to take prasada. I will bring him now.]

[break]

Prabhupada: Bhakti-caru?

Upendra: You want to see Bhakti-caru?

Prabhupada: Yes.

Upendra: I'll call him.

Bhakti-caru: [Transl. Srila Prabhupada? Did you call me?]

Prabhupada: [Transl. Should I drink some more milk?]

Bhakti-caru: [Transl. Yes sure. I will bring.]

Prabhupada: Visvambhara?

Visvambhara: Prabhupada?

Prabhupada: [Transl. Want to do anything now?]

Visvambhara: [Transl. Little hot fomentation. And if you say then little massage also.]

Prabhupada: [Transl. No, as you want.]

Rama dasa Sastri: [Transl. Maharajaji, whatever gives you relief I will do that. I will try my best to give you relief whether it is day or night. I don't care for any personal inconvenience. You become healthy that is my satisfaction. I will sleep here if needed. I don't care. Don't worry about that.]

Tamala Krsna: Srila Prabhupada? Nava-yogendra Maharaja has come from Africa to see you. Should he come over?

Prabhupada: Hmm.

Tamala Krsna: He's brought some presentations for you.

Nava-yogendra: All glories to Srila Prabhupada.

Prabhupada: Hmm.

Tamala Krsna: This is a Deity of Krsna. Sandalwood. Nice carving of Krsna. These are sweets, different types. Many fruits.

Nava-yogendra: Dried fruit, Indian fruit. [Bhagatji laughs]

Tamala Krsna: Kaju. Milk sweets all on silver trays.

Prabhupada: [Transl. Who is he?]

Nava-yogendra: [Transl. He is my brother.]

Prabhupada: Keep them properly and distribute to the devotees.

Tamala Krsna: Distribute to the devotees. All right.

Prabhupada: Bank business finished?

Tamala Krsna: What, Srila Prabhupada?

Prabhupada: Bank business?

Tamala Krsna: Bank business concluded. [opening package] Almonds. Almonds. We'll keep these in the kitchen, Srila Prabhupada. Special am-acara. [Bhagatji laughs]

Prabhupada: [Transl. Bhagatji, take something.]

Bhagatji: Prabhupada asked me to take anything I want. [laughs]

Tamala Krsna: The dry things we can keep in your kitchen, almonds and nuts. Sometime you may like a little ground with honey or something. More fruits. Guava. [indistinct comments by devotees] Silver cup. Big cup.

Prabhupada: [Transl. How much did you spend?]

Nava-yogendra: [Transl. Not so much Prabhupadaji.]

Nava-yogendra: Srila Prabhupada, can I put this garland? I want to make... It's very nice flower. Jaya Prabhupada.

Prabhupada: [Transl. Fix up a time. Bhagatji, I am saying fix up a time when he should come every day.]

Visvambhara: [Transl. He is saying fix up a time.]

Rama dasa Sastri: [Transl. I will come at 10 o'clock sharp.]

Visvambhara: [Transl. Morning?]

Rama dasa Sastri: [Transl. Yes. If you want, you tell me any time.]

Visvambhara: [Transl. You tell him a fixed time. Whenever you like so that it should not disturb your rest or anything else.]

[break]

Rama dasa Sastri: [Transl. Maharajaji, no problem for me. I can stay here 24 hours day and night.]

Visvambhara: [Transl. He is very responsible person. I have seen him in the hospital. The parents of a patient left but he stayed there whole night and came back with the cured patient. He is a hard working man.]

Rama dasa Sastri: [Transl. I don't care for myself. Let your health be improved.]

Prabhupada: [Transl. Visvambhara.]

Visvambhara: [Transl. Srila Prabhupada.]

Prabhupada: [Transl. As you will manage, it will be so.]

Visvambhara: [Transl. Surely, don't worry.]

Upendra: Giriraja is here, Srila Prabhupada.

Prabhupada: So, the bank business?

Giriraja: The manager came-I mean, not the manager, the assistant general manager from the head office. He came, and he brought the letter with our eleven-points program which we want to have, and he agreed to all of the points. And he said that probably Tuesday I can go to Delhi and collect the fixed deposit certificates, and they will be endorsed on the New Delhi branch. And he said that after ten days... Within ten days there will be a new manager for the extension counter, and we'll never have to deal with Mr. Gupta again. And then so many different small points, he instructed the people to comply. And he's going to have the whole extension counter refurnished with carpets and nice chairs and sofas, so that there's a nice atmosphere. So, I mean, I think from now on everything should be very straightforward.

Prabhupada: So things are satisfactory now?

Giriraja: Yes.

