Room Conversation with Sumati Morarjee – July 11 1972, London

720711R1-LONDON [46:53 Minutes]

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. How are you? You came today?]

Prabhupada: [Transl. Today…]

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. I knew it. I came here day before yesterday. They told me that you are arriving today. I have been in London only.]

Prabhupada: [Transl. Very happy to see you. [laughs] The whole Juhu is yours.]

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. I called Giriraja one day there. How have you become so thin?]

Prabhupada: [Transl. I have to travel a lot. Besides, I can't eat anything.]

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. Why?]

Prabhupada: [Transl. My liver has become old. I can't digest anything.]

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. What do you eat then?]

Prabhupada: [Transl. Mostly I eat fruits.]

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. You don't eat anything else?]

Prabhupada: [Transl. If I eat other foods I can't digest.]

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. That's true.]

Prabhupada: [Transl. Can't digest.]

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. What about milk?]

Prabhupada: [Transl. Milk I drink, but that too is not digested properly.]

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. Oh! If You drink more now it will produce gas.]

Prabhupada: [Transl. Produce gas. Just little bit of fruits all I take.]

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. Why don't you mix little bit of that in the milk?]

Prabhupada: [Transl. What's that?]

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. One piece of ginger. When you boil the milk, you cut the ginger into small pieces and throw in.]

Prabhupada: [Transl. Will dry ginger powder do?]

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. Yes. If raw is not available then dry. So mix little bit of that and add sugar in it.]

Prabhupada: [Transl. That's all?]

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. After adding little sugar you boil it. Then you mix either little turmeric powder or Kesar and take off the fire and cover it. Then you stir it well and drink warm.]

Prabhupada: [Transl. Like 250 grams or so?]

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. About one glass of milk, a pinch of dry ginger powder and a pinch of Kesar in it. You boil it and add sugar. That's all.]

[to Syamasundara:] You understand what is kesar? Kesar is saffron. Saffron.

Sumati Morarjee: You know saffron? When you prepare milk for Swamiji, you got dry ginger powder, put a little, and little saffron.

Syamasundara: Saffron.

Sumati Morarjee: And sugar. And heat it, and keep it some time, and then properly mix it, and then... Not very cold or anything. Little hot you give it to him, and that will improve his digestion. Because this sort of gas trouble won't be there, due to age, with this.

Prabhupada: Our example, gosai, gosvami, all the gosvamis... Let me speak in English so that these people….

Sumati Morarjee: Yes, yes.

Prabhupada: The gosvamis in Vrndavana, they're nidrahara-viharakadi-vijitau.

Sumati Morarjee: Hmm.

Prabhupada: Nidra ahara vihara. Nidrahara-viharakadi-vijitau catyanta-dinau ca radha-krsna-padaravinda-bhajananandena mattalikau. Ahara nidra [Transl. Ahara nidra: eating and sleeping they gave up. Vijita: conquered. They conquered. Very difficult to give up.] Ahara nidra..., viharakadi-vijitau catyanta-dinau ca yau. The Raghunatha dasa Gosvami, he was, at that time, five hundred years ago, his father's income was twelve lakhs of rupees.

Sumati Morarjee: I know. [Transl. I have read about Jiva Gosvami, Raghunatha dasa Gosvami, or Rūpa, Sanatana.]

Prabhupada: Rūpa-Sanatana was minister, minister.

Sumati Morarjee: Ah, I know. And that you know, those other two also, what is their name? They were also very high up.

Prabhupada: Ramananda Raya?

Sumati Morarjee: Ah, Ramananda Raya.

Prabhupada: He was governor.

Sumati Morarjee: And Acarya?

Prabhupada: Yes, Bhatta..., Sarvabhauma Bhattacarya.

Sumati Morarjee: Hmm.

Prabhupada: You have read in my books, Teachings of Lord Caitanya?

Sumati Morarjee: Yes, yes, the whole Caitanya-caritamrta, Caitanya's life, and all that, it is written by Prabhu Datta brahmacari.

Prabhupada: Ah.

Sumati Morarjee: I have read that.

Prabhupada: Ah, Hindi.

Sumati Morarjee: Hindi.

Revatinandana: We stayed in his asrama in Allahabad....

Prabhupada: Ah, so...

Devotee: ...Prabhu Datta brahmacari's asrama.

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. You make a translation of that.]

Prabhupada: [Transl. Which one.]

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. Caitanya-caritamrta.]

Prabhupada: [Transl. I have done it. Teachings of Lord Caitanya.]

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. In English? I have not seen.]

Prabhupada: You show him.

Syamasundara: TLC.

Prabhupada: Our latest books can ... you show. All the books. You have got this book?

[Syamasundara explains about books to gentleman in background]

Sumati Morarjee: No. [Transl. Prabhuji, you have done a lot of service.]

Prabhupada: [Transl. It is all by the blessings of father and mother like you. Kindly keep blessing me.]

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. Please do not leave. Finish the work in your hand.]

Prabhupada: [Transl. You all bless me.]

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. Because, what you have accomplished no one else could do like that so soon. The Deities here at the ground floor are very beautiful. I came here the other day.]

Prabhupada: [Transl. Our Bombay Deities are also very beautiful.]

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. Very beautiful.]

Prabhupada: [Transl. Very beautiful. So all of you together build a mandir.]

