770405R1.BOM

Indian doctor: I would like to have the history of the present complaint which is going on. It will be apparent that so much of the same thing is going on.

Prabhupada: I have no appetite. I cannot digest. This is going on.

Indian doctor: Main trouble is... [break]

Prabhupada: [doctor has left] ...You have seen the birds, the sparrow, the crows. They are different birds. They have got different movements.

Tamala Krsna: Oh.

Prabhupada: From the pulse beating, you study how it is beating.

Tamala Krsna: Like sparrow, like crow.

Prabhupada: Accha. Then, according to that, there is verse. Immediately everything will be arranged, the history. That is Ayurvedic. He will not ask, "Give me the history." He'll study the history from the pulse. That is Ayurvedic. So that is gone. Actually Ayur-veda is now lost. Nobody seriously takes Ayur-veda.

Tamala Krsna: There is not much big money in it, I think.

Prabhupada: No, thing is there is allopathic is so popular now, nobody goes to Ayur-veda.

Tamala Krsna: Yeah, there is no... You can't make a living very much.

Prabhupada: They can give immediate effect. Although that is not very good, still, by injection and by some strong medicine they can give immediate effect. People like that. And Ayur-veda is long term, and people cannot wait.

Tamala Krsna: Yeah. The cure is very slow.

Prabhupada: And that is also not very sure, because the Ayurvedic physicians, they have not taken many cases. They cannot experience. Everything requires experience. These are the difficulties in Ayur-veda. Still, some of the patent medicines, they are effective. Just like cyavana-prasa, nava-yogendra, yogendra-rasa. If they are properly prepared.

Tamala Krsna: [aside:] Some water spilled next to Prabhupada's desk. I was looking for a cloth.

Bhavananda: Over there.

Tamala Krsna: Yeah. Bhavananda Maharaja could get you some dab water if you like. Prabhupada was liking some dab water. Yeah, one... [break]

Prabhupada: ...community. If the one community said, "Within our religion, there is no need of education..."

Tamala Krsna: Of education?

Prabhupada: Hmm. So will the state allow that?

Tamala Krsna: Well, they shouldn't, because then it is not religion. Genuine...

Prabhupada: No, no, it is religion or no religion. Suppose there is university, and if some religious sect says that "In our religion we shall not take university education."

Tamala Krsna: We shall not take any education from the university?

Prabhupada: Yes. So will the government accept it?

Tamala Krsna: In United States there is a group in Pennsylvania, and they say that they will not undergo any kind of normal education, because it is polluted, and they have their own education. And they are permitted. Even from six, seven years old, from first grade. They are called the Amish people.

Prabhupada: Hmm?

Tamala Krsna: They are called the Amish, Amish people.

[some noise in background]

Prabhupada: That is...

Tamala Krsna: That's not a door, Srila Prabhupada. That's heavy dropping of heavy items.

Prabhupada: Another point: in secular, the scientific knowledge, two plus two equal to four. If somebody says, "No, in our opinion it is five," will it be accepted?

Tamala Krsna: I didn't hear what you were saying.

Prabhupada: If two plus two equal to four, now if somebody says, "In our opinion it should be five..."

Tamala Krsna: No. No one will accept that.

Prabhupada: Similarly, if Bhagavad-gita is teaching the science that this body is not yourself, you are different from the body, if some other sect, they say that "It is stated in the Bhagavad-gita; it is meant for the Hindus, not for us," will it be accepted?

Tamala Krsna: It should not be.

Prabhupada: Therefore the institution for teaching Bhagavad-gita must be there. The science of life...

Tamala Krsna: It should be there in every university.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Tamala Krsna: It's scientific. It is the only scientific book.

Prabhupada: Yes. Dehino 'smin yatha dehe kaumaram yauvanam jara [Bg 2.13]. Kaumaram, childhood; yauvanam, youth-hood; and jara, old age; does it mean only for the Hindus?