Prabhupada: Also another thing, that four thousand..., er, four lakhs has reached Bombay?

Giriraja: Well, I sent a photocopy of that advice which they gave us here to the CBI, and I told them that they should be sure to get the money from Punjab Bank and put it in our account, BBT. But I didn't get any confirmation, because usually they give the advice to Bombay.

Prabhupada: So?

Giriraja: So it's not confirmed that we got the money. But I'm sure that... Anyway, I think I'll be going to Bombay in the next week. Otherwise I can send another letter to the CBI to advise us here in Vrndavana confirming that the money has been credited.

Prabhupada: CBI should have acknowledged. Why...? Hmm?

Giriraja: Yes. But generally they send all of their advices to our Bombay office. So they might have sent the advice to Bombay office, the four lakhs.

Tamala Krsna: Oh, I got the advice. Today I got the ad... I wrote to the Bombay office of Central Bank. I wrote a letter to Gwalior... You wrote a letter. Giriraja wrote a letter to Central Bank of India, Bombay, Gwalior Tank. And just today... When Prasannatma Prabhu went there... I told him to go to the bank, and he got the advice, and I received it today-four lakhs received on time before the tenth and deposited and credited to our account, in time for gaining interest this month.

Prabhupada: So it is all right.

Tamala Krsna: Oh, yes. Transaction is complete. I just got it today.

Giriraja: Thanks for telling me.

Tamala Krsna: I just got it.

Giriraja: So Srila Prabhupada, I have a present for you from Lord Krsna, Srinathaji. This is a coat which was worn by Him.

Prabhupada: Hmm.

Giriraja: So, He sent it to you.

Tamala Krsna: Srinathaji wore that?

Giriraja: Yes. In Nathadwar.

Prabhupada: How you got it?

Giriraja: Well, you know the Maharaja of Udaipur? President of the Viswa-Hindu Parisad? So he sent it. His cousin came here to stay for about a week.

Tamala Krsna: I think it will be very nice when the weather is a little cool, for you to wear it, Srila Prabhupada, on your morning walks. [laughter]

Giriraja: Also, he converted one of his palaces into a hotel, and he's ordering 301 copies of Bhagavad-gita As It Is-one for each room in the hotel. And he's also associated with the Taj Hotel. So he's going to try to see about having them take one Gita for each room.

Prabhupada: So you have taken your dinner?

Giriraja: Yes.

Prabhupada: All right. Then take rest.

Giriraja: Jaya Srila Prabhupada.

Prabhupada: Hare Krsna. So Mr. Dugal...?

Giriraja: Mr. Dugal?

Prabhupada: Yes.

Giriraja: Well, he was a little bit upset that we were taking away all the fixed deposits. So the man from the head office told him that he has to win our confidence. Then, when he wins our confidence, we may make new fixed deposit. But right now... I mean, whatever we say, he has to accept.

Prabhupada: So how much transferred?

Giriraja: Ten lakhs, sixty thousand.

Prabhupada: To?

Giriraja: To the Parliament Street Main Branch in New Delhi.

Prabhupada: And before that, four lakhs?

Giriraja: Yes, four lakhs to Central Bank in Bombay.

Prabhupada: So Dugal is very unhappy, eh?

Giriraja: Well, I mean he feels that he's losing everything. But the man from the head office tried to explain that, you know, "This is the reaction to your activities," and that "If you change your activities in the future, we may bring in more money." Actually we're going to expand and develop our activities more and more. So if they win our confidence, we don't mind giving them any amount of money.

Tamala Krsna: He also said that the chairman has taken a personal interest in our Society's accounts and has sent him as an emissary. And he also said that he's coming back in about ten days again. He said, "This time when I come back you will not have any complaints." In other words, he's going to rectify whatever mistakes have been made. [whispering]

Prabhupada: Hmm? What is that "pish-pish"? [laughter]

Tamala Krsna: I told him that... I told Giriraja, [laughing] I told Giriraja to explain to you about Mr. Gupta's departure.

Giriraja: He said he's going to send some nice younger person from New Delhi who will be very easy for us to work with.

Prabhupada: Gupta was present? No.

Giriraja: Mostly he wasn't present. A little bit later he came for one or two minutes, but he didn't say anything.

Tamala Krsna: One thing I noticed though is that Mr. Goswami, the accountant, the cashier, and Mr. Dugal, when they were leaving, they seemed to be much more..., I don't know if you could say friendly, but they were far more respectful now. I think that they have been a little bit humbled by this incident. They always used to tell us that "We don't care for your money. You must follow the rules. Even if we lose your money, we don't care, but you must stick to the rules." But they seemed a little humbled today, a little changed in their view. I don't think that they ever suspected that they would lose our deposits like this. I think now they'll make much more of an effort. I would expect so. Right?