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. Oh that will be built. But you don't leave us and go away. You are a true devotee. And we are materialistic persons. We are entangled in the worldly affairs whereas you are a devotee. The devotees are always a class apart.]

Prabhupada: [Transl. But you serve the devotees!] [laughter]

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. That is different, Svamiji. The thing is what you can do I cannot do.]

Prabhupada: [Transl. But it is you who first helped me to go abroad and hence all this happened.]

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. That's true. That day I told you…I remember I was telling you…]

Prabhupada: [laughs] [Transl. That day I approached you and said, please allow me to go. And you very gladly let me go.]

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. Actually I became very much worried after you left. I thought I wish I had a good brahmana captain for the ship. What if you start vomiting!]

Prabhupada: [laughs] [Transl. Yes, that Pandey and his wife, that girl, they were very nice.]

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. Very nice girl. They came to see me recently. They are from Benaras.]

Prabhupada: [Transl. Her name is Gita.]

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. Gita. Yes.]

Prabhupada: She is very nice girl.

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. She came to me now.]

Prabhupada: And she is a good astrologer.

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. That I don't know.]

Prabhupada: That little girl, young girl, she saw my palm, and she said, "Swamiji, if you can surpass seventy-one years, then you will live hundred years." [laughter]

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. It's wonderful then. Your movement is very nice and she said a very nice thing.]

Prabhupada: And on seventy-first year I was you know it.

Sumati Morarjee: I know. [Transl. You became very ill.]

Prabhupada: [Transl. Very ill. It was almost death. Only Bhagavan saved me.] Very strong heart attack in New York. I fell down, heart attack. [Transl. It was due to too much hardship.]

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. Worked very hard.]

Prabhupada: [Transl. So much. Day and night I worked hard. Now here you see we have no place.]

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. Not sufficient. I saw the other day and I told them…]

Prabhupada: [Transl. This location is very important.]

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. Very good.]

Prabhupada: [Transl. Important. But no accommodation.] We have no sufficient accommodation.

Sumati Morarjee: Hall is very small.

Prabhupada: [Transl. We have to build a nice Temple here also.] Therefore I am asking them. So, some gentlemen here, they say that "You try, money will be raised here. It will not difficult." So I'm asking that find out some place.

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. So where will you find?]

Prabhupada: Ah?

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. What happened to that Cathedral?]

Prabhupada: Three hundred million dollars... Ah, three hundred million pounds?

Sumati Morarjee: Pounds.

Syamasundara: What did he say?

Dhananjaya: What is this?

Prabhupada: That, er...

Dhananjaya: Kingsway Hall? Two and a half million pounds.

Sumati Morarjee: Kingsway House.

Syamasundara: Two and a half million pounds. Kingsway Hall.

Prabhupada: Still it is open.

Dhananjaya: No, no. It's gone to a businessman. We, we offered one and a half million pounds, and it went to the businessman for two and a half million pounds.

Prabhupada: Ah.

Revatinandana: They asked three million.

Prabhupada: Huh?

Revatinandana: They asked for three million pounds, and they got two and a half million for it. Two and half million pounds.

Syamasundara: It's just around the corner.

Revatinandana: It's a very nice place, but I couldn't imagine...

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. Can you get one here? Place is available?]

Prabhupada: [Transl. Yes, yes. There are so many places. Churches are also available. But where is money with us? Whatever money we collect from selling books we reprint books.]

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. That's a noble work you are doing.]

Revatinandana: So Mataji's... If some of these books she hasn't got, we can give her. She's our Life Member.

Prabhupada: Huh?

Sumati Morarjee: Yes, yes, just now I am.

Prabhupada: She is life..., she is life after life. [laughter] She is life after life member.

Sumati Morarjee: No, no, but I'll talk to this, ah, Giriraja in Bombay about becoming the patron myself.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Sumati Morarjee: I said, "Let us see."

Prabhupada: [Transl. You guide…] We..., let us form a trustee, and you become the president of the Trust. [laughter] [Transl. That is what I want.] You become the president of the trustee, and do the needful.

Sumati Morarjee: You know, just now that your...

Prabhupada: So, whether you agree to this or not?

Sumati Morarjee: Yes, yes.

Prabhupada: Yes. Immediately make her the president of the trustee, or Giriraja.

Sumati Morarjee: No, you see.

Prabhupada: Giriraja is also very nice boy.

Sumati Morarjee: No, no, every day he is there, because he says, "I want you..."

Prabhupada: You like him?

Sumati Morarjee: He's a good man.

Prabhupada: Very good.

Sumati Morarjee: "I want your advice." So first day I called him, he came. I said, "You I don't want. Where is that Syamasundara?" [laughter]

Prabhupada: His father is very rich man.

Sumati Morarjee: Is he?

Prabhupada: His father is a very big lawyer, and mother, father, both came to me Calcutta. Mother, after all mother, she was crying, that "Give me back my boy." [laughter] So I, "You can take away your boy." So anyway, they are very good gentlemen. So... But he has... He's graduate in psychology. He's learned.

Sumati Morarjee: No, no, he's a very nice man. So I asked him just now, I'm running a school. I said, "You come and, uh, give lecture," mean some stories...

Prabhupada: [aside:] Why don't you give some fruits?

Sumati Morarjee: ...to the children. No, I will take this. You give me a piece of paper, can you?

Prabhupada: Yes, why not.

Sumati Morarjee: And I'll take this for the children.

Dhananjaya: Isn't there some prasada also, that's still out there in the...

