Prabhupada: Jayadeva's, that poetry, that Krsna is begging pardon from Radharani, that is also very confidential. Dehi pada-pallava...

Guest (1) (Indian man): We have recorded songs, thirty-four songs, written by the ancient poets and Jayadeva.

Guest (2) (Indian man): Vaisnavas.

Guest (1): All Vaisnavas.

Prabhupada: People misunderstand this Krsna's behavior with Radharani and the gopis as ordinary woman-hunters.

Guest (2): No, no.

Prabhupada: You say no, but they take it like that. Even a person like Vivekananda, he said long ago that "This Vaisnavism is sex religion." They misunderstand. So just try to understand. This lila is kept in the Srimad-Bhagavatam in the Tenth Canto, and middle of Tenth Canto, Thirty-fourth, Thirty-fifth Chapter. So one has to understand Krsna first of all. So it is not for ordinary men. So we discourage these things to be discussed or presented even for ordinary men. This is our preaching. It cannot be taken as ordinary film show.

Guest (2): No, sir, he was taking it in different angle, that Krsna was by these Vaisnavas.

Prabhupada: That's all right...

Guest (2): That is the rasa. We are talking of the rasa-lila.

Prabhupada: Rasa, that is not for ordinary persons. It is most confidential. So this has deteriorated. Otherwise, so many gentlemen come here... And India, they are asking, "What is God?" This is the question. "Why God was killed?" Yesterday this was the question.

Guest (2): We also came. We were also there. And Mr. Karana was asking nice questions. Yesterday evening he was here.

Prabhupada: So in India... You are born in India, where God comes as Lord Ramacandra, as Lord Krsna, as Lord Caitanya, and you are asking, "What is God?" So how much deteriorated you have become, just imagine. So we are trying to reform all this nonsense business, and how I can associate?

Guest (2): No, no, we don't ask your association. We want your blessing.

Prabhupada: How can I give my blessing? It is... I protest, rather. I protest, rather. You should not present this.

Guest (1): No, this is about the activities of Lord Sri Krsna.

Prabhupada: No, no, you said Jayadeva's.

Guest (1): We have taken some rasa, merely some songs of Jayadeva.

Prabhupada: That's all right. That is also dealing with the gopis. Dehi pada-palavam udaram. So these things are not ordinary things. You should understand that. If you make, propagate, then the people... I have seen one book one rascal Bhattacarya has written. And the United Nation or something like that supported, gave him, them money. And in the cover of the book he has given a picture of Radharani sitting naked. This is going on.

Guest (1): No, sir, the pictures you were having, this rasa lila, this is also these very things. We have seen those pictures.

Prabhupada: No, but... No, that's all right. That picture is in the book. That book is... We are translating Srimad-Bhagavatam. And what...

Guest (1): No, even in mandir there is a big photograph of Radha, Hari Gopala(?) rasa-lila.

Prabhupada: That is not presented in that way. So we do not say... But these warnings that... It is... We must understand it is very confidential thing. It is not for ordinary men. If we present as ordinary thing, that is distortion. Our... I have got stricture that we don't present...

Guest (2): (showing picture?) This is our... Here. You made this. This is...

Prabhupada: This is Radha-Krsna. That's all right. But generally, gopis, rasa-lila and gopis, vastra-harana-lila...

Guest (2): No, no. Vastra-harana is not...

Guest (1): All is concentratedthe Radha-Krsna lila.

Prabhupada: No, no. Why don't you present...? Krsna has so many lilas. Just like... Where is our Krsna book? You have got?

Hari-sauri: I can get a copy.

Prabhupada: Yes. There is...

Hari-sauri: Any volume, or...?

Prabhupada: That... Krsna is killing Kamsa.

Guest (1): That is the final lila of Sri Krsna.

Prabhupada: Not final.

Guest (1): No, we are having four things. We have an institution here. We are just presenting the Krsna lilas part by part. First we are presenting the bala-lila, the children part...

Prabhupada: So why don't you present Krsna's fighting in the...? Just like Kuruksetra.

Guest (1): That is Mahabharata. That is the part also.

Prabhupada: That is also Krsna-lila.

