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770224ed.may
Prabhupada: No light?
Prabhupada: No, in daytime there is no need.
Prabhupada: Oh! Thank you very much. First Canto.
Ramesvara: This completes the new style for the First Canto.
Prabhupada: What is that new style?
Ramesvara: Well, the cover art has changed a little so you can read the titles, and it fits in the series. And also the captions are on one side; the pictures are on the other side.
Prabhupada: Part One. That is this...
Prabhupada: Same.
Prabhupada: So new pictures added.
Ramesvara: Only in 1.2 and 1.3 we added some new pictures. But in 1.1 there were so many pictures.
Ramesvara: And now each book also has its own index in the back. That was also a reason for reprinting the First Canto.
Prabhupada: This is?
Prabhupada: Kuruksetra.
Prabhupada: Oh.
Ramesvara: This is the new artwork for 2.2 on the cover. Same idea. Each book now has captions on one side, pictures on the other; the standard new typeface.
Prabhupada: Second Canto, Part Two.
Prabhupada: This is San Francisco?
Prabhupada: Los Angeles. Hm.
Ramesvara: We printed fifty thousand copies of the 1.1 and twenty thousand copies of the 2.2.
Prabhupada: This is selling more?
Ramesvara: First Canto we want to sell more because...
Prabhupada: It introduces.
Ramesvara: Yes.
Ramesvara: That's the new book.
Prabhupada: Oh.
Prabhupada: How many copies?
Ramesvara: Twenty thousand.
Prabhupada: Twenty, minimum.
Prabhupada: What is that?
Prabhupada:
sa vai manah krsna-padaravindayor
vacamsi vaikuntha-gunanuvarnane karau harer mandira-marjanadisu srutim cakaracyuta-sat-kathodaye [SB 9.4.18] Very good. So everything is there. So let me take prasadam. Then we can talk some more.
Prabhupada: Thank you very much.
Jayatirtha: One more thing. This is the first British BTG.
Prabhupada: Oh, very nice. I did not see this picture?
Prabhupada: It is an American printing?
Jayatirtha: This is British.
Prabhupada: This is British.
Ramesvara: They printed it in England. How many copies?
Jayatirtha: One hundred thousand copies.
Prabhupada: Oh. Competition. (laughter)
Ramesvara: He's trying.
Prabhupada: (laughs) Yes. This transcendental competition must go on. Thank you.
Prabhupada: Yes, yes. Yajnad bhavati parjanyah [Bg. 3.14]. (sound of thunder and rain) This time rainfall is very beneficial for crops. This is the way of living. You perform yajna, there will be rain. And as soon as the ground is moist, you can produce anything, whatever you want. Sarva-kama-dugha mahi. From the field, you can get all your necessities of life. The first necessity is the food grain. So food grain you can eat, and the rejected grass portion, you give to the cows. So both the animal and the man get sufficient food. And the cows will give you nice milk, and from milk you can get butter, ghee, yogurt, so many nice sweetmeat. And there is ghee, and here is food grain, then you make kacuri, puri, samosa. Then sufficient foodstuff, nice, palatable, nutritious. First necessity is ahara. You get sufficient ahara. Then make little cottage for shelter. Just like there is rainfall. Now you require little... (thunder sounds) Ahara, nidra, bhaya, and sex. So marry. Then the whole problem is solved. And then, rest time you save and advance in Krsna conscious... This is civilization. Why you create unnecessary necessities of life and become complicated and forget Krsna? What is this civilization? Rascal civilization. Instead of giving protection to the cows, you are cutting the throat. Is that civilization? So this is a civilization of duskrtina, means mischief monger. Therefore they must suffer, and suffering. And asuras are being created. And Krsna's business is to kill the asuras. Paritranaya sadhunam vinasaya ca duskrtam [Bg. 4.8]. This is going on. This is material nature. Asuras are being created, and the whole plan is to kill them. So struggle for existence. The asuras, they want to live. Mahisasura he's struggling with the weapons of Maya, Durga. He'll be failure, but still-ahankara-vimudhatma kartaham [Bg. 3.27]by false egotism he's thinking, "I shall conquer over the material..." That is scientist, so-called scientist. Asuras are... They are planning that "We shall do without nature's control." That is mudha. Daivi hy esa gunamayi mama maya