Sumati Morarjee: You give me. Everything is there.

Prabhupada: Syamasundara.

Syamasundara: Hare Krsna.

Prabhupada: Immediately write one letter to Giriraja that, uh, I'll suggest some names for becoming trustee, or you can suggest some of the Life Members you know.

Sumati Morarjee: I know so many, but... [Transl. But you suggest. When are you coming to Bombay?]

Prabhupada: [Transl. I have some work to be done here. I will go to Bombay sometime.]

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. How long will you stay here?]

Prabhupada: [Transl. You look after and let me travel and preach freely.]

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. Svamiji, how many days will you stay here?]

Prabhupada: [Transl. Just like previously you forced me. It was you who gave me the start. [laughs] so let me travel around.]

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. So how long are you planning to live here?]

Prabhupada: [Transl. Say, one about month.]

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. That's all? Then?]

Prabhupada: [Transl. Then Paris.] Maybe Nairobi. Then either Los Angeles or to India.

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. Where will you be in October?]

Prabhupada: [Transl. In October I must go to India. I have a plan to purchase a house in Los Angeles.] Because whatever that Mayapur... You have been in Nava..., Navadvipa?

Sumati Morarjee: Yes, yes, I have been to Navadvipa, Mayapur, Santipura, then that Katwa. [Transl. the place where Lord Caitanya took sannyasa.] All those places I have visited.

Prabhupada: So Mayapur we are constructing a big temple. And Vrndavana also. So, for maintenance of the temple perpetually, I want to purchase some property in Los Angeles, because here, Los Angeles, property gets nice income.

Sumati Morarjee: Is it?

Prabhupada: Yes.

Sumati Morarjee: How?

Prabhupada: Los Angeles.

Indian man: Good income?

Prabhupada: Yes, because any ordinary room is about a $125. So $125 in our Indian exchange is about thousand rupees. So, thousand rupees, two rooms, who will pay in India?

Sumati Morarjee: No. Nobody will pay.

Prabhupada: [laughter] Nobody will pay. So then therefore I thought that to purchase one, two house, so that as Vrndavana property... Because I am maintaining now the whole institution by begging. But when Vrndavana and Navadvipa Deities are there, there is no income.

Sumati Morarjee: No, there won't be any. Both places...

Prabhupada: In Bombay we can go to you: "Mataji, we have no money. Please give me some."

Sumati Morarjee: No, that is different, but these things...

Prabhupada: Yes, so, but Vrndavana and Navadvipa I want to make some provision. So I'm negotiating for that. This is one business. So Bombay... [Transl. For Bombay you are sufficient.] Huh?

Sumati Morarjee: Of course, you won't get so much rent for London properties. They're also very much appreciated.

Prabhupada: London property is very costly.

Sumati Morarjee: Oh, very costly, but they're day by day appreciating.

Prabhupada: Hmm.

Syamasundara: Doubled. In one year it's doubled.

Sumati Morarjee: No, no. Forty percent has gone up in a year's time, on one property.

Prabhupada: Because the Indians are coming.

Sumati Morarjee: Yes, they have taken away all the property.

Prabhupada: [laughs]

Sumati Morarjee: And started taking all the shops. All the cinema theaters.

Prabhupada: And London is practically now Indian.

Sumati Morarjee: I always say that I see more Indians in London than really the people who are...

Prabhupada: [Transl. So why don't you kindly take charge and build a temple here also. Public are interested.]

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. Yes, they will.]

Prabhupada: [Transl. If you just stay here for some days it will be done.]

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. Now I will have to go. But I will return on 10th October.]

Prabhupada: [Transl. On 10th?]

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. No. 10th is my meeting. So I will come three, four days before that. October 4th or 5th. So on which date are you leaving, Svamiji?] Oh, so much prasada.

Dhananjaya: Oh, we have prepared just a little for you.

Sumati Morarjee: All right. I'll take and send it back, because the children are at home.

Prabhupada: All right, all right, all right.

Sumati Morarjee: I'll take, send you back your vessels. Did he give you last time?

Prabhupada: So if you have got some paper, you can wrap it.

Syamasundara: Here's a bag.

Sumati Morarjee: So now, what..., what is your problem? Ah, this is better.

Prabhupada: [Transl. Just need your order.]

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. What is that?]

Prabhupada: This boy, he's president of..., of my Detroit.

Sumati Morarjee: So what does he want?

Prabhupada: He wants to give me some car. [Transl. Kindly arrange to dispatch it.]

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. Where is the car, in Detroit?]

Prabhupada: [Transl. Yes, Detroit. So where to send it first you tell.]

Sumati Morarjee: [Transl. Where do you want to send, India?]

Sumati Morarjee: So ask..., you write to me a letter in Bombay, Scindia address, that such-and-such car, so when is the ship due in Detroit. And then I will let you know, finding out the whole detail. Because UK office doesn't know the movement of the American ships.

Prabhupada: Ah.

Sumati Morarjee: It's only Bombay who..., which knows. So you write me in a letter to Bombay.

Prabhupada: When everything is settled up.

Sumati Morarjee: When you are settled, when is the ship due, and we want to send. [Transl. But what about…] So there won't be any trouble in port?

Prabhupada: That he'll clear up.

Sumati Morarjee: You better clear first.

Syamasundara: Yeah...

Sumati Morarjee: Otherwise what happens.

Syamasundara: Ksirodakasayi knows.