Giriraja: Oh, yes. Now they're going to make every effort not to annoy us in any way.

Prabhupada: Very carefully deal, and as far as possible, don't keep money in the bank. Invest in books and expansion. That is my request. If you keep money, there will be so much trouble.

Tamala Krsna: So much what?

Giriraja: Trouble.

Prabhupada: So the current account and savings account, ten days' notice, these things are to be done?

Tamala Krsna: What did Prabhupada ask?

Giriraja: Whether on the savings account we have to give ten-day notice.

Tamala Krsna: We didn't discuss that yet. We don't have any current accounts any longer. We changed them all to savings accounts.

Prabhupada: So when you have to withdraw, you have to give ten days' notice?

Giriraja: Well what we did in Bombay is we made arrangement that if we could not give ten-day notice, we could predate a letter ten days before, and they would accept that.

Prabhupada: Yes, the Bombay accept, but these people?

Giriraja: Well, we didn't discuss this, but the next time we meet the man from the head office I'm sure we can arrange it, because he wants to satisfy us.

Prabhupada: The Central Bank, they do not mind.

Giriraja: No. These people are too fussy. Actually, every bank always bends the rules to accommodate the customers. These people... This is one of the symptoms of nonsurrender, that they are too attached to following the rules and regulations without understanding the purpose.

Tamala Krsna: Niyamagraha?

Prabhupada: Niyamagraha. [laughter] Do everything very carefully. You were present in the conference?

Giriraja: Well, actually I wasn't, because I wasn't feeling too well this morning. But tomorrow I want to be present.

Prabhupada: I don't see Brahmananda?

Tamala Krsna: Brahmananda has malaria, Srila Prabhupada, for the last four days.

Trivikrama: Taking pills?

Tamala Krsna: He's taking some medicines, but he's had fever on and off. He gets it regularly every year. This is the fourth time he got.

Prabhupada: What medicine?

Tamala Krsna: Quinine, and I think Sridhara Swami is arranging some other medicines. There is malaria epidemic in India. In Hyderabad every family, at least one person has malaria. It's all over India, even in big cities. Bhakti-prema Swami, he also has malaria. Mosquitoes seem to be a very envious creature. Are you liking the massage, Srila Prabhupada?

Prabhupada: Yes.

Tamala Krsna: He is using the same idea as that brahmacari, putting hot on different places.

Upendra: Leg. Tell him the leg.

Tamala Krsna: You have to explain to him about massaging.

Upendra: We did already.

Tamala Krsna: Oh. You have pain in that hip, Srila Prabhupada?

Prabhupada: Hmm.

Tamala Krsna: Maybe he can give some special massaging there.

Visvambhara: [Transl. He has pain in the hip. You massage there also.]

Rama dasa Sastri: [Transl. Yes, I will do.]

Upendra: After some time I think it will go away with the massage. I mean from lack of movement.

Visvambhara: He said, "I am trying very slowly. He will not be able to tolerate it if hard massage." [whispering]

Tamala Krsna: He seems like a good massage man.

Prabhupada: So, why not publish in large quantity of..., large number of books?

Tamala Krsna: Yes, I think that's advisable. There has been some complaints again about no stock.

Prabhupada: Why it is not being done? There is money.

Tamala Krsna: Jayapataka had some complaint today.

Giriraja: It may be that because we're dealing with one printer he cannot handle all of the work.

Prabhupada: Why one printer?

Tamala Krsna: Well Jayapataka was thinking his parties are distributing Hindi books also, in Bihar and other places, and they ran out of books, and even though they went to Bombay, he could not get the books he wanted. There was no stock.

Prabhupada: So, what he recommends?

Tamala Krsna: So he says he can print cheaper anyway in Calcutta.

Prabhupada: Then let him print.

Tamala Krsna: Yes. That's what I... I mentioned that to him.

Prabhupada: Why depend on one printer?

Tamala Krsna: No.

Prabhupada: Where is Gopala?

Tamala Krsna: Gopala?

Giriraja: He went to Bombay today.

Prabhupada: So, you arrange many printers.

Giriraja: Yes.

Prabhupada: Never mind the price. Huge stock should be maintained. Why unnecessarily keeping in the bank?

Giriraja: No, now we'll spend it all for printing.

Prabhupada: I think in the BBT there are five, six lakhs.

Giriraja: Yes.

Prabhupada: So why...? Turn them into books.

