Room Conversation

April 27, 1969, Boston
Prabhupada: So we take account of past, present, future of this creation. When I say, "Some years ago I was there," that means within this creation. It does not go some years in your past creation. Do you follow what I say? Are you following what I am saying?
Devotee (1) (woman): Yes.
Prabhupada: You are feeling all right? Satsvarupa?
Satsvarupa: Yes.
Prabhupada: Yes. You did not go to the airport?
Satsvarupa: No. I gave the lecture that was cancelled at...
Prabhupada: Oh. Lecture?
Satsvarupa: You were supposed to give a lecture today, but because you gave a lecture last night in Buffalo, we cancelled it and I went instead.
Prabhupada: So you lectured there? That's nice. Now you have to lecture. I will have to retire. (chuckles) I want that all my students now should be prepared. Purusottama, you sit down. You are standing. You come here. Sit down. When, at present, when we speak of past, present, future, we refer to this particular creation of my body. Is it not? Similarly, "never return back." "Never return back" means... What is your question? I... missing point. Whose question it...? Yes.
Devotee (1): What is the question? That if we've never been with Krsna, if we've never been in Krsnaloka, then how is it that we start remembering His pastimes and His form?
Prabhupada: You remember Krsna's pastimes by hearing Srimad-Bhagavatam. You can hear Krsna's pastimes. That you can remember.
Devotee (1): But how can we remember if we've never known them before?
Prabhupada: How you can remember?
Devotee (1): If we haven't known it.
Prabhupada: You can know it by hearing from Srimad-Bhagavatam. Why we are citing so many scriptures, Srimad-Bhagavatam, Bhagavad-gita? Just to remember.
Devotee (1): Just to remember?
Prabhupada: Something you forget, but I tell you repeatedly, you hear; you remember. Is it not? Here something you have forgotten completely, and I remind you constantly. Then don't you remember?
Devotee (1): Yes. But I don't understand how is it that we forgot it... How can we remember...
Prabhupada: Forgot, you forgot. That is your nature. You forget so many things. You cannot remember what you were doing exactly at this time yesterday. Can you remember immediately? Forgetfulness is our nature. We are very minute; therefore our..., we are subjected to the quality of forgetfulness. Just like Arjuna. Arjuna was asking Krsna that "How I can believe that you told this philosophy of Bhagavad-gita to Vivasvan?" He said that "In... I, first of all, I told to Vivasvan." So in reply to that question, Krsna said that "Both you and I had many, many births before, but you have forgotten; I remember." That is the difference between the Supreme Lord and ourself. He does not forget. He remembers everything, past, present, future, all, but we forget. That is the difference between God and living entity. We are subjected to forgetfulness. So we forget; again, if it is reminded, we remind. That is our nature. So at the present moment we are forgetful of our eternal relationship with Krsna. And then, by good association, by constant chanting, hearing, remembering, we again revoke our old consciousness. That is called Krsna consciousness. So forgetfulness is not wonderful. It is natural. We forget. But if we keep constant touch, we may not forget. Therefore this association of Krsna consciousness, devotees, and constant repetition of the chanting, scripture, that will keep us intact without forgetting. Satatam kirtayanto mam yatantas ca drdha-vratah [Bg. 9.14]. We have to continue this service constantly. Then we shall not forget. Forgetfulness is not wonderful. That is our nature. That is our nature. And that is the difference between ourself and God. God does not forget. We forget. We are claiming, some of us, foolishly claiming, that "I am God, but I forget." God does not forget. Therefore I am not God. Is that clear? That is the difference between living jiva and Siva, God. He does not forget. In the Bhagavad-gita He says, vedaham samatitani: [Bg. 7.26] "I know everything of this present, past, future, everything." But we do not know. We have forgotten. In our daily life, in our childhood, so many things we did. We don't remember. But our parents may remember that as a child, that we did this. So forgetfulness is our nature. But if we keep constant touch with Krsna, then He will give us remembrance. So sarvasya caham hrdi sannivisto [Bg. 15.15]. Krsna says in the Fifteenth Chapter. Now you read Bhagavad-gita very carefully. In our examination next January... Yes. From Bhagavad-gita for title of bhakti-sastri. Now we have to make our organization regularly a spiritual institution so that we may be recognized, and our students may be freed from this draft board requisition. That I am... Next step is going on. [Break] Na tasya karyam karanam ca vidyate. Purusottama? Why don't you get that tape? Yes.