Guest (1): For sure. So we have now produced three parts, and two more parts are there to be produced. [break]

Prabhupada: Take prasada. Generally... Of course, I do not know what you have done. Generally they present rasa-lila. They describe rasa-lila. These professional Bhagavata means they immediately begin to recite rasa-lila. Bhagavata reading dissertation means rasa-lila. And people take in a different way, that "Krsna was woman-hunter. He married sixteen thousand wives, and He had three hundred thousand gopis, and He was enjoying with woman. Just see." I saw one doctor. He was a debauch. He was Muhammadan. So his friend came. So... In Calcutta. So he was addressing, kibava Krsna.(?) Just see. Krsna means debauch.

Guest (2): No.

Prabhupada: No, no, you don't mean, but people have taken like that. Anyone who is woman-hunter, he is Krsna. This is going on.

Guest (2): Therefore, Guruji, we have started...

Guest (1): This is the spiritual way we have started.

Guest (2): Spiritual way, we started from that Vrndavana, with this Krsna... Atma, Paramatma (Oriya) Here to start. Then we'll go to that...

Prabhupada: No, no. Why you start from this? Why not start Krsna's birth, Krsna's playing with cowherd boys, Krsna's...?

Guest (1): So we have that lila. That is bala-lila.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Guest (2): Then here Krsna... The spring has come, and this is... You have got here the Govardhana puja, and Krsna's lila with these cowherd boys, and they're going on. In the spring they are going out... Here, in Orissa also, in Bengal also. On the full moon day of Phalguna we get that..., where all the cows meet together and we get this. From that function we started. We have established that...

Prabhupada: On the whole, my point is: it is a very difficult subject matter. So unless we very carefully deal, people will misunderstand.

Guest (2): We have carefully dealt with...

Guest (1): So we have given them images the superpower of Lord Sri Krsna.

Guest (2): It is not a question of sex. It is super divine power.

Prabhupada: You say like that.

Guest (2): No, no. We are presenting. I am presenting this way. That is superpower.

Guest (1): When Madhu-mangala, when he was thinking that Sri Krsna is a general man and was for these ladies only, then he saw that visvarupa of Sri Krsna on the screen, all the universes inside Sri Krsna...

Guest (2): All the universes moving about.

Prabhupada: That's nice.

Guest (2): We have taken that aspect, that He's a superpower.

Guest (1): When he is thinking He's man, He's not the man. He's the superman.

Guest (2): Also we have seen that...

Guest (1): And all the universes inside revolving.

Guest (2): That is our message. Krsna is not ordinary. Superpower.

Prabhupada: He's the Supreme Personality of Godhead.

Guest (2): He's the supreme power.

Guest (1): We have produced this. Also we have produced things last ten years. Last, even Orissa, this lila, Sri Krsna lila, is very famous from the very ancient years.

Guest (2): Not from the sex. That aspect... [break]

Prabhupada: ...fourth, Thirty-fifth Chapter, when Pariksit Maharaja was inquiring from Sukadeva Gosvami that Krsna came to establish religious principles...

Hari-sauri: I just read that.

Prabhupada: Eh?

Hari-sauri: I just read that today.

Prabhupada: Oh, yes, yes. Find it.

Hari-sauri: "Songs of the Gopis," I think.

Prabhupada: He pointed out this, that "He came to establish religious principles. How is that He danced with other's wife in midnight?" This question was raised by Pariksit Maharaja to Sukadeva Gosvami, and how he has answered? Read it.

Hari-sauri: Says, "There is a distinction between Lord Krsna's dancing with the gopis and the ordinary dancing of living entities within the material world. In order to clear up further misconceptions about the rasa dance and the affairs of Krsna and the gopis, Maharaja Pariksit, the hearer of Srimad-Bhagavatam, told Sukadeva Gosvami: 'Krsna appeared on the earth to establish the regulative principles of religion and to curb the predominance of irreligion. But the behavior of Krsna and the gopis might encourage irreligious principles in the material world. I am simply surprised that He would act in such a way and join the company of others' wives in the dead of night.' "

Prabhupada: Just see.

Hari-sauri: "This statement of Pariksit Maharaja's was very much appreciated by Sukadeva Gosvami. The answer anticipates the abominable activities of the Mayavadi impersonalists, who place themselves in the position of Krsna and enjoy the company of young girls and women. The basic Vedic injunctions never allow a person to enjoy sex with any woman except one's own wife. Krsna's appreciation of the gopis appeared to be distinctly in violation of these rules. Maharaja Pariksit understood the total situation from Sukadeva Gosvami, yet to further clear the transcendental nature of Krsna and the gopis in the rasa dance, he expressed his surprise. This is very important in order to check the unrestricted association with women by the prakrta-sahajiya. In his statement, Maharaja Pariksit has used several important..."