Giriraja: [whispering] "I think that in the BBT there's five, six lakhs. So why not transform it into books?"

Prabhupada: Hindi books can be distributed all over the world.

Giriraja: Yes.

Prabhupada: Similarly Gujarati, and English to Australia. Why money should be kept in the bank?

Tamala Krsna: I don't think it will be any more, now that we have your direction. You actually gave us directions about a week ago, and I think they're going to carry through on it.

Prabhupada: Don't depend on one printer.

Tamala Krsna: No. Actually, Jayapataka is very enthusiastic for printing also. It's pretty easy to print at two different places, because once you have the plates, they can simply be... You know, the photos, offset machines. Once you have the negatives, you can simply send them, and they can be printed anywhere.

Hrdayananda: Anywhere in the world.

Tamala Krsna: Yes. And especially you can send them from Bombay to Calcutta. There's no hindrance. [Giriraja whispering]

Prabhupada: Hmm?

Giriraja: Well, I wrote a prayer to Lord Krsna for your health. So I was... It's in the next room. I was thinking of bringing it and reading it.

Prabhupada: Oh, yes.

Hrdayananda: Also a message arrived for your health, prayers from the devotees in Central America. They're all praying for you. A letter has just arrived.

Tamala Krsna: I get many letters all week, Srila Prabhupada, all praying for your recovery. The devotees cannot resign themselves to letting you go. They don't want to live without you. They cannot...

Prabhupada: Visvambhara, everywhere they want me. You also...

Visvambhara: I can give my life, Prabhupada. I can give some of my years. I pray that I may go early, Prabhupada.

Prabhupada: No, why you should go early? You live on.

Visvambhara: Prabhupada, you stay. I wish that... I told you already earlier here that please at least complete this Bhagavatam, Srila Prabhupada.

Prabhupada: That is my desire also.

Visvambhara: Will Krsna not fulfill your desire?

Prabhupada: Oh, Krsna is independent.

Tamala Krsna: You've always stated in your books, Srila Prabhupada, that Krsna likes too much to fulfill the desire of His pure devotee. He uses His independence to fulfill the desire of His devotee.

Prabhupada: [Transl. Some light I am getting. May be He will take.] Karmani nirdahati kintu ca bhakti-bhajam [Bs 5.54]. [Transl. Whatever fruits of karma is left, that has to be exhausted.] Yas tv indra-gopam athavendram aho... .

Visvambhara: [Transl. Srila Prabhupada, bhakti is also the destroyer of all one's previous deeds.]

Prabhupada: [Transl. Suppose a man is ordered to be hanged, it cannot be stopped. If someone comes and says spare his life…]

Visvambhara: [Transl. President has got special powers Srila Prabhupada.]

Prabhupada: [Transl. Yes, he has got.]

Visvambhara: Prabhupada is saying if one is ordered to hang, how can he say... I say, I tell Prabhupada, "President has got these special powers."

Tamala Krsna: What did Prabhupada say?

Visvambhara: What? Yes.

Tamala Krsna: Would you like to hear Giriraja's prayer?

Prabhupada: Yes.

Giriraja: "My dear Lord Krsna, You are known as Yogesvara, the master of all mystic powers. So it is very easy for You to perform the impossible, as You have done many times in the past. By Your merciful glance You restored life to the boys and cows who had died by drinking the water of the Yamuna River which was poisoned by Kaliya. And You swallowed the devastating forest fire to protect the inhabitants of Vrndavana. In the rasa dance You expanded Yourself to be simultaneously present by the side of each gopi. And as guru-daksina, You recovered the dead son of Your teacher. When the hunchback maidservant of Kamsa smeared You with sandalwood pulp, You made her straight and beautiful. And as a householder in Dvaraka, You expanded Yourself into sixteen thousand Krsnas and simultaneously satisfied all of Your sixteen thousand wives. When Sudama Brahmana offered You chipped rice, You transformed his poor cottage into a beautiful palace suitable for the king of heaven. And to satisfy Mother Devaki, You returned her six dead sons from the kingdom of Bali. To appease the Dvaraka brahmana, You also reclaimed his dead sons from Maha-Visnu. When Srila Prabhupada sat with seven dollars under a tree in Tompkins Square Park, You transformed that tree into so many royal palaces, and You expanded that seven dollars into millions of dollars. And when Srila Prabhupada spoke Your message, You turned the mlecchas and canḍalas into Your devotees. And when Srila Prabhupada went all by himself to sell his Srimad-Bhagavatam volumes, You expanded him into ten thousand loving salesmen who are working day and night without asking any salary, and You expanded his suitcase of books into fifty-five million pieces of literature in twenty-three different languages. And when Hare Krishna Land was lost to the demons, You returned it to His Divine Grace. So from these examples we can understand that for You, the impossible is not difficult, but rather, You have performed so many impossible feats for Your devotees. Therefore, if You desire, please give Srila Prabhupada a new body."