Sumati Morarjee: Government of India doesn't allow any import of car in India; otherwise you will come...

Prabhupada: His, his admission is that I am the guru of the Americans. I have no car. [laughter]

Sumati Morarjee: I know. But if, how, you have to take either through the American Embassy permission or government of India's permission is needed.

Syamasundara: Yes, but Prabhupada is an alien registered as living in the United States, so he can take his personal car.

Prabhupada: I am immigrant. I am immigrant, and I think I heard that one who has lived in America more than three years, he can take.

Sumati Morarjee: Yes, yes, you can bring car.

Prabhupada: Yes, that is, that is the law, I think.

Sumati Morarjee: So you can find out all this from India office. Yes.

Syamasundara: Yeah, Gurudasa can do that.

Sumati Morarjee: And then will give you in Indian High Commission all details.

Prabhupada: Another, another is that we get some incense imported from Hong Kong.

Sumati Morarjee: I know. So what is that incense?

Syamasundara: Punks. Punks.

Prabhupada: Punks.

Syamasundara: Just a punk.

Sumati Morarjee: Can you show me?

Prabhupada: Yes, yes.

Sumati Morarjee: Show me some.

Prabhupada: Show, show, Spiritual Sky.

Sumati Morarjee: I know, we also use that incense, but, uh, I don't know the name of it.

Prabhupada: So kindly get them carried from Hong Kong to Los Angeles.

Sumati Morarjee: So let us see.

Syamasundara: They're punks, without any scent, and then it...

Sumati Morarjee: I know it [indistinct].

Syamasundara: And when they come here, then they dip them into oil and make a scent.

Prabhupada: Anyway...

Sumati Morarjee: That's why I...

Prabhupada: You get from Hong Kong...

Sumati Morarjee: And take where?

Prabhupada: Huh? Take to Los Angeles. That is a...

Sumati Morarjee: No, but one thing, if it is brought to Bombay via Hong Kong, then we can send it to Los Angeles by ship.

Prabhupada: That's all right.

Sumati Morarjee: By ship we can send it.

Prabhupada: Your ship does not go to Hong Kong?

Sumati Morarjee: Sometimes it goes.

Prabhupada: Oh.

Sumati Morarjee: So, at that time it is handed over to Hong Kong ship. It will be delivered in Bombay. Then we reship it to Hong Kong..., to Los Angeles.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Bhagavan: Is that on a regular basis, that it goes to Hong Kong?

Sumati Morarjee: Yes, mostly. I'll let you know, because that service is also Bombay. These people, they don't know. So you can write one letter for this car, and another letter for this, so they're not intermixed.

Prabhupada: Yes, all right. Scindia Steam Navigation meant for carrying Krsna conscious... [laughter]

Sumati Morarjee: Everytime we carry.

Prabhupada: That was written in the beginning.

Sumati Morarjee: Ah. [laughter]

Prabhupada: I think it was done by..., at your expense.

Sumati Morarjee: Yes, yes.

Prabhupada: That small pamphlet.

Sumati Morarjee: Yes, yes.

Prabhupada: Scindia Steam Navigation Company carries Krsna consciousness movement to Western countries.

Sumati Morarjee: Yes, I know.

Prabhupada: Yes. She's a great devotee of Krsna. In her office there is Krsna.

Sumati Morarjee: Everywhere.

Prabhupada: These Gujaratis are especially, worship of Lord Krsna, and they belong to Bhatiya community. They're all Vaisnava. The whole, I have to say, Visnu-Svami-sampradaya, or Vallabha-Acarya-sampradaya.

Sumati Morarjee: Yes, Vallabhacarya.

Prabhupada: Their guru.

Sumati Morarjee: Vallabhacarya is our guru.

Prabhupada: So, they, they're originally all Vaisnava family. All Vaisnava family. Bala-Krsna. They are worship of Bala-Krsna. Yes.

Syamasundara: I have that Gujarati Back to Godhead.

Prabhupada: Yes. Now we're printing the Gujarati Back to Godhead.

Sumati Morarjee: What? Let me, what is it?

Prabhupada: We have got some... Giving, give her that.

Sumati Morarjee: This is from where you get?

Prabhupada: Yes, we get from Hong Kong.

Sumati Morarjee: Hong Kong. Why, is it good?

Prabhupada: No, it is not good. It is raw. That we re-scent it...

Sumati Morarjee: How?

Prabhupada: ...different, in different way.

Bhagavan: They dip it into oils.

Prabhupada: Scented oil. That's...

Sumati Morarjee: Ah, and then it becomes...

Dhananjaya: They're known as firelighters, because sometimes they use them for lighting fireworks.

Sumati Morarjee: I know. Oh, I know now. I understand. So you can present, tell me. Yes, this is Dvarakadhisa.

Prabhupada: Yes. Dvarakadhisa [Transl. is yours.]

Sumati Morarjee: So you, you have started?

Prabhupada: Yes, we have started.

Syamasundara: It's printed in Bombay.

Sumati Morarjee: Where?

Syamasundara: In Bombay.

Prabhupada: Recently.

Syamasundara: This is the first one.

Sumati Morarjee: Oh, because I have not seen it.

Syamasundara: This is the first issue.

Prabhupada: This is the first issue. They have sent one copy. [knock on door] Yes?

Sumati Morarjee: So, Swamiji, can I take this?

Prabhupada: Oh, yes, you can take.

