Conversation – December 4, 1971, Delhi

People are not being taught the value of life

Prabhupada: These, they do not leave the control. They sell things, and they catch some leaders, they take loan from them, and they take it, and eighty percent for themselves and twenty percent for so on. This is going on, the so-called independent country. In India also, that is being done. America is loaning, and these, ah, those who are in charge of the government, they're spending money in their way...

[break] …purchasing weapons from them.

Actually, the development, and these Britishers and Americans, they're constantly engaging Pakistan in fighting spirit and supplying them ammunition and supplying here. Their business is going on, taking loan from them and paying to them, and they remain debtor perpetually. You give me money, purchase from me, and in books you are debtor. I take your money by supplying some goods. So my money comes back, and you remain a debtor in the book, perpetually.

Guest: [laughs]

Prabhupada: Is it not?

Guest: Yes. Eighty percent rupee belong to the States, United States.

Prabhupada: Just see.

Guest: The public did the dee…, the date, 3-04-80[?]. The interest is calculated every fortnight. So though it is two or three percent, but it works out about eighteen percent in a year.

Prabhupada: Just see.

Devotee: Oh.

Guest: You see, it's a sort of, I don't know how to call it. It's… Not only compound interest, but super-compound interest. Every fifteen days or a month something is added to the capital. So things are… But I think Krsna consciousness is better for them as well as for us. [laughs]. So I will take leave and come tomorrow at four o'clock. Hmm? Dalmiyaji has been here? Jai Dayal Dalmiyaji?

Gurudasa: Not recently.

Guest: Hmm?

Gurudasa: Not recently.

Prabhupada: I have come just yesterday night, last night.

Guest: Hmm.

Prabhupada: Give him that prasadam.

Guest: I'll come…

Prabhupada: All right.

Guest: Krsna… How many of you… [break]

Prabhupada: …our activities. But… [break]

Gurudasa: Even the security governments know us. One time there was this Mr. Fugarty from Florida. Remember, Maha-purusa went to see him?

Prabhupada: Fugarty, yes, I know.

Gurudasa: First Dayananda and Nandarani went, and they knew him?

Prabhupada: Oh, yes. Fugarty. Yes.

Gurudasa: So he came to London, and he wanted to meet with us. But he didn't know our address, so he looked in the Central Intelligence files, and they had our address, and he came to see us. [laughs]

Prabhupada: Oh, yes. He was interested in our...

Gurudasa: He was cryptologist, code breaker, for the government.

Prabhupada: Hmm.

Gurudasa: When secret codes would come in, he would decode them by formula. That was his job.

Prabhupada: Accha.

Devotee: Yes.

Gurudasa: Just like Sanskrit. [break] …so he was doing that job. [break]

Prabhupada: But do it, do it throughout with enthusiasm. In this way simply this advertisement goes out, village to village. And this should become popular in the world.

Gurudasa: Nagaradi grama.

Prabhupada: Nagaradi grama.

Tamala Krsna: But we should leave at least one devotee in each village.

Gurudasa: If there was time…

Prabhupada: But difficulty is you do not know the local language.

Gurudasa: Hmm. When Caitanya Mahaprabhu was here, there was one language? Because the…

Prabhupada: No, this Hare Krsna language will be understood by everyone. There was one language, Sanskrit, amongst the learned. Still, amongst the learned gentlemen you can speak in English. Similarly, in India the pand…, learned class language was Sanskrit, all over India. Anywhere you go you can talk with them, Sanskrit.

Gurudasa: Hah.

Prabhupada: We are not… Learned circles, they are not concerned with the mass of people. They meet with learned circles. When learned circles meet, everyone comes.

Gurudasa: There was that nice story, that one person was coming to defeat one of the associate of Caitanya Mahaprabhu; it was Narottama dasa Thakura. So his disciples, he said, "If they want me to leave, I will leave." So his disciples posed as a cobbler and a betel-seller, and when they came to… A potter and a betel-seller. When they came to buy betel they spoke Sanskrit. And they thought, "Oh, Narottama dasa Thakura is teaching the common betel-seller Sanskrit, then how can we compare with this?" It's a very nice story. [break]

Prabhupada: Yes.