dura... [Bg. 7.14]. They cannot conquer it. That is not possible. But you are struggling. You do not want the control of nature. And nature is so strong... Now it is raining. Within one hour they can vanquish the whole world. Doesn't take time. If there is one cyclone and heavy rain, then you are put into danger. So long it is mild, it is all right. And as soon as becomes ferocious, then finish you. What you'll control the nature? When there is no rain, you cannot bring in rain; and when there is heavy rain, you cannot stop it. Then where is your control? You rascal, you think like that, "We shall control over nature." This is your rascaldom. You cannot control over. So everything has its use, and how to use it properly, that is all described in the Bhagavad-gita. And if you take instruction of Krsna and ultimately surrender to Him, that is success of life. Otherwise, struggle for existence, survival of the fittest... Nature is fittest. You'll die; nature will be... You are not fit to fight with the nature. That is asura temperament. And that will never be successful. So many asuras came. Formerly there was Hiranyakasipu, Ravana, Kamsa and others. In the recent years there was Hitler, there was Churchill, there was Lenin, and Gandhi and so on, so on. For few days. Then gone: "Get out. Bas. Finished." Big, big scientists, big, big asuras, big, big leaders, what they could do? Tribhir gunamayair bhavaih. Where is Bhagavad-gita? Read from the... Tribhir gunamayaih. Seventh Chapter.
Tripurari:
tribhir gunamayair bhavair
ebhih sarvam idam jagat mohitam nabhijanati mam ebhyah param avyayam [Bg. 7.13] "Deluded by the three modes (goodness, passion and ignorance), the whole world does not know Me, who am above the modes and inexhaustible."
Prabhupada: Hm. What is the purport?
Tripurari: Purport: The whole world is enchanted by three modes of material nature. Those who are bewildered by these three modes cannot understand that transcendental to this material nature is the Supreme Lord, Krsna. In this material world everyone is under the influence of these three gunas and is thus bewildered.
Bv nature living entities have particular types of body and particular types of psychic and biological activities accordingly. There are four classes of men functioning in the three material modes of nature. Those who are purely in the mode of goodness are called brahmanas. Those who are purely in the mode of passion are called ksatriyas. Those who are in the modes of both passion and ignorance are called vaisyas. Those who are completely in ignorance are called sudras. And those who are less than that are animals or animal life. However, these designations are not permanent. I may either be a brahmana, ksatriya, vaisya or whateverin any case, this life is temporary. But although life is temporary and we do not know what we are going to be in the next life, still, by the spell of this illusory energy, we consider ourselves in the light of this bodily conception of life, and we thus think that we are American, Indian, Russian or brahmana, Hindu, Muslim, etc. And if we become entangled with the modes of material nature, then we forget the Supreme Personality of Godhead who is behind all these modes. So Lord Krsna says that men, deluded by these three modes of nature, do not understand that behind the material background is the Supreme Godhead.
There are many different kinds of living entities-human beings, demigods, animals, etc.and each and every one of them is under the influence of material nature, and all of them have forgotten the transcendent Personality of Godhead. Those who are in the modes of passion and ignorance, and even those who are in the mode of goodness, cannot go beyond the impersonal Brahman conception of the Absolute Truth. They are bewildered before the Supreme Lord in His personal feature, which possesses all beauty, opulence, knowledge, strength, fame and renunciation. When even those who are in goodness cannot understand, what hope is there for those in passion and ignorance? Krsna consciousness is transcendental to all these three modes of material nature, and those who are truly established in Krsna consciousness are actually liberated.
Prabhupada: How many copies they are printing?
Brahmananda: One hundred thousand.