Prabhupada: Na tasya karyam karanam ca vidyate na tasya samadhikas ca drsyate. This is from Upanisad. Parasya saktir vividhaiva sruyate svabhaviki-jnana-bala-kriya ca [Cc. Madhya 13.65, purport]. It is said that nobody is seeing... This is called research. You are accepting any nonsense as God, and they do not have any information from the..., that God means na tasya karyam karanam ca vidyate na tasya samadhikas ca drsyate: "God has nothing to do, no responsibility. Nobody is found greater than Him." So if this Vedic injunction is followed, if somebody is claiming, "I am God," we have to see whether he has nothing to do and whether nobody is greater than him. And these two tests will make him false immediately. He has to prove that nobody is greater than... Even contemporary... Suppose I am claiming I am God. So I have to show that at the present moment, throughout the whole world, apart from universe, nobody is greater than me. Then I am... Will these pretenders be able to show that nobody is greater than him? This is a simple test. And na tasya karyam karanam ca vidyate: "And he has nothing to do." There are so many things to test who is God. Sad-aisvarya-purnah. Nobody shall be richer than him; nobody shall be stronger than him; nobody shall be wiser than him; nobody shall be beautiful than him. So these things have to be tested, whether he is God. And simply if I claim, "Oh, I am God," there will... No testament? If I say, "I am President Nixon," will you accept it? If you don't accept it, even an ordinary President Nixon, without testing his credentials, how you will accept a false man as God without testing? You must know what is that test. Credential. He must present credential. Just like when some ambassador comes to a foreign country, there is a ceremony that that ambassador must be recognized by the governor or the governor-general in that state, and he has to place his credentials, similarly, anybody is claiming as God, he has to place his credentials. And what is that credential? The test is there in the Upanisad, in the Bhagavad-gita and so many, all literatures, Brahma-samhita, Vedanta-sutra, in Srimad-Bhagavatam. In Srimad-Bhagavatam first it is said, janmady asya yatah, anvayad itaratas carthesv abhijnah svarat [SB 1.1.1]. Svarat, svarat means fully independent. Satyam param dhimahi. The Supreme Truth, fully independent. We are not fully independent. And just now, if I feel a little toothache, I will have to go to a doctor. So how can I claim that I am God? God's first qualification is fully independent, svarat. Abhijnah. Abhijnah means fully cognizant of everything. What is that?
Purusottama: Lugdoos.
Prabhupada: Oh, yes. All right. Take. Distribute little. Na tasya karyam karanam ca vidyate. Just like Krsna. He is the Lord, but He has nothing to do. He is simply enjoying with His friends, with Radharani, with cowherds boy, with gopis. That is greatness. He has nothing to think, "How to provide?" (chuckles) That is greatness. He is taking the cows as a sporting. You see? And when He was called for killing Kamsa, He left everything, renounced everything. Aisvarya samagrasya yasasah... Everything in full, so much love, so much everything, but at once, in a moment, He renounced everything, went to..., left Vrndavana, and all these devotees, they began to cry for Krsna for the rest of life. And whenever Krsna was reminded, oh, He will say, "I am very soon coming. Don't worry. I am very soon coming." (chuckles) You see?
Girl: Have took, Your Grace?
Prabhupada: Yes. I have taken. You take. You know how to make lugdoo? Himavati is good. (chuckles) She learned many things about... We have got another nice girl in Buffalo. I have given her name... What is? Sada?
Pradyumna: Sadanandini.
Prabhupada: A very nice girl. Yes. Always chanting and dancing and always jolly. (chuckling) Very nice girl. You know her? No. She has recently joined. She is good devotee, good worker, very nice. So Krsna consciousness is so nice. Anyone who comes to Krsna consciousness immediately becomes beautiful in every respect. [Break]
Hamsaduta: Purusottama.
Prabhupada: How many rose trees Jayananda has...
Prabhupada: 108. So at least 108 flowers we'll have daily. Yes. So it is very nice. Our Hawaii, tulasi grows very nice.
Hamsaduta: Hawaii. They have a new place?
Prabhupada: Yes, the place where now Govinda dasi is staying, a very nice place, just on the seaside. And the house is two stories, entire house among the fig trees. There is nice arrangement. So you have any correspondence with her?
Jadurani: A little.
Prabhupada: So what does she say?
Jadurani: She said the flowers weren't out yet, but that was months ago. We have some mail for you. One letter is from her with up-to-date news.
Prabhupada: Oh. Some devotees are coming. And in Honolulu, two boys, they are also doing. In Hawaii there are two branches now. Yes. One at Honolulu, one at Kauai. Kauai. That island's name is Oahu. Hawaii has five islands' stretch, and this is called Oahu. Oahu island, one side, Honolulu, and one side... This island means hill. And the valley of the hills are utilized for residential purposes. So all sides, Pacific Ocean. And there is ample production of sugar cane and pineapple. I was chewing sugar cane as it is. Yes. And there is so many coconut trees, palm trees, and mango. In mango season they throw away mangos. So I have asked Govinda dasi that "You make mango pulp and dry it and send it." So they are doing nice, husband and wife, Gaurasundara, yes, trying their best. I do not know whether they are working now.