Tamala Krsna: No.

Prabhupada: Then how this science should be stopped for others? It is universal.

Tamala Krsna: Just as that Christian asked you, "Is Lord Jesus's teachings universal?" The Christians, they say that Jesus's teachings are universal. So that means that they must be true.

Prabhupada: And I answered yes, why not?

Tamala Krsna: Jesus said "Thou shalt not kill." This applies to all human beings. So if they say that about Jesus's teachings, why not about dehino 'smin yatha dehe [Bg 2.13]? They should say.

Prabhupada: [japa] The whole human society is being put into ignorance. How we can tolerate? We know the things. How we can hide it? Jnana-khala. One who knows the thing, how he can hide it? He is called jnana-khala. He has got the knowledge but he will not give it to anyone else.

Tamala Krsna: That's miserly.

Prabhupada: That is very dangerous. Jnana-khala. Khala means envious, "I know it..."

Tamala Krsna: A Vaisnava is param-duhkha-duhkhi.

Prabhupada: How we can stop spreading Krsna consciousness? It is not possible.

Tamala Krsna: You told me that unless one is compassionate...

Prabhupada: He cannot become Vaisnava.

Tamala Krsna: ...he cannot preach.

Prabhupada: Para-duhkha-duhkhi, krpambudhi. My Guru Maharaja used to say prana ache yaṅra se' hetu pracara. [Vaisnava Ke, Srila Bhakti Siddhanta Sarasvati Thakura Prabhupada]

One who is living being, he can preach. Dead body cannot preach. One is actually a living being, he can preach. And Caitanya Mahaprabhu said bharata-bhumite haila manusya-janma yara . One who is a man, he will be interested in this. Cats and dogs, it is not possible. bharata-bhumite haila kukura-janma yara, e-katha baleni. He didn't say "One who has taken birth as a dog in India." manusya. To give knowledge of Bhagavad-gita, this is India's prerogative. And India can distribute this knowledge. And the government has to consent. And they are misinterpreting this. I wanted to point out to Morarji. What is this? [indistinct].

Tamala Krsna: It will be a very interesting meeting, to see if he is actually willing to take some action. He'll hear, and he may agree, but whether he will act, that we will see.

Prabhupada: He may not act. That will be like...

Tamala Krsna: One thing I am already doing is I am starting to compile a list of those who we want permanent residence for. I told Bhavananda this morning already that he should tell me the names of those people in Bengal who he feels are qualified to remain permanently. So that way if suddenly we get some opportunity, I'll have the list all ready to submit. That's... To me, of course, I am a little bit..., tend towards pessimism, but I think that is something we could actually hope for from this government. It won't be difficult...

Prabhupada: Let me work with these foreigners, because you have taught Indian independence, and they are not coming. Therefore these foreign boys, they are helping me. So let them remain. What harm they are doing? Let them have permanent residence helping me. Their life, money, everything-why don't you allow them? Unnecessarily they have to go away and come again.

Tamala Krsna: We are throwing away five lakhs of rupees that could be well utilized every year.

Prabhupada: We are not... We have no interest in politics. What interest do we have in this phantasmagoria? They are not so fools. And there are so many people, they are taking part in politics. Is this not sufficient?

Tamala Krsna: That's the argument I always use when we are preaching, to get someone to join. They say, "Well, we want to be a doctor or we want to be..." I say there are already so many millions of doctors, so many, but there is only...

Prabhupada: And doctor is canvassing, "You become my patient."

Tamala Krsna: Yesterday that man was canvassing you.

Prabhupada: That eh.

Tamala Krsna: That Ayur-veda man.

Prabhupada: Yes. As soon as he wanted history, I rejected him. He is not Ayurvedic. And Kartikeya was sorry that I did not give him for one and a half hour.

Tamala Krsna: Oh, Kartikeya, the whole time he was very agitated.

Prabhupada: So everyone who will come I will have to give one and a half hour?