Prabhupada: One hundred thousand. This is the first?
Brahmananda: I think so.
Prabhupada: Volume One. Was there any difficulty for getting our present edition here?
Tamala Krsna: I think one of the points that Jayatirtha Prabhu was making is that some of the... He found that some of the editions were especially orientated to American reading public. For example, there was an edition about bicentennial celebration. So that celebrates the American...
Prabhupada: Independence.
Prabhupada: Yes.
Tamala Krsna: So that's actually a fact. There are a number of articles occasionally which are more American orientated. He felt that that was a strong point.
Hrdayananda: Also it's cheaper.
Hrdayananda: He's printing twenty-four pages only. So Britain House...
Prabhupada: No, it is very nicely done, very nice.
Hrdayananda: He's got a very low price.
Brahmananda: He doesn't have the Srimad-Bhagavatam included.
Prabhupada: That he should. That is not American or English. (laughter) Next issue, they can add. Where is Jayatirtha Prabhu? So your South America, there is some trouble?
Pancadravida: No. No trouble. Just in Argentina. The trouble is finished now. We're out.
Prabhupada: Trouble is finished?
Pancadravida: And we're out. (laughter)
Prabhupada: That is called mora mera gale.(?) To call a man by ill names, the last word is "You die."
Pancadravida: But it is not just us. The government threw out the Pentacostals, the jehovah's Witnesses, the Children of God, Guru Maharaj-ji's group, us. It's a very fascist government and very pro-Catholic. Now also we have heard that they have passed one law that nobody in the country is allowed to keep a beard. And the Jews, they all keep beards there because they're very orthodox Jews. Part of their religion, they don't cut the hair. So now no keeping beards, that's also even against the Jews. There are several million Jews. The government is very difficult to work with. When we went to the Ministry to ask them about this, they said they could not do nothing. The Ministry already, some people there were talking, "No, this government is very destructive. The next government will be more constructive. You try when the next government comes." So this is the way they talk down there. They change governments very often.
Brahmananda: There's also a lot of German influence there. When the Nazis left Nazi Germany they all went to Argentina.
Prabhupada: Oh.
Hrdayananda: Now every day they are killing so many people. It's become a very dangerous place. In the streets every day they are shooting so many people.
Pancadravida: Actually, though, we are learning something. We have to work with these kind of people more and more in different countries.
Prabhupada: Yes. So this is very fine, but there is no Bhagavata?
Jayatirtha: Srila Prabhupada, it's only being published quarterly...
Prabhupada: Oh.
Jayatirtha: ...and we thought to publish one section every three months, people would lose the track of the thing. That's why we... The British economy is so bad that we had to give fairly inexpensive literature. So it's either a question of printing sixteen pages color and eight page Bhagavata, or twenty-four pages color. We couldn't do twenty-four pages color and eight pages Bhagavata. We thought that since it is quarterly...
Prabhupada: That's all right. So you have printed one...
Jayatirtha: One hundred thousand.
Prabhupada: It is going on? Hm?
Jayatirtha: Nicely.
Prabhupada: So one hundred thousand you'll have to sell within three months.
Jayatirtha: That's correct, yes. We're also selling many medium books.
Prabhupada: Hm?
Jayatirtha: We're selling many Isopanisads, and now we're printing also Nectar of Instruction and Perfection of Yoga for distribution.
Prabhupada: Hm. You have already ordered for printing?
Jayatirtha: We've already printed Isopanisads, and just now they're preparing Nectar of Instruction and Perfection of Yoga for printing.
Prabhupada: In London there are very big, big press.
Jayatirtha: Yes. Quite good prices too, better than American prices. We're having our Swedish Bhagavad-gita also printed in England. It's going to the press while we're here in Mayapura.
Prabhupada: How is that vegetable market? There is wholesale vegetable market.
Jayatirtha: Not a very big one.(?)
Prabhupada: Near I saw there is very big press.
Jayatirtha: London's a fantastic city for spreading Krsna consciousness.