Himavati: Govinda dasi is working.
Prabhupada: Working. She can work. She can earn $400 at least.
Hamsaduta: Typing?
Prabhupada: Yes. She is good typist.
Hamsaduta: We have one boy in Montreal. He says that he wants to go to Florida the first of May. His father is a real estate man. So he wants to get a job and then get a temple, and he wants someone to come there. He said me preferably.
Prabhupada: All right. This South, North Carolina, they are also doing... (laughs)
Hamsaduta: He wants to go to Palm Beach. Palm Beach is the richest place in the country.
Prabhupada: That's all right. That's all right. So chant Hare Krsna and everything will be all right. And Buffalo is also doing nice. Oh, yes. The students are educated circle. They are taking interest, both the boys and girls. And three meetings I attended. Every meeting was full, two hundred boys and girls. They were dancing, chanting, asking very intelligent questions. And Rupanuga is holding class. There will be some examination of the students. They accept papers. Yes. Some Indians are coming from long distance. One Indian gentleman, he came to see me from, what is that place? Ninety-two miles away from Buffalo.
Himavati: Did you see Nauvani?
Prabhupada: Nauvani is there. Yes. He is there still. He is also very good. He works very nice in the temple.
Hamsaduta: Every day.
Prabhupada: He's a very good man. Everyone who will come to this Krsna consciousness will become good man, even he's a bad man. That is the influence of Krsna consciousness. Sarvair gunaih tatra samasate surah. All godly qualities will develop in Krsna consciousness. That is the test. Now, our students, nobody can compare with their behavior, with their character, with their innocence. Everything nicer. So don't worry. Simply go on chanting. Everything will be all right. Don't worry.
Jadurani: Doesn't sound like you're concerned about temple affairs.
Prabhupada: No. It... That's all right. For the time being you don't touch. You chant and everything will be... Soon you will be in good health. Then you will again work. Yes. Saradiya, you are painting? No. All right, you finish your school. You are going to school?
Saradiya: Yes.
Prabhupada: That's nice. You are painting? That's nice. You? That's nice. Practice painting nicely. We'll require so many pictures. We shall publish so many pictures, book. You are not painting. You have no time to paint. You have got enough engagement. So you can... So long you are here, you just show how to Deity worship, how you are doing that, and they will learn. Yes. She is doing that very nice. So you can, all of you, all girls, you take, her. See doing, how she is doing. Who is doing your temple worship?
Hamsaduta: Are you going to give some more instruction?
Prabhupada: No. This is... In this age temple worship is not recommended.
Hamsaduta: It's not recommended. But Deity worship is temple worship?
Prabhupada: It is Deity worship. Because nobody can actually, very nicely perform, this age is not suitable. You see? Temple worship, the regulation, the engagement—at least four, five men must always be engaged, always, twenty-four hours.
Hamsaduta: In the temple worship. In the temple.
Prabhupada: Yes. We haven't got sufficient men, neither we can arrange such a way. Besides that, your previous culture, everything is completely different. So in this age Caitanya Mahaprabhu has..., this sankirtana, Hare Krsna, harer nama harer nama harer nama [Cc. Adi 17.21]. This is all round. But at the same time, if you can perform as far as possible, that's nice, Deity worship. In this age Deity worship is secondary. Sankirtana is primary.
Hamsaduta: Does it matter who performs the Deity worship? Does it matter? I mean is it some particular person?
Prabhupada: Oh, yes. That is called arcana-siddhi.
Hamsaduta: Who should do it? I mean, in the temple who should do it?
Prabhupada: No, everyone should do it. Yes, everyone should learn. Everyone should learn. Sometimes somebody is doing something, somebody is doing something. Yes, like that. Everyone should be expert in every respect, twenty-six qualifications. (car noise outside) You have got car here? No. Nobody has got car amongst our disciples?
Jadurani: No.
Himavati: Do you need a car, Swamiji?
Prabhupada: No, because the temple is here, just in front. So what is the use of car?
Satsvarupa: Prabhupada, I found a place very likely for a new temple. And I've gone so far as... The lawyer even drew up a lease. So maybe tomorrow you could look at it.
Prabhupada: Oh, yes. What is the description?
Satsvarupa: Very excellent location, right downtown. The things wrong with it is that the temple area is no bigger than the temple area we have now, but the location is just the greatest. Second floor. Still, right downtown.
Prabhupada: Second floor. So what is the rent?