Sumati Morarjee: So you must give me, ah, blessings.

Prabhupada: Ah, yes, here. [laughter]

Sumati Morarjee: And this also, so I will always remember that I've been in London to meet Swamiji, my..., Swamiji's darsana.

Dhananjaya: And you're also president now, board of trustees.

Prabhupada: You, president, you give her this garland.

Sumati Morarjee: Me?

Prabhupada: Yes.

Sumati Morarjee: But did you put it 'round Swamiji's head?

Prabhupada: Yes, yes.

Sumati Morarjee: Then I can take prasada garland of Swamiji.

Dhananjaya: Hare Krsna.

Bhagavan: Jaya. Haribol.

Prabhupada: You consider Sumati Morarjee as the mother of the Institution. [laughter] .

Dhananjaya: And you're our father. [laughter]

Sumati Morarjee: Yes, that's true.

Prabhupada: Hare Krsna.

Sumati Morarjee: Because, you see, today, then Swamiji was in so much trouble, I still remember. He wrote to me some letter from America, that "I am sitting in the Central Park, all alone." [laughter]

Syamasundara: Daddy can't be alone. You've got so many students, you have no time to be alone.

Prabhupada: I was going to your agent's office, Battery...

Sumati Morarjee: Ah, Battery Place.

Prabhupada: Seventeen Battery Place.

Sumati Morarjee: Yeah, 17 Battery Place.

Prabhupada: So I was asking him, "Find out when Scindia Navigation is going back.'' He said such and such date. "All right." Then I thought, "Let me stay another month, what I can do." Then again I was going...

Sumati Morarjee: To find out.

Prabhupada: Find out. [laughter]

Sumati Morarjee: Because you know...

Prabhupada: ...so he said, "Swamiji, you are coming to find out, but you are not going back. What is?'' [laughter]

Sumati Morarjee: Because you know, there was one old man, now he has retired, who used to look after all service in that office. So he wrote to me that "This Swamiji wants to come. What to do?'' I said, "Yes, whenever he wants to come."

Prabhupada: No, I got return ticket.

Sumati Morarjee: "Yes, so you send him back, if he wants to come. But see that a good captain is on the ship." Then, uh, then once he came to Bombay, said "Swami doesn't come." I said, "Now he won't come.'' [Prabhupada laughs] And also give me, Swamiji, that Gujarati... So I'll preserve all this.

Prabhupada: Huh? Yes, yes.

Dhananjaya: Remember you were asking me just a few days ago about Srimad-Bhagavatam?

Sumati Morarjee: Yes, I was. I heard Swamiji, you know, came to my house to read. Rasa-panca-adhyaya.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Sumati Morarjee: From Bhagavata. That is supposed to be the...

Prabhupada: Now, when I shall go to Juhu, I shall regularly begin all Bhagavata.

Sumati Morarjee: I want to hear, Swami.

Prabhupada: Yes, all Bhagavata.

Sumati Morarjee: And you know, rasa-panca-adhyaya is really the panca-prana of Bhagavata; otherwise it is all right. There is nothing important. That is the real soul of the Bhagavata, this rasa-panca-adhyaya. [five chapters of Srimad-Bhagavatam containing Krsna's rasa-lila pastimes]

Prabhupada: [to devotee] You have got duplicate copies of this?

Sumati Morarjee: Have you got? Otherwise don't give me.

Bhagavan: Yes, I have some copies I brought.

Prabhupada: All right, then that's all right.

Sumati Morarjee: He has come from where?

Bhagavan: Myself? I just came from Detroit.

Sumati Morarjee: Detroit. And this Swamiji from where?

Revatinandana: I'm staying here, in London.

Sumati Morarjee: No, but you come from where?

Prabhupada: He's from America.

Revatinandana: From California.

Sumati Morarjee: All from California?

Syamasundara: He travels around England and preaches in all the villages, small towns.

Sumati Morarjee: Where's that?

Syamasundara: Here, in England, Scotland.

Revatinandana: I also met you in Bombay once.

Sumati Morarjee: Yes, yes, I have seen you in Bombay. And what about you?

Dhananjaya: I'm Scottish.

Sumati Morarjee: Ah, because you look...

Prabhupada: In Edinburgh we have got a temple.

Sumati Morarjee: Is it?

Dhananjaya: Yes.

Prabhupada: Nice temple

Sumati Morarjee: This Swamiji's from there.

Syamasundara: This boy is son of a Muslim family, Pakistani family.

Sumati Morarjee: Oh, so you have come from Pakistan.

Jaya Hari: Yes.

Sumati Morarjee: Which side?

Jaya Hari: Lahore, West Pakistan.

Sumati Morarjee: I have been to Lahore. We had a very big office in Karachi. I've been to Karachi so many time. Next to, you know, the [indistinct], the office area.

Prabhupada: Now, what is the position of Pakistan now?

Sumati Morarjee: Today that Bhutto is come and gone.

Prabhupada: Ah.

Sumati Morarjee: You know he has left for today for Pakistan back. He came to see the Prime Minister.

Prabhupada: Here?

Sumati Morarjee: No, our Prime Minister.

Prabhupada: Oh, our Prime Minister.

Sumati Morarjee: And they were both met in Simla for four days, five days, and then they discussed various thing, and now they have come to an understanding that everything must be mutually done, and with the good faith, and they have to be...

Prabhupada: So, what is the use of keeping Pakistan? Let it, let, let, let them have another.