Tamala Krsna: He wanted you to stop talking to the reporter and begin talking to the doctor. What good the doctor will do? But the reporter can do so much good.

Prabhupada: Hmm.

Nava-yogendra: [Transl. Should I keep here?]

Prabhupada: [Transl. That puffed rice you heat it up…]

[break] When I say do this, he can do that.

Tamala Krsna: He listens.

Prabhupada: So one must be good cooking expert.

Tamala Krsna: Yes. No, he's a nice choice.

Prabhupada: And if Upendra can do like Bhavananda, then it is very nice. Let him be trained up. He can do.

Tamala Krsna: How long do you think...?

Prabhupada: [referring to cleaning of floor] Now it is black.

Tamala Krsna: It is starting to shine.

Prabhupada: The more we do...

Tamala Krsna: It is like shining one's heart.

Prabhupada: This is..., this is marble.

Tamala Krsna: Yeah. Bhavananda Maharaja and I were just discussing this morning, the... We were looking at the shining, and we were discussing the difference between this marble and kota stone. Kota stone is very much inferior.

Prabhupada: Hmm?

Tamala Krsna: Kota, kota stone. You can never get it even smooth. It will always be uneven, because the stone is layers. So when they are polishing, some layers are higher than others. And marble is generally very first class.

Prabhupada: Dust stone is third class.

Tamala Krsna: How long Bhavananda should...? Now Upendra is here, I am wondering...

Prabhupada: If he is intelligent, he can learn it in one day.

Tamala Krsna: Otherwise, a few days. Bhavananda was thinking at least four days he will remain. He has gotten a little bit attached to taking care of you.

Prabhupada: So wipe this floor twice like this. Let him see. As he does very nicely, very nicely.

Tamala Krsna: I think the best anyone has ever...

Prabhupada: There is no doubt.

[pause] How we can stop educating people about Bhagavad-gita? It is most heinous mentality, such a knowledge should be hidden from the human society. And some rascal will misinterpret.

Tamala Krsna: Yeah, your point yesterday was very nice, that some things which are difficult, they may need explanation, but when Krsna says, "Give it to Me," what is the question of a need of interpretation? That Radhakrishnan, immediately he gives his explanation: "It doesn't mean to Krsna the person."

Prabhupada: "...to Krsna the person." Just see. How rascal he is, and he is commenting. No, no, this is the rule, grammatical rule, that when things are clear, there is no interpretation.

Tamala Krsna: It's an actual rule.

Prabhupada: Just like Sarvabhauma Bhattacarya and Caitanya Mahaprabhu was talking. Caitanya Mahaprabhu said, "When the meaning is clear, why you are giving us this, nonsense?"

Tamala Krsna: Sarvabhauma asked Him, "You have sat here hearing Vedanta for seven, eight days, but You have not said anything. Are You not understanding?" Caitanya Mahaprabhu said, "I understand the Vedanta, but I cannot understand..."

Prabhupada: Your interpretation.

Tamala Krsna: "...your interpretation."

Nava yogendra: [Transl. Take this. I have heated it up.]

Prabhupada: [Transl. What are these?]

Nava yogendra: [Transl. This is panir or curd which was kept for you and this is cucumber. Do you want this spinach also?]

Prabhupada: [Transl. Han?]

Nava yogendra: [Transl. Spinach, which was saved from the morning for curd. You said you will eat it with sugar candy?]

Prabhupada: [Transl. Yes.]

Nava yogendra: [Transl. Do you want spinach then? No?]

Prabhupada: [Transl. Why they have turned into granules?]

Nava yogendra: [Transl. No, not granules. I have just prepared them fresh.]

Indian man: [Transl. Why do you take out the water?]

Tamala Krsna: If you give me the key to the almirah, then I can affix the tags.

Prabhupada: Take.

Tamala Krsna: I'll keep these here for now. First I'll do those. [end]