Satsvarupa: Three hundred a month. But we can do it as long as... Presently, Patita-pavana is working and so am I, and sometimes the gopis get some money. So we wouldn't have any problem as long as Patita-pavana would continue to work.
Prabhupada: All right, Krsna will solve the problems. But the space is not lesser than this temple?
Satsvarupa: Well, the temple room is maybe even smaller than the present temple room, but then there's another large, very large room for a kitchen and then another space where bunks could be for sleeping. So there's actually three different spaces. The thing is that the main temple hall is not too large.
Prabhupada: That's all right. That doesn't matter. You have to take sankirtana party. That should be the main business. And the..., at least sixteen men, four mrdangas. Practice mrdanga like that. And twelve cymbals, and one chanting and all others responding. Oh, it will be tremendous. Take some flags, "ISKCON, Hare Krsna" flag, red flag. You see? And conchshell, mrdanga. In New York they are doing now, and they also one day collected 240 dollars or something like that. What is that?
Prabhupada: 247. You see? (chuckles)
Hamsaduta: I'll try in Montreal. We have new devotees now, lot of new boys.
Prabhupada: Yes. Oh, you will get devotees. You just begin sankirtana party. You will get many devotees. You see? In Los Angeles, daily the devotees, new devotees, are coming, and very nice boys. We are now searching after a bigger place. Yes. That temple is not sufficient, although that is the biggest center of all our centers. It has got compound. It has got parking place. It has got two big halls, one big room, one big kitchen, and three, four, five small rooms. It is a nice situation, you see, just suitable for our purpose. And they decorate Jagannatha very nicely. Yes. So increase centers. And what is the name of the boy who went to... Nanda-rupa(?). He wants to open Toronto?
Hamsaduta: In Toronto. Toronto is a very good place to go.
Prabhupada: So let him open.
Hamsaduta: Let him go?
Prabhupada: Yes.
Hamsaduta: Okay. But not alone. He needs someone else, I think. He needs one more boy. I don't think by himself he can do it.
Prabhupada: That we shall arrange, somebody to go. Yes.
Hamsaduta: Maybe you remember Mr. Sini(?) in Montreal?
Prabhupada: Yes, yes.
Hamsaduta: Well, he approached me just recently. He wants to open a store, Indian store and goods, and he wants the boys in the temple to work there. He wants to make some arrangement so the temple will get some money.
Prabhupada: He is very cunning man.
Hamsaduta: Yes, I know. I don't trust him at all.
Prabhupada: He wants to utilize our men.
Hamsaduta: Yes. Don't deal with him, right? That's what I thought.
Prabhupada: He wants a cheap, cheap price. [Break] I don't believe all these things they have... They have come here to beg, to make money. You see? Their mentality cannot be good.
Hamsaduta: I have a letter for you from Gopala Krsna.
Prabhupada: Oh. Gopala Krsna is a good boy.
Hamsaduta: Oh, he's very nice. Oh, he's getting so nice. He wants to come.
Prabhupada: Yes. Yes. Because he is serving.
Himavati: He lives in our house now.
Hamsaduta: He lives with us now. You know we have another house, the whole house, and almost everyone now is a devotee there. And they're eating prasadam.
Prabhupada: Gopala Krsna is very nice boy. You give him good protection, and he will turn very good help. Sevonmukhe... This Krsna consciousness can be, I mean to say, appreciated only by service. There is no other, no other way. Sevonmukhe hi jihvadau [Brs. 1.2.234]. You cannot catch Krsna by any way, by your riches, by your beauty, by your..., because He excels everything. How you can make Him under your control? You can simply make Him under your control by service, like the gopis did. Yes. What is this? Prasada? Oh, I think I cannot take any. All right, I shall take some.
Satsvarupa: The devotees have prasadam over at the temple that's ready.
Prabhupada: Oh, they can take. They can go. [Break]... initiated, they are chanting mantras three times, om bhur bhuvah savitur varenyam? Yes. (devotees chanting japa)
[break] ...very beautiful towns(?) in India.
Hamsaduta: What are they called?
Prabhupada: It costs not much with single... (Someone turns on tape of chanting) Oh, the... Middle. Middle. What is this? Tune? Tune? No, what is called?
Satsvarupa: Speed.
Prabhupada: Speed. Yes. That's all right. Oh, so many things. This is the rest of...
Hamsaduta: Conchshell.
Prabhupada: Is it broken?
Hamsaduta: A little bit. What is this for, Swamiji?
Prabhupada: This pancapatra.
Hamsaduta: What do you put in there? Ghee?
Prabhupada: No. Water. Acamana. And what is this?
Himavati: Look inside.
Prabhupada: Jagannatha?
Himavati: Yes. (end)

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