Prabhupada: In Vrndavana this prakrta-sahajiya, they are making bhajana that a man, he thinks that "I am Krsna"; another woman...

Guest (2): That is Radha.

Prabhupada: "Radha." This rascaldom is going on.

Guest (1): Others are gopis. It was also in Orissa also previously.

Prabhupada: Just see.

Guest (2): That is gone. That is gone. Previously in that rasas, they get decorate oneself and Krsna.

Prabhupada: Now they have taken it as bhajana, to associate with other woman, and he becomes Krsna, and (s)he's Radharani, and they're making bhajana. This rascaldom is going on. Go on.

Hari-sauri: "In his statement, Maharaja Pariksit has used several important words which require clarification. The first word, jugupsitam, means 'abominable.' The first doubt of Pariksit Maharaja was as follows: Lord Krsna is the Supreme Personality of Godhead, who has advented Himself to establish religious principles. Why then did He mix with others' wives in the dead of night and enjoy dancing, embracing, and kissing? According to Vedic injunctions this is not allowed. Also, when the gopis first came to Him, He gave instructions for them to return to their homes. To call the wives of other persons or young girls and enjoy dancing with them is certainly abominable according to the Vedas. And why should Krsna have done this? Another word used here is aptakama. Some may take it for granted that Krsna was very lusty amongst young girls, but Pariksit Maharaja said that this was not possible. He could not be lusty. First of all, from the material calculation He was only eight years old. At that age a boy cannot be lusty. Aptakama means that the Supreme Personality of Godhead is self-satisfied. Even if He were lusty, He does not need to take help from others to satisfy His lusty desires. The next point is that although not lusty Himself, He might have been induced by the lusty desires of the gopis. But Maharaja Pariksit then used another word, yadupati, which indicates that Krsna is the most exalted personality in the dynasty of the Yadus. The kings in the dynasty of Yadu were considered to be the most pious, and their descendants were also like that."

Prabhupada: This is described in the sastra. If one hears of the Yadu-vamsa, he becomes purified. And Krsna is addressed, Yadupati. Then?

Hari-sauri: "Having taken birth in that family, how could Krsna have been induced even by the gopis? It is concluded therefore that it was not possible for Krsna to do anything abominable. But Maharaja Pariksit was in doubt as to why Krsna acted in that way. What was the real purpose? Another word Maharaja Pariksit used when he addressed Sukadeva Gosvami is suvrata, which means to take a vow to enact pious activities. Sukadeva Gosvami was an educated brahmacari, and under the circumstance it was not possible for him to indulge in sex. This is strictly prohibited for brahmacaris, and what to speak of a brahmacari like Sukadeva Gosvami. But because the circumstances of the rasa dance were very suspect, Maharaja Pariksit inquired for clarification from Sukadeva Gosvami. Sukadeva Gosvami immediately replied that transgressions of religious principles by the supreme controller testify to His great power. For example, fire can consume any abominable thing. That is the manifestation of the supremacy of fire. Similarly, the sun can absorb water from urine or from stool, and the sun is not polluted. Rather, due to the influence of sunshine the polluted, contaminated place becomes disinfected and sterilized. One may also argue that since Krsna is the supreme authority, His activities should be followed. In answer to this question, Sukadeva Gosvami has very clearly said, isvaranam, or the supreme controller, may sometimes violate His instructions, but this is only possible for the controller Himself and not for the followers. Unusual and uncommon activities by the controller can never be imitated. Sukadeva Gosvami warns that the conditioned followers who are not actually in control should never even imagine imitating the uncommon activities of the controller. A Mayavadi philosopher may falsely claim to be God or Krsna, but he cannot actually act like Krsna. He can persuade his followers to falsely imitate the rasa dance, but he is unable to lift Govardhana Hill. We have many experiences in the past of Mayavadi rascals deluding their followers by posing themselves as Krsna in order to enjoy rasa lila. In many instances they were checked by the government, arrested and punished. In Orissa, Thakura Bhaktivinoda also punished the so-called incarnation of Visnu who was imitating rasa-lila with young girls. There were many complaints against him. At that time Bhaktivinoda Thakura was a magistrate, and the government deputed him to deal with that rascal, and he punished him very severely. The rasa-lila dance cannot be imitated by anyone. Sukadeva Gosvami warns that one should not even think of imitating it. He specifically mentions that if out of foolishness one tries to imitate Krsna's rasa dance he will be killed, just like a person who wants to imitate Lord Siva's drinking of an ocean of poison. Lord Siva drank an ocean of poison and kept it within his throat. The poison made his throat turn blue, and therefore Lord Siva is called nila-kantha. But if any ordinary person tries to imitate Lord Siva by drinking poison or by smoking ganja, he is sure be vanquished and will die within a very short time. Lord Sri Krsna's dealing with the gopis was under special circumstances."