Prabhupada: Accha?
Jayatirtha: Very good.
Prabhupada: On whole, they like it?
Jayatirtha: Yes, especially our kirtana parties on Oxford Street and Picadilly Circus. They like that very much. Sometimes we get a thousand people standing around our kirtana party, Picadilly Circus and Leicester Square, places like that.
Prabhupada: So what about that house?
Jayatirtha: That house? We've purchased now and we're fixing it up.
Prabhupada: Hm?
Jayatirtha: We're fixing it up just now for using. We should be using it within about two months.
Prabhupada: What is the name of that place?
Jayatirtha: Soho Square.
Prabhupada: The same house which you showed me?
Jayatirtha: Yes.
Prabhupada: So you have taken money from my account? No.
Jayatirtha: No, Srila Prabhupada. We didn't need to.
Prabhupada: So there we shall have restaurant?
Jayatirtha: Yes. It should be very successful. Restaurants in that area... Vegetarian restaurants... There's one that sells about ten thousand pounds (sterling) a week of food. So ours may not be quite that big.
Prabhupada: So we have already started restaurant? No.
Jayatirtha: Not yet. It takes some time. We just got permission finally from the planning commission from the city. That was a technicality. But we just got that. There was no problem. Now we're starting to do the refurbishing. We have to do a lot of painting and...
Prabhupada: So we shall move from Bury Place there? No.
Jayatirtha: No. We want to build a very nice temple and cultural center in London. The Indian community is very anxious for that actually. They're spread out, the Indians, in Wembley and South Hall and different areas. And they have a few very lousy local temples. But they know that we're the only ones who can build a very nice place, so they're interested in helping us build a very big place as close to the center of London as possible.
Prabhupada: So you have got any place? No.
Jayatirtha: Right now we're looking for land, and I brought this Ranachora... Where's Ranachora? Anyway, Ranachora, he's architect and artist. He's going to work, hopefully, with Saurabha. Saurabha is anxious also for helping do some preliminary drawings.
Prabhupada: No, unless you get land, how you can do?
Jayatirtha: Well, we thought some things, have some drawings we'd showing...
Prabhupada: But so far I know, it is very difficult to get vacant land.
Jayatirtha: Yes. Depends on how close to the center you are. We'll probably have to get a piece of property that has an old warehouse or something on it and demolish it. There's no... Nothing is vacant, but a lot of the buildings are so old that no one wants to use them.
Prabhupada: Yes. That you can get. There are many old houses. I do not remember what is that neighborhood. That is forlorn practically.
Jayatirtha: Hm. There are many places like that. So we have to find a place like that, about three quarters of an acre, half an acre to three quarters of an acre, and build a building, taller building, with the temple and auditorium and museum and hotel rooms.
Prabhupada: Like New York. Like New York?
Jayatirtha: Not quite as big as New York. (laughs)
Prabhupada: That house is very good, our New York temple.
Jayatirtha: We need about half that size, but bigger, nicer temple and meeting hall. We can rent out for weddings. People are paying five hundred pounds a day for renting just one room, a big room, and they can't get sufficient rooms in London. So they told us that they could book for two years in advance at five hundred pounds a day every weekend, Saturday, Sunday, for a wedding hall. If we can arrange to do the wedding for them, then they'll pay us an additional couple hundred pounds. There's a lot of..., so many Indians there.
Prabhupada: Yes, there are Indians there.
Jayatirtha: Lot of scope. They're coming to like our movement very much there now also, respecting. There's no more complaint. Before, there were some complaints.
Pancadravida: This last Sunday in New York for Siva-ratri there were so many Indians there. There were thousands of Indians in that temple. It was very exciting just to see so many people come in.
Prabhupada: This is a good chance of United Nation-Indian, Americans, Englishmen, German, all mixed together.
Jayatirtha: Our Amsterdam temple has about sixty devotees, and they're from seventeen different countries, seventeen different nationalities are represented in the temple. There's nowhere else where so many different nationalities are living together.
