Audio

Tamala Krsna: One thing I feel, that while there hasn't been any great improvement, on the other hand, I do not find that there has been any negative reaction or any regression since the time the kaviraja's treatment began. Of course, Your Divine Grace says that you feel weaker now than you did a week ago. If that's a fact, then...

Prabhupada: Not so very weak.

Tamala Krsna: I do find that you have more difficulty sitting up now. I notice that when you sit up you always slump over to one side, either as if you have no sufficient strength or as if you lost your balance. I can't tell which it is. You're always leaning. You're not able to sit up straight. Of course, that was there also even a week ago, but it seems a little more noticeable now. Do you think you are weaker now than you were a week ago?

Prabhupada: Hmm.

Tamala Krsna: You do? That's not good. That's not a good sign. I mean I wouldn't expect that you should be that much stronger, but I don't see why you should be weaker now. Do you think it may be psychologically that you're weaker? I mean, how would you know if you were weaker now?

Prabhupada: Because I cannot sit down.

Tamala Krsna: You can't sit up. You mean after being sat up you can't stay sitting up? You were never able to sit yourself up. That you were not doing since many months ago. When you say you're not able to sit down, you mean you cannot keep sitting in a sitting position? 'Cause that you were able to do. I've seen you in the last day or two, sitting up. I think it might be-I don't know-but it may be more psychological, from laying in bed all the time. Naturally there is a feeling perhaps that one is... Weakness also means one's willpower becomes more weaker. Is that possible that that may be it?

Prabhupada: What it is, Krsna knows.

Tamala Krsna: Anyway, the signs which the kaviraja told us to look for, which would show that things are going well, are definitely present. The fact is that you have been passing more urine every day, nearly double the amount that you previously were passing. And also you're taking more... You're not exerting yourself as much. Up until about a week ago you were speaking a lot, translating or otherwise, and this parikrama you were doing was also exerting. So in that respect you're not exerting yourself as much. In other words, all of these things which the kaviraja has asked us to do, we're doing and you're doing. So we should now wait and see. In the meantime, we're here chanting. If you like, we can read. And we're perfectly satisfied to be with you. So I don't see that there's any difficulty in waiting to see the results of the treatment, see if it has actually helped.

Bhakti-caru: [Transl. Srila Prabhupada? Will I give you some medicine now?]

Prabhupada: [Transl. I am only taking medicines.]

Bhakti-caru: Prabhupada is saying that "I am just taking medicines." I asked him if he would like to take some medicine. Srila Prabhupada? [Transl. Throughout the day I am giving you medicines four times, five times.]

Prabhupada: [Transl. I am taking.]

Bhakti-caru: [Transl. After giving you medicine I will give some grapes juice.]

Prabhupada: [Transl. Give….. [indistinct]]

Tamala Krsna: Prabhupada's supposed to take medicine now? He doesn't want to take? You don't want to take your medicine now, Srila Prabhupada?

Prabhupada: My taking the medicine means I am passing urine.

Tamala Krsna: Mmm-huh. Is that all right?

Prabhupada: That I do not know.

Tamala Krsna: Well, according to every physician that we've consulted, Ayurvedic and allopathic, they say that that's very much required. Is it painful to pass urine?

Prabhupada: Sometimes.

Tamala Krsna: I think you should take the medicine as he prescribed. They're not dangerous medicines in any way. Otherwise we won't be able to see the effect of the kaviraja's cure.

[Pause]

Prabhupada: [Transl. When I turn on my side I feel little dizzy.]

Bhakti-caru: [Transl. Feel dizzy? It is due to weakness Srila Prabhupada. What about when you sit up?]

Prabhupada: [Transl. In the beginning I feel dizzy.]

Svarupa Damodara: What is he saying?

Bhakti-caru: Srila Prabhupada said that when he turns on his side he feels dizzy, and when he sits up also, towards the beginning, he feels very dizzy. I think that's due to weakness.

Tamala Krsna: Well, according to this kaviraja, he said that after fifteen days of this treatment, there should be noticeable sign, increased strength. Didn't he say that? So, it's been about one week now, hasn't it? Or maybe not so long. Five days. So for another week or ten days, Srila Prabhupada, we should carry on, and let us see.

We're certainly not going to... I think that this is the last kaviraja that we should take the help of. If his medicine works, that's very welcome. And if it doesn't, then I don't think we can try any more kavirajas or any doctors. We've tried enough. But at least for the next week to ten days now we should carry through.

At least we've seen that with other kavirajas there were so many negative effects. Remember? Now, with this kaviraja, nothing has ever happened badly with the medicine he's prescribed. Rather, exactly as he predicted, there would be more urine, more urine is coming. I think the swelling is reducing.

Bhakti-caru: Yes. It has. It's a lot... Another thing is that milk...

Tamala Krsna: Milk, you were never able to take. Now you're able to take without producing... I mean there definitely are, Srila Prabhupada.

Prabhupada: Last night you gave me milk?

Bhakti-caru: Um-hm. You started coughing, Srila Prabhupada.

Tamala Krsna: What was that?

Bhakti-caru: Last night.

Tamala Krsna: What time?

Bhakti-caru: About 8:30.

Tamala Krsna: Prabhupada was vomiting?

Bhakti-caru: Not really. Like...

Tamala Krsna: See, Srila Prabhupada, I explained to Bhakti-caru Maharaja that when you take something to drink, milk, that when you sit up, at first you should not eat immediately. First of all, you should sit up...

[break] I don't think it was due to the milk and barley that you were coughing.

Bhakti-caru: There are few things. First of all that, as you say, sitting up and taking it immediately after sitting up, and when he was feeling dizzy, then drinking the milk.

Tamala Krsna: Yes, that's what it is.