Prabhupada: Excellent. Very... Print in back to Godhead. I am getting little glimpse, He may agree to your prayer, yes.

Hrdayananda: Jaya Prabhupada.

Prabhupada: Now stock books immediately.

Tamala Krsna: Here is Jayapataka Swami.

Prabhupada: You print. They will pay you. Jayapataka?

Jayapataka: Yes, Srila Prabhupada.

Prabhupada: There is no question of becoming miserly. You print as many books as you like. All money will be paid if you have no money. Why? If you are selling books, you must have money also.

Jayapataka: We have a program to print. We're printing right now. It's in the press at the present time. The Bhakti Katha, Jnana Katha, Bhagavaner Katha and then hardback Vairagya-vidya. And also three issues of Bhagavata-darsana. We're trying to, within that money also, print the first three chapters of Bhagavad-gita.

Tamala Krsna: We gave him a loan of forty-five thousand rupees, and then another twenty-five is coming. But that's all...

Prabhupada: So you'll get money. Print.

Jayapataka: One of our parties has gone to Bihar, and they sold about twelve thousand books and they ran out. They just now ran out of books, so they went to Bombay to get Hindi books, but there was no stock. So they came here to... Spent four hundred rupees going there, they found no books. Then they came here to Delhi, and they got two thousand books from Vrndavana here, what stock they had.

Prabhupada: So why stock lacking? Why this mismanagement? There is no question of shortage of stock. I give you open order: print more than necessity. If you do not print, what shall I do?

Bhakti-caru: Should we start printing Hindi books in Calcutta, Srila Prabhupada?

Prabhupada: I do not know where to be... But get it printed in huge stock.

Bhakti-caru: Calcutta also has all the facilities in Hindi.

Prabhupada: What is use of telling me?

Hrdayananda: What is the use of telling him?

Jayapataka: He said, "I give an open order to print books. Always have big stock."

Hrdayananda: Huge stock, he said, more than necessary.

Kirtanananda: It's up to us to figure out where to print books.

Gargamuni[?]: I have to put that question, Prabhupada.

Jayapataka: He already answered that question. Gaura-Govinda, he's already translated sixteen chapters of Bhagavad-gita in Oriya, and he's translated three small books in Oriya.

Prabhupada: Let him bring. There is fifty thousand rupees in Orissa.

Tamala Krsna: Yes.

Jayapataka: That fifty thousand rupees was supposed to be for construction. Bhagavata Prabhu has collected about 35,000 rupees on his own that he's put into the account there so far. More is also being collected. It was previously promised that whatever he would collect for construction, then that amount would be matched from BBT fund or from your...

Tamala Krsna: Somewhere.

Jayapataka: Somewhere, wherever.

Tamala Krsna: So, so far he has to collect fifty thousand, 'cause that's already there.

Jayapataka: He has to match that first before he can get it. [laughs softly] Just yesterday night, the SP of Cuttack District, Orissa, he came here, and he said that he was very impressed by the mandira. He told Bhagavata... I happened to meet him also. He was very pleased. His wife and family were here. He gave his name and address and said, "When you come back to Orissa, you kindly see me and whatever I can do... I'm not so big a man, but whatever I can do to help you, I'll do." He's very pious man.

Tamala Krsna: You told him we will have Krsna-Balarama there?

Jayapataka: Details Bhagavata was discussing.

Tamala Krsna: We're installing Krsna and Balarama there, Srila Prabhupada?

Prabhupada: Hmm.

Tamala Krsna: Orissa.

Prabhupada: That construction is not so important as printing of books.

Jayapataka: The president of the Bhadrak temple that Lokanatha Swami had got donated from the Gauḍiya Matha to ISKCON, he has been collecting Life Members, hoping that he can build and improve a little bit on it. He was hoping to get the same facility of that Bhubaneswar, of matching fifty-fifty. He's collecting everything locally in Orissa.

Tamala Krsna: Srila Prabhupada? We got a telegram from Nrsimha-Caitanya, about... You know, he's the boy who does library distribution? Should I read it to you?

Prabhupada: Yes.

Tamala Krsna: Okay.

Jayapataka: Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura's analogy of brhad-mrdahga has really come true through Your Divine Grace. The sound of your books has been heard in all corners. [end]