Prabhupada: It is not for public show. That is the idea.

Hari-sauri: There's a little bit more. Should I read it?

Prabhupada: Read it.

Hari-sauri: "Most of the gopis in their previous lives were very great sages, expert in the study of the Veda, and when Lord Krsna appeared as Lord Ramacandra they wanted to enjoy with Him. Lord Ramacandra gave them the benediction that their desires would be fulfilled when He would appear as Krsna. Therefore the desire of the gopis to enjoy the appearance of Lord Krsna was long cherished. So they approached goddess Katyayani to have Krsna as their husband. There are so many other circumstances also which testify to the Supreme authority of Krsna and show that He is not bound to the rules and regulations of the material world. In special cases He acts as He likes to favor His devotees. This is only possible for Him because He is the supreme controller. People in general should follow the instructions of Lord Krsna as given in Bhagavad-gita and should not even imagine imitating Lord Krsna in the rasa dance."

Guest (1): In our original language, in Oriya, there is a book, preface of the book Maha-vandana. This is written by...

Prabhupada: Maha-vandana is a fact. That is all right. But it is meant for the liberated soul.

Guest (1): Certainly.

Guest (2): Guruji, I am telling you a single word.

Prabhupada: So it cannot be demonstrated to the ordinary person.

Guest (2): No, one babaji, Vaisnava-Carana dasa, years back, he was at...

Prabhupada: No. There are many babajis. Just like I told you...

Guest (1): No, no. He wrote a preface for that book. The preface is...

Prabhupada: ...that he's thinking himself as Krsna and others' woman as the gopis. They are doing that.

Guest (1): No, no. Same thing. It has been written. It has been advised time to time. This is in our language also. This text...

Guest (2): And he has observed there, "Those who will act Krsna and Radha, they should have sadhana. They should devotee. They should not take any..." You have to go to that tulasi tree and you have to worship that fruit of...

Prabhupada: My point is that for ordinary discussion, ordinary show, these things are not meant for. That is my point.

Guest (1): No, we are just depicting the lilas.

Prabhupada: It is not that they should be forbidden altogether. No. That is meant for a certain high-class devotees, not for ordinary persons.

Guest (2): Here they say that when you get to this Maha-vandana or Krsna lila, they take... Any party. Even one Vaisnava, he was getting a troupe and making that Krsna conscious movement here. Or that some of this... The Suri Patel, he became leper. And the woman who was acting as the Radha, she also became the victim of leprosy.

Prabhupada: So why should take such risk? (laughs)

Guest (2): No. No, no, no. What happened...

Prabhupada: It happened, and it must happen. It must happen. So why should you take that risk?

Guest (1): This is... We are depicting the lila...

Prabhupada: Any... Anyway...

Guest (1): You are telling and your disciples are always telling about Krsna's sacred(?) lilas. So we are your disciples, and we are telling the lila in different form. It is in vision. And we are starting from Sarva-bhumna or Sarvabhauma...

Guest (2): We started for keeping the traditions of the songs of the Vaisnavas.

Guest (1): All traditions of Sri Krsna lila, all Vaisnava, everything.

Guest (2): One aspect. One aspect we have taken, that supreme, the message, essence...

Prabhupada: No, no... It is... Krsna-lila is in the Srimad-Bhagavatam. So Srimad-Bhagavatam, why don't you begin from the first chapter of the Srimad-Bhagavatam? Janmady asya yatah [SB 1.1.1]. Just show how Krsna is supreme, how everything is coming, coming from Him. Janmady asya yatah anvayad itaratas carthesv abhijnah svarat [SB 1.1.1]. These things explain by picture. That will be real education. Why you jump over on the Tenth Canto immediately? That is my point.