Prabhupada: No. This is the nucleus of United Nations, real. Isavasyam idam sarvam [Iso mantra 1], to understand everything belongs to Krsna. That is the basic principle of United Nation. Brahma-bhutah prasannatma [Bg. 18.54], samah sarvesu bhutesu. In that stage there can be equality. Otherwise not.
Pancadravida: Srila Prabhupada, the text on the back of this magazine here, the back advertisement for the Gita...
Prabhupada: Here?
Pancadravida: ...is very nice wording. It's referring to India.
Prabhupada: This. Oh, yes. This is the fact.
Brahmananda: Headline. "This book is sacred to 650,000,000."
Prabhupada: "650,000,000" means?
Brahmananda: Indians.
Jayatirtha: According to the books, that's the number of Hindus in the world. I wrote that text. That impresses people.
Pancadravida: Because they are saying this is not religion, and we're saying, "How you can say it's not religion when already 650,000,000 people are following it?"
Prabhupada: The practical example is there. In everywhere they are coming to the temple. So in England there is opposition.
Jayatirtha: Not really. There's none of this deprogramming or any trouble like that. People are pretty peaceful. We have a pretty good reputation. The government doesn't oppose us.
Jayatirtha: Our Ratha-yatra, yes. I don't think they'll ever stop opposing. This year when I went to the Ratha-yatra, when we had the Ratha-yatra, I saw that their feeling is so strong about it I don't think they'll ever let us have a good cart on that route. I wish they would, but I don't think they will. They told us that they only way they'll let us have a big car is if we change the route. So actually that's one thing I wanted to discuss with you while I was here, whether... If we had the Ratha-yatra in the Indian district, like Wembley...
Prabhupada: No.
Jayatirtha: Then we could have a big cart.
Prabhupada: No.
Jayatirtha: Otherwise not.
Prabhupada: That is not...
Prabhupada: Huh?
Jayatirtha: With a small cart there's nothing so exciting about the Ratha-yatra that people will come for miles, at least English people. They won't come just to see this small cart. In San Francisco these three huge carts makes it so exciting and colorful that people come just to see the carts.
Prabhupada: They will not allow.
Jayatirtha: No. I don't think so. It's a safety thing, they say. The street is such... And they won't stop the traffic, so the traffic is still going on.
Brahmananda: Has there been any accident on the previous ones?
Jayatirtha: Well, that argument won't work on the British bureaucracy. There hasn't been any accident in the past, nor in the future there will be any accident. They... Simply they don't want a big cart.
Prabhupada: But Wembley quarter is not good.
Jayatirtha: No, that quarter is not so good. There may be other quarters where they'd do it, but...
Jayatirtha: Hm. Actually we were thinking to have... If we kept a small cart and had Ratha-yatras, one in London, one in around Birmingham area, there's a lot of Hindus in that area that will come. One in the north around...
Prabhupada: Yes.
Jayatirtha: ...Liverpool-Manchester area.
Prabhupada: Yes. That will be nice. Take the Ratha-yatra alongwe have this bus programdo publicity with the bus program, and then, at the end of the month, have a Ratha-yatra somewhere in the city. I think if we keep the small cart, do at least three Ratha-yatras this summer... Our big car is there?
Jayatirtha: It's still standing.
Prabhupada: So that we can move? No, that will not be possible.
Jayatirtha: No.
Jayatirtha: It may be. We have to investigate.
Hrdayananda: There's no place in London where you can do big carts?
Jayatirtha: It depends. In the Hindu quarters I don't think they could stop us. But in other quarters they would.
Prabhupada: The Watsford area there are many Hindus.
Jayatirtha: Few in Watsford. Mostly down by Wembley, which is not very far from Watsford. It's only three stops on the tube. I think they may let us do a big cart there. And in other cities they may also. We just came to this idea recently to do them in other cities, because especially in the Mid... It's called the Midlands. There is Leicester and Coventry and many cities with many Hindus there. And those people up in those cities, sometimes they're more pious than the London Hindus. They're very... One of our life membership makers in the north made twenty-four members in two weeks.