Sumati Morarjee: I know, I know. But what about this Bangladesh also? You'll have to...

Prabhupada: Huh?

Sumati Morarjee: ...do something. Because I met so many people from Bangladesh, they have completely forgotten our culture.

Prabhupada: Ah.

Syamasundara: That's..., we're going there next month, Tamala Krsna. I think you remember him.

Sumati Morarjee: Yes, yes, very well.

Syamasundara: He's got his visa now. He's taking a party there, to Bangladesh.

Sumati Morarjee: Very good, but I hope they put..., don't put you somewhere. That's not a very...

Prabhupada: Ah, reliable, I say. You have your office in Dacca?

Sumati Morarjee: Huh?

Prabhupada: Dacca? No?

Sumati Morarjee: Yes, yes, our office used to be. We had property. We have lost about twenty-six lakhs of rupees with both sides of Pakistan.

Prabhupada: Oh, you had to close your office?

Sumati Morarjee: We had our own bungalow, our own house in Chittagong, then our offices, then lighter, and our manager he was interned, and beaten and all sorts of things. In Karachi also.

Prabhupada: Ah.

Sumati Morarjee: We had big property in Karachi.

Prabhupada: So, so they cannot return?

Sumati Morarjee: They're not returning anything. With great difficulty. I put up a fight with the British to get back my ship with that interned one passenger.

Prabhupada: Yes, that ship I saw when I was going.

Sumati Morarjee: Yes.

Prabhupada: We met on the way.

Sumati Morarjee: Ah.

Prabhupada: And that ship was returned.

Sumati Morarjee: That was returned. So that I put pressure on the British here. That's how we got back the ships. Otherwise we would have lost those two ships.

Prabhupada: They're very uncultured.

Sumati Morarjee: Very, very uncultured. And he came to see the Prime Minister, he brought all his sons, all his daughters, whole family he brought, to our Bhutto. Because Bhutto, he is from Junagadh. I know him.

Prabhupada: Ah, he is a Gujarati?

Sumati Morarjee: Yes, yes, he is Gujarati Muhammadan. He is from Junagadh. His father...

Prabhupada: Jinnah was also.

Sumati Morarjee: Yes, yes, Jinnah was from Kachcha, [a district in Gujarat] Bombay, but this Bhutto 'till he went away, he was in Junagadh. His father, son was Deewan: a powerful government officer of Junagadh.

Prabhupada: Just see.

Sumati Morarjee: He was brought up in Junagadh. He was in Bombay all these... He's educated in Bombay.

Syamasundara: Juna, Juhu?

Sumati Morarjee: No, no. Junagadh.

Prabhupada: No, no, Junagadh is a city.

Sumati Morarjee: You know, in Saurashtra.

Prabhupada: Saurashtra.

Syamasundara: Oh, yes.

Sumati Morarjee: There, he was born, bred, educated. He is from Bombay and Junagadh, Saurashtra. Like Jinnah. Jinnah, last time before Pakistan, came to my house, we were old friends, so he came to my house, so I...

Prabhupada: Jinnah was older than you?

Sumati Morarjee: Oh?

Prabhupada: Oh, yes, he was of Gandhi's age.

Sumati Morarjee: I know. And he was a Congress member before.

Prabhupada: Yes, yes.

Sumati Morarjee: Home Rule and all that. He was the man. So I knew him since many years. So he came to see me, and I talked to him. At that time, you know, his position had become very bad. So he said that... I started talking to him English, he said, "Why do you talk to me in English? You talk to me in Kachi. We have common language."

I said, "I thought you forgotten." He said "How can I forget my mother tongue?" [Prabhupada laughs]. And after that, you know, he..., this movement of Pakistan, and India became very strong and he went away.

Prabhupada: He was..., he was paid for that running on the League of...

Sumati Morarjee: Ah, I know.

Prabhupada: Was the Muslim League.

Sumati Morarjee: I know.

Prabhupada: This all Englishmen subscribes.

Sumati Morarjee: Because you know is the policy "Divide and rule."

Prabhupada: Yes, that was it. Jinnah was made.

Sumati Morarjee: Otherwise, nobody will do anything. So, I won't take your time Swamiji.

Prabhupada: No, you can sit down.

Sumati Morarjee: Because you are tired, whole day…. I'm going to preserve this mala.

Prabhupada: Thank you.

Sumati Morarjee: I put it, give it to my daughter. She is very fond of roses.

Prabhupada: Oh, yes.

Sumati Morarjee: Oh, yes, she's crazy...

Prabhupada: How old she is now?

Sumati Morarjee: She's ten. Today I'll..., starting today in the afternoon, I remembered so much that I wish Swamiji was here, she gave a Manipuri dance recital in our office and became Radha.

Prabhupada: Oh, that's nice.

Sumati Morarjee: You know, asta nayika.

Prabhupada: Accha.

Sumati Morarjee: So the eighth nayika she became.

Prabhupada: Oh.

Sumati Morarjee: Radha getting angry with Krsna.

Prabhupada: So there are other girls also.

Sumati Morarjee: Hmm?

Prabhupada: Other girls?

Sumati Morarjee: No, she was alone, but the offices, we wanted to see. So I said "All right." We had tape, so she danced on that, and the other one is Makhan-chori.

Prabhupada: Accha.

Sumati Morarjee: Two things she did. So I remembered so much.