Guest (1): No, we understand. We are depicting the...

Prabhupada: Begin.

Indian man: ...aspect, supreme superman.

Prabhupada: Just like one learns from ABCD, not jumping over M.A. class. That is my point. Teach people from the ABCD. So this is the beginning of Srimad-Bhagavatam. Janmady asya yatah [SB 1.1.1]. What Krsna? He is the original. Aham sarvasya prabhavah [Bg. 10.8]. Show that by film, how He is sarvasya prabhavo. That will be...

Guest (1): So He is always supreme power.

Prabhupada: That's all right. Not... You are going to produce some film. Begin from the first chapter of Srimad-Bhagavatam. Why you jump over the Tenth Canto? That is kept very confidential. Unless one understands... By understanding nine cantos of Srimad-Bhagavatam, he has no entrance. Just like you cannot enter into the law college unless you are graduate. So Sukadeva Gosvami has arranged in such a way that one should understand what is Krsna by reading these nine cantos. Then he can enter into the Krsna's lila and Krsna's birth. What is the purpose? He could have given Krsna... Srimad-Bhagavatam is for Krsna. So we have named this, Krsna. Krsna-katha. So first Krsna-katha is: Krsna is explaining Himself in the Bhagavad-gita. Present Bhagavad-gita. Then one accept Krsna as the Supreme Personality... Sarva dharman parityajya mam ekam saranam vraja [Bg. 18.66]. When he comes to that stage, then Bhagavata begins. Dharmah projjhita-kaitavo 'tra paramo nirmatsaranam [SB 1.1.2]. Paramo nirmatsaranam. Unless one is matsara... "Oh, Krsna is doing that? Why I cannot do it?" The sahajiya babajis, they do that. That is matsarata, that "Krsna can do? I can also do." So he simply imitates Krsna's rasa-lila. And Krsna can raise the Govardhana Hillthat is not possible. That is... What is called? Mythology. What he cannot do, he takes as mythology. And what he can easily imitate and go to hell, that is very good.

Guest (2): This very assertion, to our eyes, that... Our (indistinct) tells about Krsna. So we can't take it otherwise.

Prabhupada: No, no, you cannot take, but the public will take like that.

Guest (1): No, when Madhava thinks that "Give me the flute and I'll be the Krsna," then he remains in the...

Guest (2): Nobody is coming...

Guest (1): This Visva-rupa.

Prabhupada: No, our... Just like we are making Krsna consciousness propaganda all over...

Guest (2): That, education, not for... Education.

Prabhupada: That is wanted. What is Krsna you should understand.

Guest (2): That is education, not propaganda.

Prabhupada: Yes. So these boys, they are advised to follow the regulative principle: no illicit sex, no meat-eating, no fish, no egg, no onion. So many "no's."

Guest (2): That is also...

Guest (1): No, Guruji, you cannot take these persons who are by this strictness as your disciple only.

Prabhupada: No. Yes. Yes.

Guest (1): You should take us as your disciple even.

Prabhupada: You should follow my rules and regulations. I can take.

Guest (2): As you have advised that a sun doesn't only act on the fouls of purity. The purity is for all.

Prabhupada: But I am not that sun.

Guest (1): We're also enlightened by your knowledge.

Guest (2): No, no, sir. Definitely. At least light of this... Light of the Krsna consciousness. Krsna consciousness, you are giving it to all.

Prabhupada: So... No, no. So you have to take the light and the suna process. Adau sraddha tato sadhu sango tato bhajana-kriya.

Guest (2): All right.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Guest (2): When you are giving a darsana... Yesterday we came to see you. That, these people, had to go to Bombay yesterday. But when a certain uttered that you have come here, we were astonished. They ran to my office, told me that "Guruji has come." "No, you are wrong." "No, you see. It is from our local newspaper." He's from Bengal. So he came for us and told me he would let us go and see. By five o'clock they had told him... "Let us go." We came here, and there's some people here I was talking to him. That engineer when Guruji tell that no rain, he was searching for the water, (indistinct) in that I was telling him that way. So Guruji when you are giving the light, wisdom, or making blessing that you become filled the superness. You surrender yourself.

Prabhupada: Yes. That is our propaganda.

Guest (2): The surrender to... So similarly, suppose I am a drunkard.

Prabhupada: No, it is no disqualification.