Gurudasa: Accha.

Prabhupada: Then give another one.

Gurudasa: Panḍita Narayana dasa came?

Prabhupada: And whatever things we require, you give him a list and they'll supply. So if you can cook, that's all right; otherwise they have got their cooks. So take that advantage. You talked with Narayana dasa?

Gurudasa: Yes.

Prabhupada: But at that time he did not give us some facility.

Gurudasa: At that time he was sick in bed.

Prabhupada: Ah.

Gurudasa: Blood pressure, high. So he said, "Arrange with these other people; then I will come and see that it is all right."

Prabhupada: Oh. So when he came, he was informed that I had left. So somebody said, "No, he's upstairs," and he came to see me.

Gurudasa: [laughs]

Prabhupada: He's my old friend. He knows me.

Gurudasa: He help… He was on the League of Devotees? Yes?

Prabhupada: Not League of, but he knew me when I was there. Whenever my books were published, he came to purchase one.

Gurudasa: I spoke to them about putting some books in that shelf; they said yes.

Prabhupada: Not shelf; they purchase.

Gurudasa: Yes.

Prabhupada: Ask them to purchase.

Gurudasa: Yes.

Prabhupada: Narayana dasa's son?

Gurudasa: Yes.

Prabhupada: He's the secretary…

[break] But they are putting…

[break] Yan maithunadi-grhamedhi-sukham hi tuccham [SB 7.9.45]. People are not being taught the value of life. They only understand that polished hogs' life is to be [indistinct]. [break] I have said that they're all sinful. Indirectly I have said. Factually.

These, all the gosais and babajis, they're actually sinful. And some of them who are..., those who are sincere, they're surprised, that "We are so long in Vrndavana, we cannot have sahkirtana like that. What is the reason?" They're searching. I told them, "You do not follow the rules and regulation." First of all I told them that "You have no bona fide guru."

Devotee: Hmm.

Prabhupada: Or you're not bona fide student. There must be some defect. Anandamayi's men also came to invite me.

Gurudasa: This morning I met mataji in Kamala Nagar.

Prabhupada: Oh, she's there?

Gurudasa: She was there, yes.

Prabhupada: She's…, she has got some party for sahkirtana.

Gurudasa: Yes. She was in Calcutta, she told me.

Prabhupada: She has become something, incarnation, like that. That is his proposal. And she cries.

Gurudasa: She is not… [break]

Prabhupada: She is simply exploiting some women's sentiments, by giving them some deity and crying. And woman, they're simple. This way, she wanted to captivate donors. I know that. She has got some foolish woman, innocent woman. I say foolish, innocent. And naturally their husbands become inclined.

Gurudasa: Hmm.

Prabhupada: Actually she has no… She is not a preacher. She is a sentimental so-called religionist among some women, and naturally their husbands… And she has no objection. Whatever you do, it doesn't matter. Therefore she is getting some followers, and posing herself as… She's opening hospital. That means she has no asset.

Gurudasa: True.

Prabhupada: We are going without opening hospital and school; rather challenging…

Gurudasa: [laughs]

Prabhupada: …and diminishing everything, decrying. We do not agree with anyone, and still people like us. Is it not?

Gurudasa: Yes.

Prabhupada: Our first proposition is that "You do not know anything."

Gurudasa: [laughs]

Prabhupada: [laughs] And still they'll agreed to come to us.

Gurudasa: Yes, Delhi is very successful. People are asking, asking, asking.

Prabhupada: Yes, yes. Walking in the morning, and someone came to me, "Ah, we thought that somewhere you have gone." When we have got regular center here, they should come.

Gurudasa: I mean they were asking questions, like "Who am I?" And… [break] [end]