Prabhupada: Just see how this girl is being trained. So similarly, you are teaching our students, small children... We have opened a school at Dallas, to..., because these boys and girls, they're having children, they're being trained up. We are creating a new generation of Krsna consciousness.

Sumati Morarjee: I tell you, we have got a very good Manipuri teacher.

Prabhupada: Ah.

Sumati Morarjee: Last year I was in Manipura, I took this girl with me, my little girl, and I stayed there eight days, went to Govindadeva's temple and all these places.

Prabhupada: I, we cannot pay; we have no money.

Sumati Morarjee: No, no, no. If these girls come to my school, I will teach them this dance.

Prabhupada: Where is your school?

Sumati Morarjee: Oh, just opposite to you, my house.

Devotee: Next to the temple, Juhu.

Prabhupada: Oh, oh.

Sumati Morarjee: These small girls, whatever you have got, they can come twice or four or four times, three times a week. This Manipuri girl comes.

Prabhupada: No, we are opening here in America one school for training small children to Krsna consciousness.

Sumati Morarjee: Yes, so I told, Swamiji, this Giriraja to come to our school, and tell them all mythological stories, and tell them..., make them know some bhajana and all that. I hope he has started.

Syamasundara: Yes.

Sumati Morarjee: [aside:] [Transl. You come forward.]

Prabhupada: What is your name?

Sumati Morarjee: His name is Mr. Girish Joshi. He is from Dakor.

Prabhupada: Oh, I see.

Sumati Morarjee: Dakorji's temple. [In Gujarat]

Prabhupada: Now, in future, in Joshi family, Lord Krsna will appear as Kalki.

Sumati Morarjee: Oh, so here is Joshi.

Prabhupada: Yes, it is named there in the Bhagavata, Visnu Joshi. The father's name of Kalki is Visnu Joshi, and He will appear in Sambhala. Sambhala.

Sumati Morarjee: Ah, I know that. They have built a temple.

Prabhupada: Hah?

Sumati Morarjee: In..., near Puri, there is a place, I forget the name, and in that they're building a temple.

Prabhupada: Oh.

Sumati Morarjee: When Kalki avatara... They've built a very big..., huge, big temple. When Kalki... Without any image. When Kalki avatara takes place, Jagannathaji will come there, from the Puri temple, and They will be worshiped...

Prabhupada: But that is after four lakhs of years.

Sumati Morarjee: Ah, I don't know that. They are building a temple. [laughter] I, this time, I asked, I said, "Who's building all these temples?" They said, "It is for Jagannathaji." I said, "Jagannathaji has got." They said, "No, when the Kalki avatara takes place." There is a Sambhala town somewhere near, small village, and...

Prabhupada: So you'll not remain here up to Ratha-yatra.

Sumati Morarjee: No, I have my Thakurji's Ratha-yatra.

Prabhupada: Oh, I see.

Sumati Morarjee: At home.

Prabhupada: I see.

Sumati Morarjee: So I today only wrote a very big letter what to do, how to do. I'll go there.

Prabhupada: At Juhu?

Sumati Morarjee: Yes, my house.

Prabhupada: I see.

Sumati Morarjee: So our Ratha-yatra. My Thakurji must be waiting.

Prabhupada: It is taken outside? No.

Sumati Morarjee: No, inside. In the house.

Prabhupada: Within the compound. That's right.

Sumati Morarjee: Here I have seen Ratha-yatra, the first time in..., when these people came here. I had no idea. That day I arrived. [laughter] So I said, "What is all this?" There were so many people and all 'Hari bol' and all that. "What is happening?" So then I saw Ratha, I said, "This is Ratha-yatra," near this place.

Devotees: Marble Arch?

Sumati Morarjee: No, no, no. I was passing Marble Arch, Hyde Park Corner. I saw all the people. I said, "What..." Then I found out. I thought...

Prabhupada: In San Francisco we hold, very gorgeous.

Sumati Morarjee: Ah.

Prabhupada: Three rathas.

Sumati Morarjee: I have seen those pictures.

Prabhupada: Three rathas, and thousands of... Oh, they're very much, I mean to say, enthused to take prasadam and dance. So this year they asked me to come here. Therefore I have come to see the Ratha-yatra, how they...

Sumati Morarjee: But, ah, you will be here in October?

Prabhupada: Ah, maybe.

Sumati Morarjee: Ah, if you are here, you, you must write to me about Swamiji's program.

Syamasundara: Oh, yes.

Sumati Morarjee: So if you are here, I'll be here by 6th, 7th of October, because 10th is my meeting.

Prabhupada: That's all right.

Sumati Morarjee: In London. So I will take your leave, Swamiji.

Prabhupada: Jaya. Jaya. Sumatiji ki jaya. All glories to Sumatiji. [laughter]

Sumati Morarjee: All glories to Lord Krsna.

Prabhupada: Hare Krsna.

Sumati Morarjee: [aside:] Kindly pick up…]

Indian: [Transl. Yes, don't worry.]

So you write to me about this Hong Kong.

Syamasundara: Yes.

Prabhupada: And for you becoming the president of the Trustee, I shall write to Giriraja.

Sumati Morarjee: Yes, you write to Giriraja, and we will discuss ourselves.

Prabhupada: Thank you.

Sumati Morarjee: So much.

Prabhupada: Yes, take it. She can take whole...

Sumati Morarjee: I'll take and then...

Prabhupada: She'll return the pot.