Guest (2): Guruji, my argument is this.

Prabhupada: Yes, Caitanya Mahaprabhu...

Guest (2): We are associated with the sadhus.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Guest (2): All associate with the sadhu. That will clean us. As you have told us in this book, that becomes more cleaner.

Prabhupada: Caitanya Mahaprabhu... Caitanya Mahaprabhu... No. We are prepared to take you also. Why not? It is not difficult. That Caitanya Mahaprabhu, when accepted Jagai-Madhai, so Narottama dasa Thakura sings, papi tapi jata chilo, hari-name uddharilo tara saksi jagai madhai. So the evidence is not that, by words. But evidence... So how? How He accepted? When Jagai-Madhai, after injuring Nityananda, so Caitanya Mahaprabhu was very angry that "I shall kill them!" So at that time Nityananda begged, "Sir, You have promised not to take weapon in this avatara. So excuse them." So as soon Nityananda Prabhu said like that, both the brothers fell down on the feet of Caitanya Mahaprabhu: "Sir. Excuse us. We have done wrong. So please deliver us. We are most sinful." So Caitanya Mahaprabhu said that "You are sinful. That is not disqualification. But if you want My asraya, then you stop this sinful life. No more. Whatever you have done, that's all right. I excuse you. But no more." So they said, ara nare bap: "Bas, whatever we have done." So this is wanted. But if we continue to take shelter of Caitanya Mahaprabhu or His representative, at the same time continue our sinful activities, that is not desirable.

Guest (2): That is not possible.

Prabhupada: Yes. Yes.

Guest (1): Guruji, we are taking your life as our own way. We are taking it.

Prabhupada: No, you cannot take in your way. That is not possible, no.

Guest (1): But you are spreading it all through the world.

Guest (2): Guruji, my soul, when I surrender, becomes the...

Prabhupada: That is the first condition. You must surrender.

Guest (2): That is surrender, the only thing.

Prabhupada: Yes. That is the beginning. Sarva-dharman parityajya mam ekam saranam [Bg. 18.66]. Unless Jagai-Madhai surrendered and stopped their sinful activities... That is wanted.

Guest (1): But there are some ways. Even I am influenced by your ideas. That is some other thing. Somebody's influenced by your appearance. Somebody's influenced by your dialects.

Prabhupada: No, there is no question of amendment.

Guest (2): No amendment.

Prabhupada: You can... Yes. You say that "Somebody does like, somebody does like, somebody..." No. Full surrender. Sarva-dharman parityajya mam ekam [Bg. 18.66].

Guest (2): No conditional. Conditional means that we have hidden here any enemy to fight over his property.

Prabhupada: If I would have compromised, then many millions of students I would have got. Anyone comes to me"First surrender."

Guest (2): But Guruji, kindly excuse me. There is Drona and Ekalavya.

Prabhupada: That's nice, but...

Guest (2): But if I have got the concentration, I can find you in me.

Prabhupada: That is special case.

Guest (2): That is special case. That is devotion. That is surrender, actually a complete surrender.

Prabhupada: Still, you know... Surrender... Surrender, but he did not do it properly. Therefore Dronacarya did not like.

Guest (2): But he has got the devotion. He has complete surrender to Dronacarya.

Prabhupada: You know that Ekalavya. He asked that "You do that."

Guest (2): Oh, yes. In the interest of the Kauravas and Pandavas.

Prabhupada: Anyway, that means he did not like.

Guest (1): But the superpower.

Guest (2): I don't know. But what you think that actually Drona, er, Ekalavya is the disciple of...?

Prabhupada: The general process we have to accept. Adau sraddha. If you think that "This line of action is very nice, Krsna consciousness," this is called sraddha. And sraddha is explained by Kaviraja Gosvami, sraddha sabde visvasa surila niscaya, krsne bhakti kaile sarva karma krta haya. This is sraddha. When one is firmly convinced, firmly. Sudrdha visvasa.

Guest (2): Sir, we have got similar in Oriya. Visvasa sunile krsna tate vata. Tate vata is surrender. You surrender.

Prabhupada: Surrender means full faith, that "Whatever Krsna said is all right. I'll not do anything, and I shall simply surrender to Krsna." That is surrender, not that one may be attracted by this, one may be attracted by this, one may...

Guest (1): No, we read literature, and we are surrendered.