Bhakti-caru: And another thing is that no taste. And Srila Prabhupada wasn't sitting properly. He was very uncomfortable, the way he was sitting.

Tamala Krsna: That's what I'm trying to say. Before you try to drink anything, Srila Prabhupada, first of all you make yourself properly comfortable in sitting. If you're dizzy and you try and drink... Anyone who is dizzy and tries to drink, they're going to start to cough and vomit. Anyway, we were explaining...

Bhakti-caru: Another thing might have been that last night in the milk the barley was little thick, little too much of it, so that density was little thick. So from today onwards I'm going to use much less barley, so that it's thin and easy to swallow. [indistinct comments by Jayadvaita]

Tamala Krsna: I don't think that... I mean, the one thing we're hoping for is the strength. I was looking at that swelling, Srila Prabhupada. Very much reduced. Very reduced.

Bhakti-caru: And another thing, Shastriji was explaining that in Ayurvedic medicine the reaction doesn't take place immediately. He was explaining in allopath, when someone is very weak, they give him glucose, intravenous glucose, and that gives immediate energy. But he says that that doesn't work. When the glucose is exhausted, then again he becomes even more weak. But with the kaviraja's method, the strength will come slowly, slowly, but whatever strength is acquired in the body, that stays there. It's permanent. It's not just temporary.

Tamala Krsna: The swelling is reduced. Isn't it, Srila Prabhupada? I mean, all of the signs, Srila Prabhupada, which the kaviraja wanted, are there.

Bhakti-caru: As a matter of fact, he hasn't given any medicine to strengthen him up.

Tamala Krsna: Srila Prabhupada? Did you hear what Bhakti-caru just said?

Prabhupada: Hmm?

Bhakti-caru: Right now, Srila Prabhupada, Shastriji didn't give you any medicine to strengthen you up as such. His medicines are simply to cure your kidney and liver. When they are cured, then he's going to give medicines like makara-dhvaja which will make you strong.

Tamala Krsna: One thing, Srila Prabhupada, this is one of the reasons I wanted the kaviraja to be with you was to be able to answer your doubts, because I felt that he could far better than we can. But factually speaking, it seems to me there's every... I mean if he were here now he would feel your pulse, and he would be able to understand that your pulse is not weak. Your heart is good, you're starting to pass more urine, you're getting sufficient rest, you're able to take things like milk, which you couldn't take before, and these are positive signs. And the one thing that which we're looking for, strength, he already said will not come immediately, and he's not even giving any medicine for increasing strength yet. The thing is, we're a little impatient because we've waited so many months and had so many failures with so many different doctors, but really, this doctor, so far, has the best record, his medicines. So we think that you should be encouraged. We feel hopeful. Even if you feel hopeless, we are hopeful.

Prabhupada: [Transl. Today how much.

Bhakti-caru: [Transl. 40 grams, Srila Prabhupada. Not so much. Only Little bit.] That's 40 grams, stool.

Tamala Krsna: Srila Prabhupada? I think you should take the medicine now. Can Bhakti-caru bring it to you?

Prabhupada: The same medicine?

Bhakti-caru: Yes, Srila Prabhupada. This same medicine will continue till kaviraji comes back and gives new medicine. They all are the same medicine, Srila Prabhupada. There are two different types of medicines. One, I'm supposed to give once in the morning, once in the evening. And another one is in the noontime and late in the evening. And there's one medicine, that's sometime in the afternoon. One o'clock, twelve or one o'clock.

Tamala Krsna: It's not very painful to take the medicine, is it?

Bhakti-caru: Does it taste bad, Srila Prabhupada, the medicine? Does it taste very bad?

Prabhupada: Yes.

Bhakti-caru: But then it is very bitter or... Because medicine will be a little bad-tasting. Very much bitter, no, Srila Prabhupada?

Prabhupada: Bitter.

Bhakti-caru: Yes. So should I mix it with some sweet, no, not honey? Like... I normally give the powder with glucose, so that the glucose will give you some sweet taste with it. But distilled medicine, the water thin, watery medicine, that is tasteless. It tastes like water.

Tamala Krsna: Let us follow this medicine until its prescribed time, Srila Prabhupada.

Prabhupada: Give me. [swallows medicine]

Tamala Krsna: This kaviraja feels quite confident, Srila Prabhupada. I mean he is not a fool. He says there's reason to feel quite hopeful. Naturally you are feeling a little hopeless because you've been laying down for so long in bed. Would you like to hear a little bit of one of the books? We'll read some more of the Teachings of Lord Kapila that we were reading yesterday to you? In this way we can pass the time very nicely.

Prabhupada: Who is...?

Tamala Krsna: We're moving the light over to this side for reading.

Svarupa Damodara: This book is wonderful, Prabhupada, Kapila, Teachings of Lord Kapila. It is a beautiful cover.

Jayadvaita: [reads from Teachings of Lord Kapila] "Kapiladeva is referred to as Bhagavan, the Supreme Personality of Godhead. Bhagavan makes no mistakes. Narayanah paro 'vyaktat: even Saṅkaracarya says that 'Bhagavan, Narayana, does not belong to this material world.' When we speak of Bhagavan, or when the sastras refer to Bhagavan, we refer to Him who is above material understanding.

As stated here, sri-bhagavan uvaca. It does not say vyasadeva uvaca or kapiladeva uvaca. Similarly, in Bhagavad-gita, Vyasadeva says, sri-bhagavan uvaca. Bhagavan refers to Him who is above the defects of this material world. Bhagavan is not subject to the four deficiencies of the living entities." [TLK Verse 13, purport]

Bhakti-caru: [Transl. Will I give you some more water?]

Prabhupada: [Transl. Hmm. Now this side.]

Svarupa Damodara: [Transl. Turn this side.]

[end]