Prabhupada: Hm?
Jayatirtha: In the north they're very active there, and they're very anxious for some interest by us for them. Anyway, at least we could have three smaller Ratha-yatras this year in different places.
Prabhupada: Simply by Ratha-yatra, you can attract many people. So still we are going to that Trafalgar Square?
Jayatirtha: Yes. It's hard, though.
Prabhupada: The crowd is the same? No. Diminished.
Jayatirtha: Well, the crowd that's in Trafalgar Square is mostly there already. That's the thing, because there's always people in Trafalgar Square. So when the Ratha-yatra comes they stay and they make benefit by ajnata-sukrti. But the number of people that are out in the parade is not very great. I've been thinking how it can be increased, because they keep us in one small lane about as wide as this room along this road, and they make you have this small cart, and the people are spread out for so long. A lot of Hindus come, but sometimes they are so far away from the cart it's hard to keep the kirtana very nice, so they can't see the Deities. And after being in San Francisco for so many years at the Ratha-yatra, I didn't feel so enthusiastic. That San Francisco festival is so elevated, so wonderful. Therefore I was thinking that if we could move it...
Hrdayananda: (indistinct)
Jayatirtha: Not in the same way.
Pancadravida: Do we use like a marching band in the Ratha-yatra? If we used a marching band, a lot of people come, like a parade, like they use in the parades with trumpets and drums and all these things.
Prabhupada: I think you can introduce in Africa also. (laughter)
Brahmananda: We want to introduce in Mombassa. We've already been discussing it.
Prabhupada: This warfield painting is done very nicely.
Jayatirtha: I think so.
Prabhupada: Who has done it?
Jayatirtha: Pariksit.
Prabhupada: Oh. Actual.
Jayatirtha: People I've shown it to like it much better than this picture. It's more realistic. Has a very classical look.
Prabhupada: This is a protest against Gandhi's nonviolence, (laughter) bogus nonviolence. So it is a protest against that idea.
Jayatirtha: Yes, this is not a nonviolent picture.
Prabhupada: I do not know how he wanted to draw nonviolence from this idea. This is going on, distorting the real fact. Politics without violence is impossible. There is a Bengali proverb, Naste base gun tata:(?) "A girl has come to the stage for dancing, and she is pulling her veil." (laughs) She has to dance freely, and what is the use of...? Nasta base gun tata.(?) In politics nonviolence, there is no history. The Britishers took it an opportunity to continue their ruling.
Mahamsa: He wasn't even political man, because politics means there has to be violence.
Prabhupada: No, impartially studying, he endeavored for upliftment of the South African Indians, South Africans, yes, Johannesburg.
Brahmananda: In Durban he started.
Prabhupada: Ah, in Durban. That was failure. The Indians haven't got any position still.
Jayatirtha: None.
Prabhupada: None. So that twenty years, failure, and here also he started that nonviolence-thirty years. In 1917 he came here from Africa, and the nonviolent, noncooperation... Actually the Hitler's war in 1947 helped India to become independent, the Hitler's cooperation with Subash Bose, INA. When he organized the soldiers, then Britishers thought, "No more chance." Then they left India. Not for the nonviolence. These are artificial things, in politics nonviolence.
Mahamsa: You two were working together?
Prabhupada: Huh?
Mahamsa: Yourself and Gandhi were together for some time?
Prabhupada: In the beginning I was, 1920. No, everyone, every young man joined. (someone yelling in background) What is that? So arati you can join, yes.
Devotees: Jaya Srila Prabhupada. (end)
Link to this page: https://prabhupadabooks.com/conversations/1977/feb/evening_darsana/mayapura/february/24/1977 Previous: Room Conversation -- February 21, 1977, Mayapura Next: Arrival of Devotees -- February 24, 1977, Mayapura
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