Prabhupada: Simply I am attracted with the words of Krsna. That's all. No compromise.

Guest (2): No compromise. No compromise. There is no question of compromise.

Prabhupada: That is not surrender.

Guest (1): Guruji, we must get your blessing definitely. In future we are...

Prabhupada: Then, if you make conditional blessing...

Guest (2): No, no. No condition. With full devotion, full surrender...

Prabhupada: Best thing is... This is the formula given by every big personality. The Rupa Gosvami, he is authorized person for bhakti-marga. He says, adau sraddha tato sadhu-sanga.

Guest (2): We are so lucky. We are writing the letter... We wrote here that "From distant land of Orissa, Guruji... This is... Your literature has tempted us, and perhaps it is your intention that we should go upon..., with Nitai Gaura..."

Prabhupada: Just like our this Krsna book, from the very beginning, or Bhagavad-gita. You try...

Guest (2): So eleven or twelve days' time... We have posted the letter on seventh, and yesterday this gentleman from here rang me that "You were searching for the Guruji, and he is at..." "Nonsense." When I am busy giving some dictation to my steno. "He is humbug." So from there we came here.

Prabhupada: Thank you. Hare Krsna. So if you want to give education, take it from the very beginning, ABCD, and present nicely so that people may..., can take advantage.

Guest (1): We have that lila also, Bala-lila. The children chant...

Prabhupada: Bala-lila also will not be understood. They will think, "What is this?" That is stated in the Srimad... Ittham brahma-sukhanubhutya dasyam gatanam para-daivatena, mayasritanam nara-darakena. Mayasritanam. They'll not.... They'll: "What is this nonsense? A boy is playing, and they are worshiping Him?" That's it. These people will take like that, that "What is that? A boy is playing with some cows and calves, and these foolish persons are worshiping." They will take it.

Guest (2): It is said also there. When Yasoda tries to beat Him, oh, He shows the universe.

Prabhupada: So who will understand that?

Guest (2): No, no, no, no, all understand it. All will understand, sir.

Prabhupada: So beginning means from the Bhagavata beginning or from Bhagavad-gita begins.

Guest (2): But when Vasudeva is coming with Krsna, and Yamuna goes out, goes out, and it makes a way and that...

Guest (1): Years long back, Orissa was full devotees of Sri Krsna, long back.

Prabhupada: Oh, yes. I know that.

Guest (2): Krsna lila means when they read that Bhagavata.

Guest (1): Our grandfather, grandmother, they are more well read and well known about Sri Krsna.

Guest (2): Still they are living if you go to a village.

Prabhupada: But your grandmother did it, all right, but now you are asking, "What is God?" This is your position. Your position is that you are asking, "What is God?" That means you do not believe what is Krsna. Otherwise why you are asking, "What is God?"

Guest (2): I tell you...

Prabhupada: Now first of all, you answer this. Yesterday the question was "What is God?"

Guest (2): The gentleman asked.

Prabhupada: Yes. You say the Orissa is whole Krsna-bhakta, and he's asking, "What is God?" This is your position.

Guest (1): He's asking to get a word from you, perhaps.

Prabhupada: Why? Why this botheration if he knows Krsna? I was surprised. If he's actually Krsna-bhakta, if he knows Krsna, then why should he ask, "Who is God? What is God?" Don't try to defend in that way.

Guest (2): No, no, we're not defending.

Prabhupada: If you know God, why should you ask, "What is God?"

Guest (2): Unless he knows God, why he's not come here?

Prabhupada: No, you are very proud that "Our Orissa is very advanced in knowing Krsna."

Guest (2): No, no...

Prabhupada: You just now told. And your Orissa man says, "What is God?" Just try to understand your position. You are advertising that you know Krsna very well, and again you are asking, "What is God?"

Guest (2): No, devotees...

Guest (1): Krsna, I mean to say that Krsna devotees.

Prabhupada: No, no, Krsna devotee... You are saying that your Orissa is very much great advanced in understanding Krsna, and your Orissa man is asking, "What is God?" This is contradictory. He does not know what is Krsna. Otherwise there was no question to ask, "What is God?" Krsnas tu bhagavan svayam [SB 1.3.28]. He should have known. But you have forgotten. Admit this.

Guest (1): Oh, definitely.

Prabhupada: Yes. So therefore you have to learn from the very beginning. In foreign countries, Indian students, they say, "Oh, Swamiji, what will be done by this Krsna, Hare Krsna? We require technology." They say like that.