Sumati Morarjee: And I'll send these bowls everything. [indistinct] [laughter]

Prabhupada: Jaya! Go with. Go with. Take this. Take this. Help her. No, no, he will help you.

[Sumati Morarjee leaves] Oh. How are you? Hare Krsna.

Revatinandana: Do you know how old she is, Srila Prabhupada?

Prabhupada: Maybe over sixty.

Revatinandana: She's very much alive. So much alive.

Prabhupada: Her father was one the richest men in Bombay, and her husband..., her father-in-law also one of the richest men. There're coming from very rich family in Bombay. And she's so intelligent.

That Scindia Steam Navigation Company, very big company. It is a semi-government, and she's the managing director. All the big, big officers respecting as mother, carries out her order. And she's great devotee of Krsna, but she does not take live with her husband. [laughter] Hmm? The husband and wife, not very agreement. Yes.

Revatinandana: Her husband is alive?

Prabhupada: Yes. They live separate building. They meet, but they live separate building, separate establishment. She looks one department of business, and he looks another department. That child, adopted. She has no own child.

Revatinandana: Oh.

Bhagavan: So perhaps she'll ship the punks, and the vehicle.

Prabhupada: And the car also. And I've asked her to become the president of the trustee for construction of Bombay. She has agreed.

Revatinandana: What will the business of the trustees be?

Prabhupada: Hah?

Revatinandana: What will their business be as trustees?

Prabhupada: To raise fund.

Revatinandana: Hmm?

Prabhupada: Raise fund. That's all. We approach these person for raising fund, that's all. Not for taking any lesson from them. Now, to have a temple here, we shall hold a meeting on the Indian gentlemen to raise the fund. You find out some place, immediately, so that while I am remaining, by performing Bhagavata-saptaha, I'm influencing the Indian rich men here; they can purchase. She will also contribute for October. July, August, September, October. So the negotiation will go on for at least three month; in the meantime, she will come. She will also contribute. I have already given her hint and she agrees. So let us find out some nice place.

Bhagavan: You won't be here that long, Srila Prabhupada. You're going to be leaving on the 20th, and...

Prabhupada: No, I may come back.

Bhagavan: You may come back?

Prabhupada: Yes, finish the business.

Bhagavan: Would you like myself or Hamsadūta to stay here and help with this building?

Prabhupada: Yes, all together.

Bhagavan: I was thinking of going to Paris, but I'll stay for a while and help here.

Prabhupada: Paris is not far off. You can go and come.

Bhagavan: Go and come. It's too crowded here.

Prabhupada: Yes. That is good.

Bhagavan: Yeah! [laughter]

Prabhupada: Instead of becoming empty, it is better crowded. Our building, in the morning it was..., there was no place to bow down. It was just matchbox packed up.

Revatinandana: Yeah, that's right.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Revatinandana: That is because all the devotees are here from all the temples. But still...

Prabhupada: Could not sit even. That is good. And it is always like that?

Devotee: No.

Revatinandana: Well, like I say, all the devotees are here from all the temples in England, so Edinburgh and Manchester, they're all here too. But always it is crowded, and, uh, on Sundays it's no good at all, because so many people come, they can't even come in to see the Deities, you know. They can't fit all in the temple.

And, uh, and we don't advertise the Sunday feast. If we advertise the Sunday feast, we couldn't get them in the whole building. So we can't even advertise. So therefore they don't even mention it, people still come, and we can't fit them all in the building. And we're hoping that it would get so full that Krsna will see and He'll give us a place quickly.

Prabhupada: Give her some position. And she's very influential, rich. But everyone wants some post. That is natural. Therefore I told..., offered her the presidency of Bombay Trust, to raise the fund. In Bombay we have got very nice place. The best place of anywhere. And it is so nice in summertime, you'll find in paradise. So many coconut trees. You have seen?

Devotee: No.

Prabhupada: And we are... Nara-narayana has been engaged to make it a nice garden. All vacant land, we are getting nice garden, and the owner of the land, he has given me the best facility. First of all, the land is worth minimum thirty hundred thousands rupees.

Revatinandana: Thirty lakhs?

Prabhupada: Thirty lakhs. But he has given me for fourteen lakhs. And that's also by instrument, in three years, er, four years, without any interest...

Devotee: Who is that man?

Prabhupada: Mr. Nair. Mrs. Nair. She is..., she is also very nice devotee. So every year four lakhs of rupees, in three years, er, four years, fourteen lakhs, without any interest. So we have got good facility. And in Vrndavana, some gentleman has given us the land.

Revatinandana: Is the land in Vrndavana, is it in the city? Is it on the outside of Vrndavana, or is it right in the city?

Prabhupada: No, it is just in front of Bon Maharaja's college.

Syamasundara: It's in Raman Reti.

Prabhupada: [laughter] The best place in Vrndavana. All aristocratic quality. And we have got potency. There are so many buildings, they are not being properly utilized. If we want to, you can purchase the whole area.

Revatinandana: How is the Gauḍiya...

Prabhupada: Now you have got enough place in Vrndavana, in Navadvipa, in Bombay. There will be no difficulty if you go by thousands to India. You can live very comfortable. So you can go, purchase by go; you can go and come back. So that foreigners, they visit, and gradually there will be unity between the so-called Hindu, Muslim-all Krsna's servant. This is the idea behind Krsna consciousness. We don't believe in this skin disease. [end]