Guest (2): Indian students.

Prabhupada: We have rejected. Otherwise why there was so much talk, yata mat tata pat? Why yata mat tata pat? The Supreme Lord Krsna is saying, mam ekam. And yata mat? What is this nonsense? Admit that you have forgotten Krsna, or you do not know what is Krsna. Otherwise why bring this all question"What is God? Yata mat tata pat. Why Krsna was killed?" Krsna can be killed?

Guest (2): He asked?

Prabhupada: Yes. Who asked?

Guest (2): That gentleman yesterday was saying.

Prabhupada: Yes. "Why Krsna was killed?" Just see how rascal question this is.

Guest (2): He was not killed. Krsna was not killed.

Prabhupada: That is the fact, but he... Why he questioned this, "How Krsna was killed?"

Guest (1): I was not there.

Guest (2): Yesterday we sat here. (both talking at once)

Prabhupada: Ordinary question... Krsna has advised in the Bhagavad-gita, na jayate na mriyate va kadacit, na hanyate hanyamane sari... [Bg. 2.20]. This is for living entity, soul. And living entity is the part and parcel of Krsna. So the part and parcel of Krsna, na jayate na mriyate. Na hanyate hanyamane sarire [Bg. 2.20]. And "Krsna, the supreme whole, He was killed." Just see the question, fun. Means he has no common sense even"Krsna was killed." "The part and parcel cannot be killed, but the whole can be killed." Just see his intelligence. If I say, "Not a single portion of this room can be destroyed," but "The whole house was destroyed," what is this nonsense? Part and parcel... Na jayate na mriyate kadacit. Kadacit, this word, is used, "at any time." And "The whole is killed."

Guest (1): Who can kill?

Prabhupada: No, he asked this question.

Guest (1): Who can kill the supreme power?

Guest (2): Oriya Bhagavatam also it is said that no one can kill...

Prabhupada: No, the atheist class, they ask this question: "Krsna was killed; therefore He's ordinary man."

Guest (1): It is a story.

Prabhupada: Not story. So you have to learn Krsna. That is my point. Manusyanam sahasresu kascid yatati siddhaya... [Bg. 7.3].

Guest (1): (Oriyan)

Guest (3) (Indian man): Our grandfather, grandmother, all were addicted to Lord Sri Krsna. But we have forgotten it.

Prabhupada: You have forgotten, so that now you are asking, "What is God?" This is your position.

Guest (1): That is what happened now.

Prabhupada: So you should know your position first of all.

Guest (3): Gradually we are now developing, making drama, this, that. We are taking it just as if Krsna-lila itself is a fact. It is a theatrical thing?

Prabhupada: Yes.

Guest (3): In that way we are acting. That's why we are going to Bhagavad-gita, this, that, all these things, only to...

Prabhupada: Satisfy our senses.

Guest (1): Senses, but not that.

Prabhupada: So if you are serious, you let us combine together, learn Krsna consciousness, deliver your country, as Caitanya Mahaprabhu advised that amara ajnaya guru hana tara ei desa [Cc. Madhya 7.128]. The whole country has gone to hell. So many people come, ask me all odd question... (tape distortedbreak)

Guest (3): Out of their... This Hare Krsna.

Prabhupada: (Bengali)

Guest (2): Yesterday one of my colleagues asked me, "What is this (Bengali)?" But we, the parents of Mother Earth forget about it. But Swamiji has started it not only Europe, America, he has started universal... Except India (Bengali)... You said that you are educated man, you go and hear lecture.

Prabhupada: No, we are recognized by all educated circle all over the world. If you read the opinions of scholars.

Guest (2): We have read many of your publications. And I was just telling him like dharma that "Swamiji has done only one thing, that he has made the universe not only contained to India. He has made the whole world conscious about Krsna. To know about Krsna at least, the real Krsna. Or the superpower. He has made this point.

Prabhupada: Therefore we have to progress very cautiously, very cautiously, not irresponsibly. That is our point.

Guest (2): Recently I had been to Calcutta for the recording of this songs of krsna-lila. (Oriya or Bengali)

Guest (1): Yasoda and Krsna. (Oriya or Bengali)

Guest (2): Unless they go back to Krsna, nobody can help us to that.

Prabhupada: (Bengali) (end)